Author Topic: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference  (Read 20242 times)

Scarlett

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #45: January 31, 2013, 01:39:46 PM »
Six months ago it might've been fun, but there are just too few nobles left who know Jenred.

I ran into the same problem coming back to Cathay - not the first time but the latter two times. The first time not only did only two people know who I was, Galiard ended up being practically driven out of the realm and ended up as PM of Ohnar West.

The last time things turned out a bit better. ;P

Bedwyr

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #46: January 31, 2013, 08:20:51 PM »
Except Velax was a recognized heir.  There was no title associated with it, but Jenred had been training him up in King-ing for, what, a year?  Something like that.  Velax wasn't the only one (Maurus and Drake were both similarly trained), but he certainly isn't someone Jenred would have worried about taking the throne.  Not to mention that per Arcaean customs and law, Jenred abdicated when he was no longer capable of Ruling, and Velax was duly elected by the assembled nobility, so he is the King, no ifs, ands, or buts.  Following the precedent set with Dentara, Jenred would likely be first among equals at whatever other title he takes as his primary one.

I am quite certain Jenred and Velax can reach an amicable arrangement, especially since Jenred hated most of the Kinging work, and the older he got the more he thought his religious title of Paladin was the more important one, especially given how the Invasions went.

As far as the Empire goes, as long as Jenred is ceremonially granted the historical title of "First Emperor" or something like that (I've always been partial to Phoenix Emperor, resurrecting the old Empire as it were), then he's unlikely to kick up any fuss about Velax being the Second and Current Emperor.

Jenred's never needed actual game mechanic power to get anything done, and I don't see that changing.  He wouldn't have trained up Velax if he didn't think he could continue working with him, after all.
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Scarlett

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #47: February 01, 2013, 03:22:18 PM »
That sounds like most of Arcaean law in that it's not written down anywhere that anybody has ever actually read it and it suits the convenience of whomever is the boss at the time. :)

Velax may have been Jenred's heir, but he wasn't 'recognized' in the sense that he was the lawful heir to the throne - because there are no lawful heirs to the throne in elective politics except for whomever is elected.

At any rate, Jenred would still have to be an idiot to claim to be King or current Emperor or anything like that, and he'd never do it in such a ham-handed way even if he had the influence to pull it off. Jenred and Galiard both share one elder statesman quality, or at least ideal, even if it doesn't always quite turn out this way: by the time they come gunning for you, it is presumably already too late.

The trouble with the current situation is that the OOC planning on Velax's and Marvel's part to stir things up has put Velax in an uncharacteristic position of defending Marvel. If somebody had just done what Marvel did and claimed the same things, Velax would string him up in ten seconds. That that isn't happening now is causing Velax to appear arbitrary, which is probably not enough to bring him down but it is definitely not good, especially given that the whole rest of the continent has been counting the minutes until Arcaea finally makes a political mis-step.

Bedwyr

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #48: February 01, 2013, 08:08:29 PM »
That sounds like most of Arcaean law in that it's not written down anywhere that anybody has ever actually read it and it suits the convenience of whomever is the boss at the time. :)

I can neither confirm nor deny the truth of this statement.

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Velax may have been Jenred's heir, but he wasn't 'recognized' in the sense that he was the lawful heir to the throne - because there are no lawful heirs to the throne in elective politics except for whomever is elected.

See the above possibly true statement about the law being whatever the King says it is.  I would argue that Jenred declaring someone an heir is lawful so long as it works...And it did.  Velax and Maurus, the two acknowledged heirs, got, what, 80% of the votes between them?  Might have even been more.  It might not have been lawful if anyone had bothered challenging it, but no one did when Jenred declared it, so there wasn't any fight over whether he could or not.

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At any rate, Jenred would still have to be an idiot to claim to be King or current Emperor or anything like that, and he'd never do it in such a ham-handed way even if he had the influence to pull it off.

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The trouble with the current situation is that the OOC planning on Velax's and Marvel's part to stir things up has put Velax in an uncharacteristic position of defending Marvel. If somebody had just done what Marvel did and claimed the same things, Velax would string him up in ten seconds. That that isn't happening now is causing Velax to appear arbitrary, which is probably not enough to bring him down but it is definitely not good, especially given that the whole rest of the continent has been counting the minutes until Arcaea finally makes a political mis-step.

Who the heck is Marvel and what am I missing?
"You know what the chain of command is? It's the chain I go get and beat you with 'til ya understand who's in ruttin' command here!"

Sacha

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #49: February 02, 2013, 02:56:28 PM »
I'd say Jenred is something of a mythical figure in and around Arcaea. He could declare himself God-Emperor and get away with it, probably :p

Scarlett

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #50: February 02, 2013, 03:35:43 PM »
Marvel is the guy giving the pristine reputation Jenred and Velax worked so hard for a big black eye. :>

Stabbity

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #51: February 02, 2013, 04:01:53 PM »
I'd say Jenred is something of a mythical figure in and around Arcaea. He could declare himself God-Emperor and get away with it, probably :p

That worked out so well for the last guy who tried it.
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Bedwyr

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #52: February 02, 2013, 09:20:20 PM »
Marvel is the guy giving the pristine reputation Jenred and Velax worked so hard for a big black eye. :>

...????

I'd say Jenred is something of a mythical figure in and around Arcaea. He could declare himself God-Emperor and get away with it, probably :p

Amusingly enough, Jenred actually has plans in place to deal with himself should he ever go that far off the deep end.  He was extremely worried about succumbing to the Ruler's Curse like every other long-time Ruler on the Far East, and being the kind of man he is, made sure that there were people who had ways of taking him down if it became an issue.  It's a short list, but the people on it are more than powerful enough to stop him, especially as Jenred was publicly afraid of the Ruler's Curse, so they would have significant support among the older Arcaeans who might have been inclined to support Jenred, and the newer ones wouldn't have any personal ties to him that might make them overlook his insanity.

Short version: Yes, Jenred is crazy enough to worry about going crazy and take crazy precautions to deal with himself.
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Woelfy

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #53: February 02, 2013, 10:01:19 PM »
@Bedwyr: so, the lesson is Jenred is crazy?

Indirik

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #54: February 02, 2013, 11:36:30 PM »
I understand that there are only one or two of those people left.
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Velax

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #55: February 03, 2013, 01:28:04 PM »
Velax and Maurus, the two acknowledged heirs, got, what, 80% of the votes between them?  Might have even been more.

It was.

Who the heck is Marvel and what am I missing?

The players of Marvel, Morgan and me were attempting to get a war going, with Marvel trying to assassinate Morgan. Unfortunately, Morgan's player's illness has meant little has happened yet.

Anaris

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #56: February 03, 2013, 04:01:45 PM »
The players of Marvel, Morgan and me were attempting to get a war going, with Marvel trying to assassinate Morgan. Unfortunately, Morgan's player's illness has meant little has happened yet.

And, again, even with Arcaea trying to kill our Regent, Zonasa would have to be dumb to declare war on Arcaea. We'd stand absolutely no chance whatsoever.
Timothy Collett

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Indirik

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #57: February 03, 2013, 04:22:37 PM »
Sounds like the perfect war, then. The only way you can disappoint people is by winning!
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Scarlett

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #58: February 03, 2013, 05:05:21 PM »
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We'd stand absolutely no chance whatsoever.

If Zonasa wanted to, they could at least have an outside chance of enlisting Kindara, Cathay, Aenilia, and Ohnar versus Arcaea and Sorraine and Coralynth.

It'd be a tough sell but the door is certainly there. Doesn't sound like Morgan wants to walk through it, though.

Eldargard

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Re: Feudal Hierarchy - Respect/Deference
« Reply #59: February 03, 2013, 08:03:58 PM »
I agree. I am surprised that Zonasa has not tried harder to portray Arcaea as standing in the way of justice and all that. I would think that they would be doing their best to outline this as an attack by Arcaea and try to get people on board. Sending investigators sounds so silly to me!