Religious freedom?

[Haerthorne]

No... but yes. He didn't do it by force but every lord was smart enough to follow the religion of his liege, if he wished any favours. Besides Clovis didn't convert alone... he was accompanied by a lot of other members of the nobility. It's a prime example of top-down conversion. down-top exists too but mostly goes with, well, lot's of slaughtering.

I know this is an old topic, but weren't there two major variations of Christianity that were adopted by the Franks and Burgundians?

[Ramiel]

I know this is an old topic, but weren't there two major variations of Christianity that were adopted by the Franks and Burgundians?

Catholicism and Orthodoxy?

[egamma]

I know this is an old topic, but weren't there two major variations of Christianity that were adopted by the Franks and Burgundians?

Christians were pretty much Catholic from the 7th to 13th centuries, although Catholicism split between the Roman Catholic and the Eastern (greek) Orthodoxy. In 1517 Martin Luther protested several practices of the Roman Catholic church and Protestantism came on the scene.

[vonGenf]

I know this is an old topic, but weren't there two major variations of Christianity that were adopted by the Franks and Burgundians?

The Burgundians were originally pagan; as they converted to Christianity they did so to the roman catholic church.

You might be confusing them with the Visigothic Kingdom, which was Aryan at some point.

[JPierreD]

The Burgundians were originally pagan; as they converted to Christianity they did so to the roman catholic church.

You might be confusing them with the Visigothic Kingdom, which was Aryan at some point.

Nope, Burgundians, Visigoths, Ostrogoths, Vandals, Sueves and Lombards were first Arians and coexisted with Trinitarists (Catholics) for a while. There were times of religious freedom and times of persecution, but it ended in one group dominating the other during the early medieval age (8th century).

[De-Legro]

Franks were pagan when they joined the empire, and converted to Nicene Christianity. As JPierreD has said, the Burgundians, Visigoths, Ostrogoths, Vandals, Sueves and Lombards had a ruling elite that were Arian, though the populace of the kingdoms were largely Nicene. Unlike early struggles between Nicene and Arian theology, which struggled over control of the forming Roman Church, in these Kingdoms the Arians had their own church structure.

[De-Legro]

Christians were pretty much Catholic from the 7th to 13th centuries, although Catholicism split between the Roman Catholic and the Eastern (greek) Orthodoxy. In 1517 Martin Luther protested several practices of the Roman Catholic church and Protestantism came on the scene.

You don't consider groups like Bogomil, Bosnian Church, Tondrakians,  or the Paulicianism to be significant I take it? Sure they were never on the scale of the Roman Church, but many of them were important enough to warrant crusades to wipe them out.

[vonGenf]

Nope, Burgundians, Visigoths, Ostrogoths, Vandals, Sueves and Lombards were first Arians and coexisted with Trinitarists (Catholics) for a while. There were times of religious freedom and times of persecution, but it ended in one group dominating the other during the early medieval age (8th century).

I see now that the "Kingdom of Burgundy" and the "Gundobad" wikipedia pages agreed with my comment, but the "Burgundians" page agree with yours. I'll readily admit to having no higher source.

[Chenier]

I see now that the "Kingdom of Burgundy" and the "Gundobad" wikipedia pages agreed with my comment, but the "Burgundians" page agree with yours. I'll readily admit to having no higher source.

wikipedia ftw

[JPierreD]

I see now that the "Kingdom of Burgundy" and the "Gundobad" wikipedia pages agreed with my comment, but the "Burgundians" page agree with yours. I'll readily admit to having no higher source.

Wikipedia FTW!

Hmm... I found no references of religion in "Kingdom of Burgundy", and found this interesting extracts in "Gundobad":

Gundobad murdered Godegisel in 501 in an Arian church along with the bishop.

The letters of bishop Avitus and Cassiodorus provide glimpses of Gundobad's intellectual side. Avitus, a Catholic bishop, answers questions posed by an Arian Christian about religion in several letters, showing a surprising religious tolerance for the time, and may be the reason Gregory of Tours later thought he had secretly converted to Catholicism.

Showing both the coexistence of Catholics and Arians, and, explicitly, religious tolerance.

[Haerthorne]

It's religious tolerance of the sort that there wasn't a really explicit majority held view. Catholic Christianity didn't mean "the main Christiainity", it meant the Roman Christianity. In that sense it was very appealing, but at the same time there were many other preachers and bishops people could access more readily who had different views. One of my favourite examples of "religious freedom" was in Kent though, where they found in Raedwald's castle both a Christian shrine and a pagan shrine (7th century).

I suppose in Dwilight religion is where we can make the most real world comparisons. Its fun to think of it as just pre-1000 in religious terms, since that was the point when there was a huge swathe of conversions to Christianity due to its associated benefits of alliances and links to a more civilized Christian world. Realpolitik and Sanguis Astroism.

[egamma]

It's religious tolerance of the sort that there wasn't a really explicit majority held view. Catholic Christianity didn't mean "the main Christiainity", it meant the Roman Christianity

What was the  difference, at that point in time? What other choice was there (for Christians I mean)?

[De-Legro]

What was the  difference, at that point in time? What other choice was there (for Christians I mean)?

Eastern Orthodox for a start. Many smaller mostly localised groups as well, some which operated within the Roman structure, some that were separate. The Roman Church was certainly powerful, and in the west in countries like France and Spain was extremely dominant, but there are ALWAYS alternatives of some scale.