Author Topic: WAR  (Read 141846 times)

Bael

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Re: WAR
« Reply #225: August 27, 2011, 06:17:27 PM »
Our ruler in the lead up to the war was a truly horrible diplomat and politician. However, she's been gone a while now, and we've been talking to Melhed (or trying) for some time. Sorenar has not been very responsive.

Exactly the same thing happened with CE on Atamara. Bad politician/diplomat, has long since disappeared. It's not uncommon for a lack of diplomacy to cause realms to get attacked on multiple fronts. Especially when other realms are looking for reasons.


Nosferatus

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Re: WAR
« Reply #226: August 27, 2011, 06:27:10 PM »
Our ruler in the lead up to the war was a truly horrible diplomat and politician. However, she's been gone a while now, and we've been talking to Melhed (or trying) for some time. Sorenar has not been very responsive.

What is some time?
Abbot has for example been working on a simple monopoly food deal to ensure constant trade between Madina and Fissoa, it took him many months and many letters and still it's not signed.

Diplomacy takes tremendous patience time and effort and if you want to establish stable relations it takes even more of that.
It also doesn't only take letters, it requires cooperation and a bond between all nobles, not only the rulers.
It doesn't happen much often anymore, also because realms religions and cultues miss alot of depth.
If people could see that there culture, political system and religion is alot like that of realm a while realm b is the opposite, a good alliance is much easier with realm a then b, it also gives your realm and realm a common politcal, religious, cultural and military enemy to bind against.



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Stue (DC)

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Re: WAR
« Reply #227: August 27, 2011, 08:20:18 PM »
You have to realize that there are game mechanics that push to this.
I don't like it either, i feel a little disgusted even as a player, but thanks to the ow so loved TMP penalty, game mechanics push a realm towards just declaring war and making up reasons just to cover them selves.

And yes, this is all still perfectly realistic, most wars weren't fought with a 'valid'  reason.

I still think Fronen could prevent this war if they'd use a diferent diplomatic strategy (if they had one at all).
You should know as ruler that gang bangs ocure alot in BM and to prevent them you need very stable relations.

MR Calanar(steve) knows all about that :P (hes been ruler on FEI for long time)

as mentioned before, i really do not care much for valid reasons, every ic char can have his own story and that is ok as long as there is at least tiny common sense which would allow us to feel as if we are playing against played characters, not slots that are just ganging, strategy commonly applied in many trivial online game i have seen.

i remember well, that melhed ruler was disgusted by thalmarkin's surprise change of behaviour, he reacted sharply at ruler's channel, stating his own beliefs that thalmarkin made dishonorable move, and lead to logical expectation that melhed will join fronen in war, making game at least tiny playable.

it is also not so impossible that such ruler is overvoted by his Senate, as that is republic, but what is really awkaward that he accepted to dismiss all his beliefs, acting as servant or senate.

he could, for instance, defy to senate, try to usurp power, defect to fronen, try to do anything to show that he is character with flash, blood and beliefs, rather than acting as someone who simply wants to save his post by all means, disregarding any ic reasoning.

that is just one of many examples how people do not care for anything but buttons and cheap, too easy, non-thrilling, non-playable-by-two-sides wars.

Stue (DC)

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Re: WAR
« Reply #228: August 27, 2011, 08:25:46 PM »
I disagree. The rise and fall of Fronen is an extremely compelling story. They started out with practically nothing, rose to be the greatest power in Beluaterra and now are being laid low again by the very realms they "defeated" on their way to the top.

that is a joke, real joke, with no any founding in ic events.

DoctorHarte

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Re: WAR
« Reply #229: August 27, 2011, 08:27:53 PM »
Well, Melhed had three options:

a) Fight Thalmarkin
b) Do nothing
c) Fight Fronen

Option A was always going to be a hard sell. Thalmarkin could just sit 6000CS in Lastfell with some militia and Melhed was never going to be able to do anything except bash their heads against the walls. If they moved further south, they'd get their rural regions torn into shreds and need to recruit a load of militia in the cities. If Fronen fell, that situation was going to get very nasty very quickly. Option B was actually my tip; for Melhed to do as Melhed always did. Since isolationism no longer seems the flavour of choice in Melhed though, that left them with only one choice.

yep, Melhed's nothing special. They picked on the weaker of the two in order to save themselves some humiliation? Beluaterra would have remember Melhed far more if they hadn't chosen the latter
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Re: WAR
« Reply #230: August 27, 2011, 08:59:25 PM »
Melhed probably wants to expand to Jyl and Vur Hagin. They can secure their southern border easily from the north by doing that.

Geronus

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Re: WAR
« Reply #231: August 27, 2011, 10:10:05 PM »
Melhed probably wants to expand to Jyl and Vur Hagin. They can secure their southern border easily from the north by doing that.

This. This is what should make for interesting politics. Not everyone who is fighting Fronen wants to see them destroyed, and Melhed taking Vur Hagin would probably do just that considering that Nothoi has claims on Dyomoque and Wudenkin already, and Old Grehk obviously covets Vozzessdor. Vur Hagin could be our last city. Will the allies reward a johnny-come-lately opportunist in Melhed at the expense of destroying Fronen for the trivial offense of getting too big for its britches?

Heq

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Re: WAR
« Reply #232: August 28, 2011, 06:01:55 AM »
Wudenkin, please.  No-one wants to see Nothoi with three cities, especially not with Wudenkin being one of them.

Geronus

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Re: WAR
« Reply #233: August 28, 2011, 06:13:50 AM »
Wudenkin, please.  No-one wants to see Nothoi with three cities, especially not with Wudenkin being one of them.

Not even Nothoi?

Solari

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Re: WAR
« Reply #234: August 28, 2011, 03:17:52 PM »
words.

You have a very... unique... interpretation of how BM is meant to be read, played, and enjoyed, and seem to get very angry when others don't share your unique interpretation.  Has anyone suggested to you that you might be the problem, not everyone else?

Fleugs

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Re: WAR
« Reply #235: August 28, 2011, 03:18:38 PM »
You have a very... unique... interpretation of how BM is meant to be read, played, and enjoyed, and seem to get very angry when others don't share your unique interpretation.  Has anyone suggested to you that you might be the problem, not everyone else?

+1
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Shizzle

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Re: WAR
« Reply #236: August 28, 2011, 07:01:38 PM »
+2


Naidraug

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Re: WAR
« Reply #237: August 28, 2011, 07:42:39 PM »
Not even Nothoi?

Actually right now the main goal isn´t to take Wudekin. More turn it rogue or something.

And even if wanted to, we wouldn´t have the man power to hold a third city right now...
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Heq

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Re: WAR
« Reply #238: August 28, 2011, 10:55:36 PM »
Nothoi probably couldn't hold it, but if they did it would dominant the other dutchies.

Ideally Wudenkin should go to Sint as a colony so they can have a good war with IVF while everyone else kicks the bejezus out of Enweil (who has had it coming for some time).  Hell, so long as Matt and Squall get aced (and go to Enweil or IVF) Fronen can keep Wudenkin so long as they're willing to burn Enweil and IVF to the ground.

Stue (DC)

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Re: WAR
« Reply #239: August 29, 2011, 01:08:30 AM »
You have a very... unique... interpretation of how BM is meant to be read, played, and enjoyed, and seem to get very angry when others don't share your unique interpretation.  Has anyone suggested to you that you might be the problem, not everyone else?

you probably talk to your forum buddies mostly, and believe that what is chatted on couple of forums among few friends is the only way around, otherwise you would not call unique what is very basics of any attempt of playing characters, not slots.

has anyone suggested you that you need to use common sense only to understand that this if forum where different opinions are stated and that is forums are for? for discussion, not for unison applauding among absolutely-the-same-minded buddies?

i did express frustration over what i feel the worst degradation of gameplay since i've been playing, and if i feel that it is only me who is bothered, i would naturally leave.