To start with, Sint was told in no. Uncertain terms that if it didn't agree to the formation of a combined realm, or violated the treaty, that it would result in a combined war against Sint. Victus tossed around threats while he was in Sint that if Sint didn't comply with the treaty (specifically the religious aspect) that there would be diplomatic repercussions against Sint. The treaty went through a couple revisions, through the cooperation of several realms. Again, it was dictated to Sint how things would be. Nowhere in the treaty does it ever hint that the treaty is optional, a suggestion, or a guideline/framework. It flat out states requirements and organizations. So, given the conditions that went into forming the treaty and the new realm, is it any wonder that people, especially those from Sint, would take it seriously? It has been "this or war" since the beginning.
And yet the people involved OOCly say otherwise. Funny that. Perhaps it is more that the leader of Sint at the time was claiming such to deflect any 'weakness' in her position onto others? Though I have little doubt that the northern realms were vehemently opposed to Sint establishing mini-theocracies anywhere.
So, now we move on to the situation where Victus walks into Sint and is, quite frankly, arrogant and hostile from the beginning. He issues threats about diplomatic repercussions if his demands for the treatment of his duchy aren't met. (Albeit there was some provocation for that.) He forms the new realm in a hurried rush long before we are ready, titles himself as "Grand Prince" which Ralina views as a subservient title which could hint that we are to be a second-class realm, under thrall to someone else. (Could this be a bid to legitimize "Emperor" Michael's claim to be an Emperor by creating a client state and spread his religion? (Yes, Ralina is paranoid.)) Victus claims that titles don't matter. Excuse me? Titles don't matter?!
On the contrary, Victus only acted as such when Sintians began making demands or attempted to issue ultimatums, all of which were then shared with the rulers of Thalmarkin, Old Grehk, and Nothoi. And all of which quickly led to Sint backpedaling.
After all, if Victus wanted war, it wouldn't have been too hard to arrange. He constantly tried warning Sintians that they're widely despised and to change their ways (in nicer terms) and even attempted to redirect his old friend, the new leader of Sint, to be more careful with his words. His time in Sint, however, has twice-over only reminded him of the dangers they pose to civilized lands.
And no, Victus never said titles did not matter. He said how people view the titles outside the realm does not matter. If they want to believe themselves superior to the leader of Caelum, they are welcome to and in for a rude awakening. Honestly though? He would -love- to change the title. In the future. When Caelum is rebuilt and they truly deserve to declare themselves an empire.
When questioned about the titles, Victus starts in with the "damnable treaty" stuff, and literally trashing the treaty, criticizing it for having typos, being poorly written, and for having no force to bind us because we didn't sign it. He states that we have a right to determine for ourselves how to govern our realm, and that the treaty has no bearing on this.
Because it does not. The treaty was for the creation of the realm, not beyond that. Again, judging from the words of two of its creators, this is a correct interpretation of the treaty.
Victus never agreed to the treaty. In fact, he complained to Michael that it was poorly written and full of loopholes. Was essentially told to grin and bear it until the realm was created.
Ummm... excuse me? The treaty is the entire source of Victus' authority to rule. The *only* reason Victus gets to be ruler is because the treaty let's Old Grehk name the ruler. Without the treaty, Victus is a squatter who has been forced on us by a foreign power under threat of war. He is the illegitimate Squatter King ... err Prince ... of Caelum.
As legitimate as any lord in Caelum is. So, when Ralina, Moonglum, and everyone else step down, they'll finally have the right to demand the same of others (not that Moonglum is causing trouble. He's actually offered Victus his full support).
The Dukes support him. That's a damned 'right to rule' right there.
The treaty is quite explicit in how things work. Sint and Nothoi (I think) name dukes, and Old Grehk names a ruler. Not "Old Grehk names a ruler and a Duke". But here we have a ruler and duke appointed by that foreign power under threat of war. (Whether or not Old Grehk intended that is irrelevant. Victus was appointed by Old Grehk, and used the authority of Old Grehk to grant himself a duchy to which he has no claim.
He is ruler. He has all the 'claim' he needs. Everyone in the realm has been appointed by a 'foreign power'. Caelum isn't Sintian.
Some people claim that we can pick and choose which parts of the treaty we use, and which to discard. But if we do that, then what guarantees do we have that any of them will be kept? Victus has been doing everything by fiat, without any discussion or consulting the realm at all. Just *poof* here's another royal decree. What could be next?
Untrue. Completely untrue, actually. It's just that he asks the leading nobles of the realm and those he trusts. Can't imagine why he wouldn't trust your character...
So, basically, so far as my character sees it, Victus is breaking the treaty so he can create and keep a duchy to which he has no right, and in so doing diminishing the power of the other dukes (one of which is a follower of Hemaism, as is Ralina). Victus is also trashing the treaty claiming it has no force over us, and that we should determine for ourselves how we want to be. But if it doesn't, then Victus has no right to rule, since the treaty is his sole source of authority. Some are calling for the government to step down and hold free elections.
Excluding the fact that he has time and again said it will be rewarded to a noble that proves him or herself in their honor, loyalty, and duty to Caelum, of course. And he's actually kept every word he has made so far. Funny that.
And the treaty no longer has any force on us, no. It was for the creation of the realm and nothing more. Unfortunately it was Sint's own actions that caused its rushing.
Some are calling for it, yes. Their words will fall on deaf ears. We are not a democracy.
So, there you have it.
Yes, rabblerouser sees things. Upset when she realizes her true masters, that being Sint, will have less influence than she imagined they would.
Ha, very well played! I yield.
*bows* I do truly wish you stayed with the Church as Henry. Would've been fun. Provided he stopped the whole garbage of trying to drag it to defend Melhed and their blood cultists.
