Secularism?

[Glaumring the Fox]

I don't really want to force nobles out of my realm for not following a religion. They will just go where its more lax, if this was an entire Dwilight idea and enforced by every realm then  I would consider it.

[Bedwyr]

Problem is that because religions are island-limited, we have serious issues...I've run into several people who follow their family religion, which just happened to be founded on a different continent.  That's perfectly reasonable RP, yet makes them not in a religion on a particular continent.

[De-Legro]

I don't really want to force nobles out of my realm for not following a religion. They will just go where its more lax, if this was an entire Dwilight idea and enforced by every realm then  I would consider it.

That is the point, it SHOULD be a SMA issue, so all of Dwilight should be pushing it. But you don't need to belong to an actual religion, so far as I understand it you just can't claim to be atheist. I'm not exactly sure about enforcing non Secularism. Obviously there was no such thing during the middle ages, but the SMA pages are silent on the matter.

Problem is that because religions are island-limited, we have serious issues...I've run into several people who follow their family religion, which just happened to be founded on a different continent.  That's perfectly reasonable RP, yet makes them not in a religion on a particular continent.

Can't see a problem with this, they are simply following a religion with no established centres of faith on the continent.

[Gustav Kuriga]

I hate it when people say "there was no such thing during the middle ages" about things like this, with such arrogant assurance that they are right. It's making a broad assumption based on popular notions of what the middle ages were like.

[BardicNerd]

I hate it when people say "there was no such thing during the middle ages" about things like this, with such arrogant assurance that they are right. It's making a broad assumption based on popular notions of what the middle ages were like.

And sometimes, it's making a specific statement based upon research.


Now, this isn't something I've done extensive research on, so I'm not going to make any definitive claims, aside from the fact that 'secularism' did not exist as a word until well after the middle ages.  However, it is my impression from what little research I have done that:

A.  Some of the underlying thoughts and philosophy existed around the time of the middle ages, BUT
Was in each case at least one of the following:
1.  Non-European
2.  Extremely late period, more getting into the Renaissance, and not accepted until LATE into the Renaissance
3.  Pre-medieval and generally either ignored or reinterpreted in the middle ages
4.  Universally condemned, and probably all the writings (and possibly the writer) ordered burned (well, I don't know if the writers were actually burned -- but put on trial and their writings burned, in any case)
5.  Not at all about freedom of belief

[vonGenf]

Some of my characters don't presently follow any religion. That doesn't make them secularists or atheists. Rather I wanted to make those characters with their religious side as a blank, so that they can be convinced by other characters to join their religions.

I don't really want to RP them as "following an obscure family religion", as that would imply they already have a religion, and that any priest preaching to them would by necessity be a bit insulting to their family.

Rather I want to RP them as "I don't know how one preaches to the Gods around here. Please show me. If I agree with your stance, I'll join your church."

[Shizzle]

Maybe the priests should go around converting more nobles instead of just hitting a button and racking up virtual followers' numbers. I think RP in general is in decline in BM, and because religion heavily relies on that, it's in decline as well.

I haven"t met any priest who ever tried to convert one of my characters out of his/her own initiative. The only religions I'm part of, I joined because I saw a temple in some region by chance, and joined it.

How about offering H/P bonuses for performing certain religious actions? E.g. as a Lord, having x% of your region following your faith would get you a bonus. Or constructing a temple. Or ... (one time only, of course. And there rests the problem I guess: tracking)

[egamma]

I just ordered 2 of my knights (2 diff continents) to join my character's religion. We'll see what happens.

[Indirik]

Maybe the priests should go around converting more nobles instead of just hitting a button and racking up virtual followers' numbers.

That is ... hard.

Actually, no it's not "hard". It's "Bloody well impossible".

I've tried traveling around with a priest trying to gain noble converts. Very, very, very few people respond. Those that do respond, are not interested. If they don't already have a religion, then they aren't interested in joining one.

[James]

Some are definitely interested and waiting for someone to come along with a religion that they can happily join.

I've had a nice discussion with a priest in Fissoa recently... Still waiting for a religion to join

[Indirik]

Then you should probably take some initiative on your own, and send out a feeler or two. I think that the complete lack of response that most people get tends to convince them very quickly that it's a pretty pointless endeavor.

[Shizzle]

Then you should probably take some initiative on your own, and send out a feeler or two. I think that the complete lack of response that most people get tends to convince them very quickly that it's a pretty pointless endeavor.

So where's the whole 'priests are a heavily RP-based class' thing going then? Is it dead? Or is writing articles on the Wiki some form of singleplayer RP?

[songqu88@gmail.com]

Most religions have like 20 guys following them, tops. New religions are just like, meh, doggy go fetch the bone, ya dig?

Then the big ones are like no one talks as if everyone in the room just got involved with each other's siblings in some weird ecchi way. That or everyone yelling at each other saying stuff like "It's not like I did it for you! Baka inu!" and then pumpsmacking the herbivorous guy into the stratosphere.

[Indirik]

So where's the whole 'priests are a heavily RP-based class' thing going then? Is it dead? Or is writing articles on the Wiki some form of singleplayer RP?

It's the same place it always has been. It is still a heavy-RP class. As opposed to warriors, who go out and fight battles.

What I meant by that last post was that you rarely see random priests wandering around trying to convert random nobles of other realms, or other faiths, to their own. That's because the success rate is very low. And if you do something for a while and get no results, you stop doing it.

[James]

My character wants religion but is not going to go trawling the world I try to find a suitable one. He has only heard of 2 on Dwilight (one only in that someone mentioned they were in it), how could he make enquiries about any others? As I see it the priests of a religion should make the effort to travel around and convert people. Some will listen, some won't. But it would be out of character for my one to be searching for a religion he doesn't even know exists.