Author Topic: Limiting unjustified diplomatic actions  (Read 11677 times)

Stue (DC)

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Re: Limiting unjustified diplomatic actions
« Topic Start: June 08, 2011, 02:02:28 PM »
You speak of a "long" alliance as if the time itself somehow lends weight to it. While it might be a consideration, an alliance of convenience could well last a long time, and be broken either when it first becomes no-longer convenient, or some power grab comes up.

exactly, i think duration has much of weight, but it is really not my own singular opinion, many things in game mechanics revelve about quality duration gives - from ability to change class to frequent granting of titles to those with longest loyalty to the realm, so that idea is i believe very much aligned with general concepts of the game.


Take for example FEI. Cathay and GA have had an alliance since GA sent military aid to Cathay during the Great Crusade. Recently GA moved through Cathay lands in order attack another realm, explicitly  after Cathay refused them passage through their lands. Should they have to go through some long process just to get a revenge war going?

they actually did take care of rp-ing and did not enter war, but lowered relations to neutral, and did not enter war for at least next month i was still there, so they would not need my device.

negative example is in my opinion arcarea, that quickly moved from long-negotiated peace to war, even if she was not party directly involved in ga-cathay troubles, in my opinion just to use favorable disposition of military forces. ordering attack and than declaring war 15 minutes before turn-change is one of my the least respected things in the whole game, and falls into similar category. there is no any rp-ing justification for use of diplomatic buttons for military tactical purposes, in my personal opinion, that just leaves bad taste.

that could lead to another proposal - after ruler clicks "war" button, that should come into power at least at beginning of next turn, if not even later, something like "messanger is coming toward you" warning to ruler who will receive war declaration.

there are marshals who should organize military tactics, that shouldn't be allowed to rulers.

The problem is you are trying to use game mechanics to solve a behavior problem. Some realms do indeed not take Alliances seriously enough, but the solution you propose limits ALL realms, in order to try and prevent the behavior of some.

you are right on this, this only comes from my opinion that such behavior degrades game, and therefore should be partly dealt with through game mechanics.

again, that is not my invention. something related to federation already exists, i just think it should be enhanced to the whole diplomacy.

as regards to limits, the only limit would be that rulers would need to wait for radical changes of diplomatic stances. that would give them large opportunity to better prepare it, justify it and rp it, and could actually imporve game quality. the only limit would be that quick diplomatic changes could not be used for military tactical operations and too-easily agreed gang-bangs.

Besides read up some history about just how greedy and ready to betray each other nobles could be. Take the 100 year war for example. Edward King of England was also the Lord of Gascony, a fief of France. After some argument revolving around one king not wanting to swear homage to another, King Edward finally did swear homage, and kept Gascony and in the process gave up his own claims to the throne of France. Almost as soon as Edward was distracted fighting Scotland, King Philip of France saw the opportunity to take Gascony, after initially accepting the ritual of homage.

in these old times, did any real change really happened within days? as far as i read, english king accepted that middle solution just to formally end too long war, while even being aware how things will go later, he could not give up everything in one step, so that could possible me more in favor of proposal  :-X

Given the time differences between the game and real life, in that game time is rather compressed in terms of actual events (nobody wants peace of year and years, or taking years to rebuild from an invasion) I would think this is just one example of how fast the diplomacy of the age could change, and just how little the nobility of the time really cared about honour in the romantic way that we think of it.

well, that is matter of personal opinion. i think that, when further diplomatic changes are expected, that would increase tensions among both realms, they would prepare for war, actively seeking for new allies, and, on contrary, that could be more interesting on wide continental scene. buliding fortifications, preparing troops for first hit, running around for new diplomatic ties, attempting political trade, all that would happen, while in instant war it is often too late for that.