Luria Nova vs the rest (bis)

[De-Legro]

Just give me a few minutes, I was already writing just such a post in the population density thread. Jeesh. Also, I don't believe I said that we should sink Dwilight in any context other than supporting your own contention that we should start over if we were going to go through the effort of merging the islands. So specifically in that scenario. I also never said I made the thread to prove that you suck, or insinuated such. I made the thread in question to show the devs that they were killing off a very dynamic part of the island that was seeing growth where everywhere else was seeing stagnation.

Now if you will give me some time, I am busy actually getting some information so I can make my suggestions in at least some kind of informed manner.

You misunderstand. BM 2.0 would not be a restart, it would be a complete recode of the game from scratch. The amount of work in integrate the islands approaches a reasonable fraction of what would be required to do this, with far fewer benefits.

[Indirik]

I am busy actually getting some information so I can make my suggestions in at least some kind of informed manner.

Thank you.

[Chenier]

You misunderstand. BM 2.0 would not be a restart, it would be a complete recode of the game from scratch. The amount of work in integrate the islands approaches a reasonable fraction of what would be required to do this, with far fewer benefits.

Am I missing something? Is there an actual intent to recode the game from scratch?

[Indirik]

No. I think he's just saying that the effort required, and the amount of recoding that would have to be done to support it, would effectively make it that. I don't have the knowledge or experience to comment on that.

[De-Legro]

Am I missing something? Is there an actual intent to recode the game from scratch?

No. In some ways M&F is what Tom's ideas for BM 2.0 turned into. I am trying to highlight the amount of work integrating continents would be. This is something I am actually highly experienced in, I am a Controls Engineer and some of the work we do is referred to as systems integrations, that is taking disparate control systems within a process and integrating them into a single interconnected system. From experience I well know that the concept for such things always seem quite simple and clear cut, I can't count the amount of times clients have told me "its just a matter of". It is the details that always come unstuck, the little undocumented functions and features, you can spend weeks trying to make two small pieces of relatively unimportant code work well together, while ensuring they still work well with the systems they were originally part of.

And this is when you are working with a system following best practise Software Engineering principles, with all those fancy things like unit testing and well structured code designed to be modified. With a code base like BM it result in either a live game that was so riddled with bugs as to be almost unplayable for a significant period while everything is sorted, or a game that received even less updates then it does now as Tim would need to spend untold hours re factoring the code on a test server and writing test code to attempt to release the thing in some sort of playable state.

Neither merging the continents nor rewriting the game is feasible when Tim is pretty much the only coder that is spending any time on the BM code base.

[Indirik]

In some ways M&F is what Tom's ideas for BM 2.0 turned into.

Not just "in some ways". It actually is. When Tom started work on BM 2.0, he came up with the map idea, and even put together a "tech demo" he showed the dev team. It quickly turned into a completely separate project.

[De-Legro]

Not just "in some ways". It actually is. When Tom started work on BM 2.0, he came up with the map idea, and even put together a "tech demo" he showed the dev team. It quickly turned into a completely separate project.

Sure, but it has diverged enough from some of the core design elements of BM that it could be considered a spiritual successor rather then version 2. I quite like M&F and it currently takes up a considerable part of my free time, but it in no way currently scratches the itch that BM does, and due to design decisions realm politics and interaction is incredibly weak.

[Antonine]

due to design decisions realm politics and interaction is incredibly weak.

This is why I don't play Might and Fealty. I tried it out but, ultimately, too often it became "village/town management" without having much of a realm. Maybe if it had customisable message groups things would be better because then you could try and foster a realm spirit but, as it is, it's too individualist for me.

[GundamMerc]

This is why I don't play Might and Fealty. I tried it out but, ultimately, too often it became "village/town management" without having much of a realm. Maybe if it had customisable message groups things would be better because then you could try and foster a realm spirit but, as it is, it's too individualist for me.

It does.

[Shizzle]

Okay so this thread has kind of derailed in different directions, but still I appreciate the provided input. To those who think I wrote my first post just to complain and blame Luria, please redo reading 101.

[GundamMerc]

Okay so this thread has kind of derailed in different directions, but still I appreciate the provided input. To those who think I wrote my first post just to complain and blame Luria, please redo reading 101.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying Luria is to blame, just that they've gotten a lot more out of this than any other realm.

[D`Este]

Well, did you ever wonder why Asylon and Niselur ended up in Luria Nova? Why nobles from those realms joined Luria rather than some other place? There was no intention to go south in the beginning, but the actions of the leaders north of luria made us go there. Increasing the player density there, while making the continent less dynamic.

Creating smaller realms of 10-14 nobles though is not the solution to fix the density on the continent, the realms depend too much on a few players being active to keep it interesting and I doubt we have those.

[GundamMerc]

Well, did you ever wonder why Asylon and Niselur ended up in Luria Nova? Why nobles from those realms joined Luria rather than some other place? There was no intention to go south in the beginning, but the actions of the leaders north of luria made us go there. Increasing the player density there, while making the continent less dynamic.

Creating smaller realms of 10-14 nobles though is not the solution to fix the density on the continent, the realms depend too much on a few players being active to keep it interesting and I doubt we have those.

I personally have no qualms with Luria having gotten more out of this than other realms. I do have qualms with people who claim that Luria is populous solely because they are more active than other realms, rather than having the original thought of "hey, we got a ton of active players from those realms that migrated from the west, that's why we have such a large population and are so active". *sigh* Then they come on here and claim that their realm's player culture is what is allowing them to succeed against the coalition realms, rather than realizing that the coalition realms have either:
A) lost key regions, or in the case of Barca, their entire realm to the monster invasion
B) have collapsed in player population to the point where they have more regions than players
C) have had to recover from a previous war with Asylon and Niselur, while taking over Corsanctum's regions, in the case of Astrum
D) two or all three of the above

Not exactly an easy thing to deal with normally, and made even harder to do while you're at war with a realm that gained a ton of nobles from Asylon and Niselur.

[Chenier]

Well, did you ever wonder why Asylon and Niselur ended up in Luria Nova? Why nobles from those realms joined Luria rather than some other place? There was no intention to go south in the beginning, but the actions of the leaders north of luria made us go there. Increasing the player density there, while making the continent less dynamic.

Creating smaller realms of 10-14 nobles though is not the solution to fix the density on the continent, the realms depend too much on a few players being active to keep it interesting and I doubt we have those.

Because every other realm of the continent was hostile to them...?

[Lorgan]

Because every other realm of the continent was hostile to them...?

Welcome to Luria, the least hostile realm of Dwilight! ;)