Fontan's Surprising Strength

[Tom]

What irks me is that it appears to be their goal in the game to frustrate others. And that I can not abide.

If they want a challenge and demonstrate how efficient they are, why not go to BT? I'm sure many realms there would've welcomed them with open arms.

[Geronus]

 :D

Indeed. If there was ever a place where ridiculous, limit-breaking military and economic efficiency were needed, it would be BT, right now.

I actively avoid them. If I see certain family names someplace, I stay away. I would be perfectly happy to never have to deal with them again.

[Lorgan]

If they want a challenge and demonstrate how efficient they are, why not go to BT? I'm sure many realms there would've welcomed them with open arms.

Maybe don't destroy it then? ;)

[Chaotrance13]

Maybe don't destroy it then? ;)

I'm sure if they were there, destruction would likely not be on the cards. You could always invite them over to Thalmarkin if you want? ;)

[Geronus]

I'm sure if they were there, destruction would likely not be on the cards. You could always invite them over to Thalmarkin if you want? ;)

Thalmarkin already has a pretty efficient and ruthless war machine. They should all go join Nothoi. If it survives.

[Ketchum]

I had to explain this to a couple of well-intentioned players in Minas Thalion who wanted to use IRC for planning as a way of team-building. It just isn't necessary for a realm to work that way and I think players who believe otherwise are missing much of the fun to be had from interacting via the lens of their characters.

This happened on Colonies Island.

You will be much surprised that my character Ash, and other players of Spearhead, Pyran did know about this MT IRC Utopia clannie planning sort of stuff. We were invited to IRC and found out they originated from Utopia game. When their work in Oritolon(the previous realm they joined before they came to Minas Thalion) threaten to ruin everyone game especially those who not hook up with them in IRC, many of us who were invited to IRC quitted. That is when Khain and his Utopia clannies put up a rebellion, protested all Oritolon government members from their posts, their rogue army embarrassing defeated all our Oritolon army many times at our border regions. At that time, all Alowca duchy regions are rogue due to Hvrek Pysche and his multi characters rebellions crusades. So Khain and his ilk able to strike us, while basing themselves in Alowca city. As they are all banned, they cannot recruit anymore men. So we able to put a stop to that, or is it they running off to MT who welcome them with open arms.

[Ketchum]

Ok, so before the Sirion interception, who do you think would have won the war? Westmoor was in control of both Commonyr and Oberndorf. Until Sirion stepped in and wanted peace for a future Nivemus to be created... So I'm sure King Jor had a reason on why to not except Fontan's rediculous "peace offers", when so clearly Fontan would be down to Krimml by now.

Hmm, I think this statement is flawed. Do you know we had moved our capital from Krimml city to Ashforth city for sometime, at that point. And we recruit from the many good Recruitment Centers(RC), then sent our armies to counter attack Westmoor lands. Anyway that is your perspective speaking, here's my perspective.

We still have Ashforth city, I hope you do not forget that Nivemus not created at that time 8)

[Ketchum]

I don't think it's fair to characterise the election that way. Lord Justin has been in Fontan for years, as has Chancellor Aulus. It's true Minister Lyzekiel is rubbing a number of established characters up the wrong way, and I suspect there'll be trouble from that, but he's only just won his second term as a wartime General and his majority was nothing out of the ordinary.

Hey hey. My character Brock does not want Lyzekiel due to his own personal reason. Oh, well. Have to be patient for 1 more month until next election.

Fontan is attempting to retake their realm from those that have taken it over. But it is hard.  The Chancellor of Fontan is their leader and they have the position of General as well. we just took back the position of judge in our latest election.

They seem to be running Fontan like a dictatorship under the guise of a democracy. they do not use the assembly and no one votes for anything now.  the chancellor made it so regions are  not voted upon but appointed by him. 

It has gotten to the point that I am seriously considering leaving Fontan, Though I am not sure where to go. They are destroying the fun and democratic atmosphere of the realm.

If this is true, then they not interested in Banker at all. My character Brock must be super uber popular or did he bribe all his Fontan realmmates during Banker election runup? Either way, it seems nobody want contest against Brock. Until our latest election that concluded recently.

Hey, nobody in Fontan even remember anymore how Brock your current beloved Fontan Banker, who in his past as Adventurer had broken many of his Fontanese realmmates Unique Items? What is going on with all your memory? I created Brock in order to play him against his sister May Ketchum from Sirion before May got deported.

It seems we all are a forgiving lot  ;) Heh, if I bring this up IC, I am sure player of Prandur going ban Brock as soon as he elected as Judge. Or fine Brock for that matter. After all, there are some Fontan realmmates questioning Brock nobility as he rise up from lowly peasant life :P

[Bedwyr]

What irks me is that it appears to be their goal in the game to frustrate others. And that I can not abide.

If they want a challenge and demonstrate how efficient they are, why not go to BT? I'm sure many realms there would've welcomed them with open arms.

I actually tried to set that up.  I particularly wanted to see what would happen if they got put in charge of the BT war effort with the full backing of a continent and a half.  Still would, at that.

[Draekarne]

I've been in Westmoor for years and I can tell you I've seen the difference, the difference being Westmoor's powergaming.

"4 New Knights" and "9 Nobles Returned" from pausing in the past month or so. That's Westmoor on a +13 from new or dead accounts right when they decide to go to War. Sure, Fontan has gone up too but not in the same way from what I can tell. You don't magic that many old players back into the game through some sort of war-declaration telepathy.

Westmoor has practically been tailored to fit with the oligarchy who runs it. I have tried to address the issue IC and as have other players but its come to nothing. You've got an army which seems to move within minutes of each other on even Westmoor's own scout reports and orders deliberately exclusive to those "active" players. The marshals don't seem to send orders to their armies but to select few players. I asked for orders when I realised I was being excluded and got nothing. Comes with not toeing the line I suppose.
Couple that with a ruling government and council of lords mostly comprised of players from Old Grehk with similar positions shared between them and then and then alone do you see a clan. I've pretty much been forced from Westmoor because of it. Its amazing that a Ruler can get kicked out of the rulership and since then half a dozen accounts that appeared after that time become ridiculously vocally supportive and then cohesively vehement against opposition to them, then when the new ruler, also in Old Grehk, resigns the ousted Ruler makes a landslide comeback and then assigns titles to all those characters, including that Ruler which stepped down ; he gets made Duke of the capital. Westmoor is hollowed out into a clique and it shows.

Now the ruler himself is saying other realms are clans on an OOC level? Yeah right. Takes one to know one.

It really isn't worth playing there anymore. I've clung on for a year and watched the place turn into a zombie hole. I've just had Hergoervik join Fontan, since he's got nowhere else to go, and quite frankly its not a moment too soon. Westmoor stopped being an actual realm months ago.

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New Knight (5 days, 18 hours ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Deklan Fuor is starting his career today.

Noble returns (4 days, 20 hours ago)
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New Knight (3 days, 5 hours ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Lanvi von Bax is starting his career today.

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New Knight (12 hours, 43 minutes ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Django Ω is starting his career today.

New Knight (10 hours, 24 minutes ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Tatlana Adriddae is starting her career today

Also, all those new nobles moved straight to the front regions where Fontan was.

If you smell !@#$, check your own shoes first. I know I did and that's why I left. Westmoor has dug its own grave. They expected to steamroller Fontan, made up a reason to go to war on shaky grounds and now don't like it that they've screwed up so they'll try anything.

Oh, and before anyone calls the Saxon cliché again ; Yes I was in Thulsoma, and Averoth, and Caerwyn, but it was original Thulsoma and I was there waay before any Saxons turned up and left long before too.

[Draco Tanos]

Oh Hergo, Hergo, Hergo.  Where to start?

"4 New Knights" and "9 Nobles Returned" from pausing in the past month or so. That's Westmoor on a +13 from new or dead accounts right when they decide to go to War. Sure, Fontan has gone up too but not in the same way from what I can tell. You don't magic that many old players back into the game through some sort of war-declaration telepathy.

...you mean the several people who frequent these forums (reading at the very least) and saw that war was breaking out so returned to activity because they were bored?  The player of the York family was even considering leaving the CONTINENT due to boredom before Fontan executed his adventurer that was close to knighthood.

EC is also one of the main starter continents.  We've always been known for getting the occasional new family for that very reason.  If you remember (which I doubt because it doesn't fill your deluded point), it is also common for new players to join, never respond to messages, then go inactive because it's confusing.

Also, you may notice several things.
1.  The character Vanimus is a character of the Iltaran family (Maedros's).  He donates when he can, being a law student and all.  You'll also notice that Vanimus has a long history of going inactive and active (depending on donations).

2.  I see Dantag also goes inactive and active at least twice in your little list there.  Perhaps another in the same situation, donating a euro here and there?

3. Genivae/Eliza, though not from donation, also have gone inactive and active several times since she joined.  Perhaps it is a little thing called...  Life?

Westmoor has practically been tailored to fit with the oligarchy who runs it.

Oligarchy?  I don't think you know what the term means.  Ask the players of the Lionheart family, the Turner family,  and the Iltaran family just how well I deal with responding to people trying to give me orders after a period of time.  I naturally tend to rise to leadership positions in many games, so it's become somewhat ingrained.   The things it's done to my blood pressure...  (seriously, 27 and on blood pressure meds.  Bleh.)

Or is having advisors equal to an oligarchy in your mind?  I always viewed that closer to monarchy.

I have tried to address the issue IC and as have other players but its come to nothing.

You and Lazslo, yes.  Both of course have/had characters in those Saxon realms.  Neither of whom are well liked by a large number of people in the realm.  The general rule of thumb is that if either of your characters dislike an idea, it MUST be a good idea.

You've got an army which seems to move within minutes of each other on even Westmoor's own scout reports and orders deliberately exclusive to those "active" players. The marshals don't seem to send orders to their armies but to select few players. I asked for orders when I realised I was being excluded and got nothing. Comes with not toeing the line I suppose.

You mean...  Around turn changes?  Yes.  That tends to be pretty standard in BM. 

I have frequently seen scout reports sent to the -entire- realm. 

Now, once we realized we had Saxon spies in Westmoor (two of whom are now gone/defected finally once they realized they weren't getting info to send), we removed them and those who were not following orders from the armies or, in certain cases, sent out orders purposely excluding them.  Why would we give the Saxons free information?

Simply put, you were excluded because the Military Council did not trust you.

Couple that with a ruling government and council of lords mostly comprised of players from Old Grehk with similar positions shared between them and then and then alone do you see a clan.

See the bits of rising to leadership.  Also note, one of my characters had been banned from OG by Maedros's OG character.  If you had ANY idea how things go in Old Grehk, you wouldn't make such ludicrous claims.  I mean, Tom's more than welcome to look at chat logs there.  I'm pretty sure he'll say many of our characters hate each other.  Vehemently.

Also, "coming from Old Grehk"?  You realize that the characters you're talking about started in...  Westmoor?  I mean, if you're going to make a clanning comparison, at least make one that has some logic behind it.  Flawed logic, but logic. 

Westmoor!  Home of clans whose characters hate each other!  Wait...  That invalidates the points behind clans...

I've pretty much been forced from Westmoor because of it.

No, you were ignored in Westmoor because no one trusted you.  You never had anything positive to say or contribute.  When all you do is attack others, you're going to be pushed to the sidelines.  That's the way of the world In Character and Out.

Its amazing that a Ruler can get kicked out of the rulership and since then half a dozen accounts that appeared after that time become ridiculously vocally supportive and then cohesively vehement against opposition to them, then when the new ruler, also in Old Grehk, resigns the ousted Ruler makes a landslide comeback and then assigns titles to all those characters, including that Ruler which stepped down ; he gets made Duke of the capital. Westmoor is hollowed out into a clique and it shows.

It is amazing that a half dozen accounts appear over the course of a year?  ...really?  Are you serious?

You also fail to grasp, my character greets all new nobles/players and offers help and guidance, both as Knight/Count/King (depending on the timeframe) and as a priest of the Church of Humanity.  So yes, they defend my character.  They also oppose those who spout nothing but hate and stupidity.  Like your character frequently did.  They defend people they start to view as a friend.

You leave out key points.  Flaylen, one of the key members of the opposition and Jor's replacement as King, was a HORRIBLE ruler.  He got us into wars with Caligus (after I made a peace happen that everyone viewed as impossible prior) and Fontan (who broke the alliance with Westmoor because Gregor was trying to sell Krimml back to them).  Then there was Maedros.  Maedros was not as horrible a ruler as many like to think, but he had the unfortunate luck to follow Flaylen after Flaylen was protested off the throne.

Through Maedros's rule, the road to peace with many of our neighbors that Flaylen shattered prior was rebuilt.  He just had bouts with inactivity and was known for going quiet. 

Why did Jor replace him?  Westmoor was at war.  It had peace with no one, excluding an alliance with the crumbling Sultanate.  He was the one who brought peace with Perdan under the reign of Maedros.  He was willing to say no to unreasonable Fontanese demands.  He had a history of being a peacemaker and many believed could get the support of foreign leaders.

I assigned titles to "all those characters"?  Like whom?  The most I can remember doing is naming Edward Anthony to Marshal of the Royal Guard (was he one of my supporters?), Maedros to Duke of Westmoor (A leading temporal member of the Church, a friend and supporter, and a Royal), and I suggested Rhakanvar as Count of Hagley (whose previous character was violently opposed to Jor's last reign, even being the lone rebel then, holding the throne for about five seconds before Flaylen threw him off.  But the character IS a member of the Church and HAS been better behaved than his kinsman.  Jor is always willing to forgive bloodlines).

Though keep in mind, Jor would be insane NOT to reward  his supporters with titles, lands, etc.  It also makes perfect IC sense.  I mean, why would Jor (a priest of the Church of Humanity) reappoint Gregor (a follower of the Church of Ibladesh) not only while Caligus and Perdan are actively hunting out Ibby holdouts, but when Gregor is a person known for promising his support to people while plotting behind their back?  He promised Jor support the first time (didn't he join in on the protests not long after that?).  He promised Maedros support, but remained silent.  Can only imagine what he told Micna, the Usurper, et al.

I'm sorry you feel it seems to be a clique, but that was due to your own attitudes.  You made even those reluctant supporters of Jor cheer your departure.  Your character's blantant greed that required the bulk of the army to fix the region not once but TWICE made the military leadership.

Now the ruler himself is saying other realms are clans on an OOC level? Yeah right. Takes one to know one.

Yeah...  Because when we have characters who hate each other, actively at each others' throats, we're a GREAT clan!

For your list, see above.

Also, all those new nobles moved straight to the front regions where Fontan was.

Imperial Knights?  Yep.  Many know the drill to request funds when they become active (who doesn't?) and as I can access BM on my phone, whenever I see someone popping back up I assign them to the Column right away.  Pretty much whenever I'm not asleep, in the shower, or eating, I refresh BM now and then.  I like to be able to write things down on paper when I have ideas, so it helps.

So essentially, because our Dukes are on the ball handing out gold and people have some sense...  This is a bad thing?

Then again, if they were recruiting troops and marching straight for Fontan's forces, I would question if they turned out to be Saxon plants because that's suicidal...

* Draco Tanos scratches his head.

If you smell !@#$, check your own shoes first. I know I did and that's why I left. Westmoor has dug its own grave. They expected to steamroller Fontan, made up a reason to go to war on shaky grounds and now don't like it that they've screwed up so they'll try anything.

No, you left because you weren't liked.  You weren't trusted.  You were kept out of the loop.  The military council, when discussing Fontan before the war re-ignited, FLIPPED when they saw what you were doing to Hagley AGAIN.  You quickly lost any support Corwin was giving you at that point.


Nor did we expect to "steamroller" Fontan.  On the contrary, we viewed it as to be an even fight.  Unfortunately, due to their clique (you know, what you accuse us of but oh so willingly go to join...  When you have characters that are part of their clique already...  Huh...), that is not the case.  Again, I'm not a fan of veteran players talking about abandoning not only the realm but the CONTINENT because of the presence of the Saxons.

I like how seeing Fontan building up is "on shakey ground" btw.  It was obvious what the Saxons intended.

Oh, and before anyone calls the Saxon cliché again ; Yes I was in Thulsoma, and Averoth, and Caerwyn, but it was original Thulsoma and I was there waay before any Saxons turned up and left long before too.

So you joined them in Averoth or Caerwyn?

Seriously though, if you're going to lie and help your clan, do something a little better than this. :(

[Draco Tanos]

Oh, forgot I appointed Mathros as Duke of... Kazakh?  I forget the old SoA capital's name.  Then again, that was more due to his conversion to the Church from the Flow, his competence and the general respect many feel towards him, and the fact that, well, Jor trusts him.  Even if he didn't vote for Jor.

* Draco Tanos eyes Mathros!

(would have edited it in, but it keeps locking up when I do!)

[Turner]

Couple that with a ruling government and council of lords mostly comprised of players from Old Grehk with similar positions shared between them and then and then alone do you see a clan.

Excuse me, my characters started off in Westmoor first before immigrating to Beluaterra. There are only a couple of players in Westmoor that also have characters in Old Grehk as well. Most of those serving in the Council of Lords do not have characters in Old Grehk. Why don't you get your facts straight first before you go around making baseless accusations, especially when they are not even true.

[Azul]

Well thanks to you Tanos I've had to face a storm in Nivemus. You spreading lies all over the ruler's channel OOC to try to pettily gain as much support as you can for Westmoor. You basically said everyone with any association to a list of realms are saxons. Averoth, Thulsoma, now anyone who has ever had any of those names on their family pages to you are some massive clique. Point out what you like about how you're not some powermongerer in Westmoor but even in Nivemus we're suspicious of your Old Grehk linkage. Hey, if circumstantial realm association is enough for you to make accusations its enough for us, right? I mean that would be fair. Oh no wait, you have a cute phrase you can tag on to anything. "The Saxons", and with that little signature everyone jumps. Well honestly I'm sick of it, as a player, having had a character in Averoth for barely two months who then got killed off. I joined because of an OOC discussion in Fontan how there was a massive war going down with two horribly mismatched realms and I took the underdog, like any decent player should if they're interested in game balance and "the experience". Ha-de-ha. Three or four other Fontanese did too, since it seemed a lot more fun than anything else going on. Oh the audacity for wanting to do what you want with your own characters. Now you can pull that "But you were in ..." line every time you want to.

You are exactly the worst kind of player. You've made a point of using OOC to try to win through your IC objectives.

One thing you and everyone else needs to get their head around is that Averothians are certainly not saxons. The Saxons joined Averoth. There are no "Saxon Realms" that I've ever been in. That is a distinction you should do your hardest to realise. But no, you look down a family career page and just note realm names. Well guess what, thats all anyone has done with Westmoor and Old Grehk and that looks sweetily like equally conclusive evidence. The difference being your little gang are still together and still trading titles.

Like the gang in Arcachon and subsequently Madina, the same player spouting off saxon crap to make up for his own failings. I tell you what the TO of Arcachon by the Melehan Clique was the best done thing I've ever seen. Expendable characters, a load of private communication, new nobles taking up sides, bans issued to new accounts and players who attended a tournament knowing nothing could be done to reverse it. Even the OOC appeals to that were ignored. Better yet the stooge-player who did all the banning heroically suicides his character at the end to clean up the whole shop and everyone gave him a pat on the back for good roleplay. Oddly self-sacrificing that Ironhorse family.

And as for you katyanna, one of the main people in the family clan who used to run Fontan and is now upset they lost it, you need to get your facts straight. Ignore my IG attempts to get you to justify yourself but I like loads of players in Fontan have got sick to the back teeth of your family trying to win Fontan. So you targetted Justin in these elections to see him removed from the Judgeship? While at the same time you stand yours, the Draguls and the Hyde's chaarcters for every single position they can get? Even Prandur is now confused since he doesn't know if people think he is in a clan or he's in your anti-clan, which is more like The Fontan Clan out of anyone. Your Royal Family Of Fontan has fallen, don't try to cheat your way back. You've made half a dozen players leave Fontan in the time I've been there, well it won't work with me.

[T Strike]

I've been in Westmoor for years and I can tell you I've seen the difference, the difference being Westmoor's powergaming.

"4 New Knights" and "9 Nobles Returned" from pausing in the past month or so. That's Westmoor on a +13 from new or dead accounts right when they decide to go to War. Sure, Fontan has gone up too but not in the same way from what I can tell. You don't magic that many old players back into the game through some sort of war-declaration telepathy.

Westmoor has practically been tailored to fit with the oligarchy who runs it. I have tried to address the issue IC and as have other players but its come to nothing. You've got an army which seems to move within minutes of each other on even Westmoor's own scout reports and orders deliberately exclusive to those "active" players. The marshals don't seem to send orders to their armies but to select few players. I asked for orders when I realised I was being excluded and got nothing. Comes with not toeing the line I suppose.
Couple that with a ruling government and council of lords mostly comprised of players from Old Grehk with similar positions shared between them and then and then alone do you see a clan. I've pretty much been forced from Westmoor because of it. Its amazing that a Ruler can get kicked out of the rulership and since then half a dozen accounts that appeared after that time become ridiculously vocally supportive and then cohesively vehement against opposition to them, then when the new ruler, also in Old Grehk, resigns the ousted Ruler makes a landslide comeback and then assigns titles to all those characters, including that Ruler which stepped down ; he gets made Duke of the capital. Westmoor is hollowed out into a clique and it shows.

Now the ruler himself is saying other realms are clans on an OOC level? Yeah right. Takes one to know one.

It really isn't worth playing there anymore. I've clung on for a year and watched the place turn into a zombie hole. I've just had Hergoervik join Fontan, since he's got nowhere else to go, and quite frankly its not a moment too soon. Westmoor stopped being an actual realm months ago.

Noble returns (23 days, 5 hours ago)
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Knight returns (9 days, 13 hours ago)
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Knight returns (8 days, 19 hours ago)
The player of Genivae has unpaused this character and rejoined the game.

Knight returns (8 days, 19 hours ago)
The player of Eliza has unpaused this character and rejoined the game.

New Knight (5 days, 18 hours ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Deklan Fuor is starting his career today.

Noble returns (4 days, 20 hours ago)
The player of Cross has unpaused this character and rejoined the game.

New Knight (3 days, 5 hours ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Lanvi von Bax is starting his career today.

Noble returns (21 hours, 8 minutes ago)
The player of Erich has unpaused this character and rejoined the game.

New Knight (12 hours, 43 minutes ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Django Ω is starting his career today.

New Knight (10 hours, 24 minutes ago)
A new knight has emerged from the ranks of the Westmoor nobles. Tatlana Adriddae is starting her career today

Also, all those new nobles moved straight to the front regions where Fontan was.

If you smell !@#$, check your own shoes first. I know I did and that's why I left. Westmoor has dug its own grave. They expected to steamroller Fontan, made up a reason to go to war on shaky grounds and now don't like it that they've screwed up so they'll try anything.

Oh, and before anyone calls the Saxon cliché again ; Yes I was in Thulsoma, and Averoth, and Caerwyn, but it was original Thulsoma and I was there waay before any Saxons turned up and left long before too.

So basically, you rage quit on Westmoor, and now you are trying to throw dirt on it? Typical... I also went back for the sole purpose of knowing that Saxons were in Fontan and were trying to take Westmoor out.