IR - Choosing one's own class/Realm themes

[Indirik]

It would be interesting to see a group of 10-15 infils assaulting an army of 20 nobles (10K CS +/-).

What would be the outcome? Can some one calculate the possibilities of success of those Infils?

Too many variables. Relative skills (swords and infiltration), troop sizes, guard activity, patroling activity, etc.

One thing that I have seen done, though, is for infils traveling with the army is to wait until after a battle. Then stab the people who's troops were scattered or retreated. Keeps them from rallying their troops for the second round. With some luck on your side, two or three skilled infils could possibly take out 6 or more enemy nobles, and make a significant dent in the enemy's second-round punch.

But too bad that there is a disadvantage for the stealth class, it would be more interesting if the Infiltrators couldn't be executed but just thrown in jail, otherwise it wouldn't be fun.

Not sure what you mean with this. Infils are no more freely executable than any other class. You can't be executed unless you have a pre-existing ban.

[Gustav Kuriga]

What Indirik says. Infiltrators are no more executable than any other class, they still require a ban. It's just that they often have that ban already...

[Bedwyr]

Too many variables. Relative skills (swords and infiltration), troop sizes, guard activity, patroling activity, etc.

One thing that I have seen done, though, is for infils traveling with the army is to wait until after a battle. Then stab the people who's troops were scattered or retreated. Keeps them from rallying their troops for the second round. With some luck on your side, two or three skilled infils could possibly take out 6 or more enemy nobles, and make a significant dent in the enemy's second-round punch.

Even better is right before you make a major strategy change.  One of the most glorious things I ever saw was back in '06 when the Abington/Carelia/RedSpan alliance managed to assassinate all the generals and most of the marshals of the opposing force in the same day, and then radically changed plans while they were still wounded.

Now, admittedly, pulling that off got half a dozen infils banned and one or two others executed, and the successes were turned shortly when ASI and the Eastern Alliance attacked, but it was still amazing.

[Sonya]

Not sure what you mean with this. Infils are no more freely executable than any other class. You can't be executed unless you have a pre-existing ban.

But i refer to failed attempts, remember we are talking about a mainly infiltrator army defending themselves again another army with Archer, Cavalry and Infantry.

They advantage is the surprise, so they would have to attack first, also the early disadvantage that i mentioned before was about the chances the infiltrators have to be captured either they have success or fail.

Since i never made an Infiltrator my worry is if the infiltrator can get a ban every time they get captured, since captured nobles cant be banned, so I wonder what are the situation where infiltrator get banned.


Peace!

[Telrunya]

An Infiltrator Army would also have Archers, Cavalry and Infantry. While they might not be as strong as an Army composed out of more battle-focused classes, their strength should come out of the disruption and chaos they can cause next to it (Stealing Tax Gold for extra income, stealing/burning food, lowering militia, destroying fortifications, stabbing Nobles, delaying travel). So an Infiltrator Army probably should not focus on attacking the enemy head-on in battles, but seek their advantage through such options and slowly whittle down the enemy while avoiding the big blobs attacking each other, at least not until their actions take effect.

But yes, lifting bans etc. would be a major diplomatic point and challenge for such a Realm. And lifting bans should probably be on the top of the list for any negotiations of any kind between realms (Prisoner Agreements etc.)

[Dante Silverfire]

Don't forget that any infiltrator laden realm will have the most waylaid signs you've ever seen. Good luck getting to an attack on time with 10 infiltrators messing with the roads. Assault their city and only half of your troops arrive on time? That's not good...

Your a realm under attack? Hire 5 infiltrators to tag along with your army to mess with the enemy before, during, and after attacks.

[Vellos]

Don't forget that any infiltrator laden realm will have the most waylaid signs you've ever seen. Good luck getting to an attack on time with 10 infiltrators messing with the roads. Assault their city and only half of your troops arrive on time? That's not good...

Your a realm under attack? Hire 5 infiltrators to tag along with your army to mess with the enemy before, during, and after attacks.

Indeed; I would think that the realm's main contracts would not be assassinations, but food burnings and road tampering. Those make far more sense: more estimable returns to the service, more reliably successful, and less risk for the infiltrator. I would see assassinations as kind of "bonus pay" for infils as they rack up bounties.

[Indirik]

Since i never made an Infiltrator my worry is if the infiltrator can get a ban every time they get captured

The way in which you end up in prison determines whether or not you can be banned. An infiltrator can only be banned if they are captured while performing an infiltrator action. If they are caught in battle like a regular noble, then they cannot be banned. (But they could be executed if they were previously banned. Which also holds true of regular nobles.)

Infiltrators have increased chances of escaping from prison, as well. It is possible for them to escape before they can be banned. For more skilled infiltrators this is a common occurrence. Like all noble,s they also get a last chance to escape when an execution is attempted, and they get a bonus to that escape attempt, as well.

[James]

Joining this conversation late, so apologies if I'm covering things already said...

The Assassins realm on the Colonies was successfully run as an Infiltrator realm for a very long time. When they were accepted by all other realms as being neutral to politics and just doing things for gold or other conditions. When they expanded a bit more with land and started getting involved in more political things they became just another realm. Before that though, if any realm had tried to attack the Assassins, they would have been condemned by the rest of the island.

So it can be done, just not easily... As soon as the perceived neutrality is gone, the realm is just another realm...