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BattleMaster => Locals => Dwilight => Topic started by: Skirting boards on July 10, 2016, 09:42:00 PM
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First you take an interesing war with Arnor and declare peace in order to appease them.
Then you give away a city to Astrum, just cause theres been some controversy over it, even though the majority of your nobles wanted to keep it.
Then you let a bunch of "Terran" nobles hijack your realm (which I'm okay with, keeps stuff interesting) who then launch a rebellion when theyre colony fails and rebel in order to keep a placeholder position for Katrina Dragul.
Lastly you let a duke cecede your CAPITAL city and form their own realm, and then declare an alliance with them.
Talk about trying to keep things status quo and not wanting to fight any wars or contribute to any discussions with other rulers on the continent. Way to continue being the most boring realm in BM.
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Well my friend. Now it is time for you to look for a new realm. Come to Astrum ;D We like fighting wars.
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I have literally no idea what's going on in the north. Someone should write up a brief news flash or better yet a roleplay post.
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Yeah...I could add a couple items to that list from my perspective as an allied ruler trying to cooperate with Morek against its foes. But instead, just lots of empty words (or silence), inaction, and 'make-nice-with-everyone-in-alliance-block'. SA is an Alliance, not a Church. It's sole focus is on retaining political power. Not that some players within it cannot have different objectives, but for many years now, the Church as a collective-elders-government has put their hegemony above the fun of players, to the detriment of themselves losing players getting bored.
I started ESA to do something different, but I'm burnt out on any IC action anymore, especially after dealing with Morek, who I had invested thousands of gold into a temple built by Morek's ruler with express roleplays about the temple-expansion being dedicated to Morek's victory *over my own realm*, trying to demonstrate a religion independent of realm politics. All it takes is a new noble in the realm to tear the temple down, Katrina to spend months saying 'we will do something about that', nothing to ever happen, and then to see that same noble elected ruler. That noble not even being SA, but pagan, which you think a dual SA-ESA theocracy could at least agree that a pagan closing any astroist temple is perhaps...concerning? Nope. That would create conflict and end Pax Sanguisa. That was one of the final frustrations of exerting effort to work with others only to have minimal effort spent to completely destroy the little progress we had made to try to have a wider reach and provide more connections to more characters in more realms.
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Well I tried to change Morek too. Even allowed the Empire to shatter into pieces instead of trying to put things back together.
Didn't take too much effort. Anyway, I tried to pick a fight with multiple realms but didn't take too long to get kicked out.
Was fun while that lasted.
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Well my friend. Now it is time for you to look for a new realm. Come to Astrum ;D We like fighting wars.
I already found a new realm in D'hara.
After being booted from Morek's generalship and being banned for assassinating a few nobles that were trying to turn Morek into the new Terran.
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summary:
mayhem did something crazy and probably pointless
dragul rolled over
who's surprised, again?
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SA is killing Dwilight. Has been for a long while. This was one of the last nails in its coffin.
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In fairness the GMs look to be trying to do something with SA but the player base are too scared to consider anything different because lets face it, it is an incredibly well established church and infrastructure. Maybe a bit of a victim of its own success now.
Recently in my realm there have been a couple of RP events showing an active non-SA deity, and religious recruitment is still near impossible... almost tempted to put in an SMA violation complaint when I was told it was good that a deity had got rid of daimons but there could be no sensible conversion because there were still undead about that the actions against the daimons may have caused... REALLY?!
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I think in order for religions to become something important, it needs to reach a critical mass. Otherwise, it will never have enough influence to make it interesting. I don't think we have enough people left to make it happen.
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In fairness the GMs look to be trying to do something with SA but the player base are too scared to consider anything different because lets face it, it is an incredibly well established church and infrastructure. Maybe a bit of a victim of its own success now.
Recently in my realm there have been a couple of RP events showing an active non-SA deity, and religious recruitment is still near impossible... almost tempted to put in an SMA violation complaint when I was told it was good that a deity had got rid of daimons but there could be no sensible conversion because there were still undead about that the actions against the daimons may have caused... REALLY?!
I have been doing the most recent Portal events. Yes, I have been trying to include and involve religion in them as a means of endorsing religiosity. However, and especially in the roleplay you mention, I try to avoid religious partiality so much as to give them both fodder to interpret and use against the other.
Unfortunately, some players refuse to join religions on account of modern religious views. And those that do, want to run their own religion, resulting in too many weak, pointless faiths with one priest each. And on Dwilight, that serves SA well. It makes me wonder that if any lord could form a realm, whether we'd have everyone forming their own pointless realm too.
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I have been doing the most recent Portal events.
You're doing a great job then.
Unfortunately, some players refuse to join religions on account of modern religious views.
I think if that's a thing, it contributes only marginally to most players not being religious. I know my character on Dwi have wanted to join a religion since day one. But I don't want to join a dead religion, why would I? We have a VE priest and he spends exactly zero time preaching or doing anything linked to religion. More active religions tend to stay with the realms where they are already established and make zero effort to spread abroad. I do not say this to somehow blame the religious leaders for not going out of their way to proselytize and bring more people and realms into the fold. Just explaining why in my opinion religious life is non-existant in many realms.
And those that do, want to run their own religion, resulting in too many weak, pointless faiths with one priest each.
I think there are also some important issues to be recognized here.
Imagine a realm where religious life is dead and some active character decides to liven it up. He has had precisely zero interaction with priests of existing faiths. There is no way for him to learn anything about other religions except reading the wiki. I tried to read about old religions btw and it just left me confounded. There is no surprise said player will just simply start a new religion because there is no benefit for him in doing otherwise, rather lots of trouble and inconveniences.
I understand that for the game in general it would be better to have less religions with more members in each. But we must also realize that players need to be incentivised. There needs to be a reason to become a proselyte of some established faith when you can just become a high priest of your own tiny sect instead. Right now there is none. See my point?
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You're doing a great job then.
I'll always appreciate any advice, critique, or other player input.
I think if that's a thing, it contributes only marginally to most players not being religious. I know my character on Dwi have wanted to join a religion since day one. But I don't want to join a dead religion, why would I?
I have mixed views on this. Most religions are dead. Just as some realms are dead. The way to get them not-dead is to join them and try to shake them up into doing something, not by continuing to pretend they do not exist. Or to destroy them so they are one less option for folks to waste time on. At the same time, especially with my EC character, I have joined and left plenty of religions that refused to do anything.
And as to contributional significance of modern views, as someone who has tried to share religion, I cannot count the number of times I have been rebuffed for simply 'I do not do religion'. And those times I tried to ask why, in a fictional game in a medieval setting, they refuse to even consider their noble being religious, it comes down to them playing as an agnostic or atheist or that 'religions are just scams', 'religions are the opiate of the masses' etc. Hey, aren't we the nobles controlling those masses, at least? Sometimes, its just a private religious roleplayed background, which is at least entirely credible for the medieval noble milieu, if not still frustrating that they've chosen to not consider working with others over IC flavor text, when they could've used the opportunity to spread their IC flavor text to others via the religion.
We have a VE priest and he spends exactly zero time preaching or doing anything linked to religion. More active religion tend to stay with the realms where they are already established and make zero effort to spread abroad. I do not say this to somehow blame the religious leaders for not going out of their way to proselytize and bring more people and realms into the fold. Just explaining why in my opinion religious life is non-existant in many realms.
VE is one of those religions that only cares about their roleplays theological flavor text, but never actually does anything. At least SA does something and communicates, even if it might not be the best something (alliance/political-power) imo.
As someone who *has* tried to actively proselytize, its has felt quite sisyphean, resulting in myself putting less and less effort into converting others as time passed, furthering the cycle. Especially when it takes so little effort to wash out the effort put into converting. Such as temples destroyed in Fissoa, Morek, and Swordfell with little to no roleplay behind it or even against standing roleplay, which are important for being able to attract nobles in different realms by giving them a place to register at. So I can see how some get burnt out on trying to make efforts that do not pay off. Religious frustration was actually the final straw/cause of my pausing my characters. I also see some do not try, like the VE priest you mention. And, I'm not trying to single anyone out, as each realm has different folks in in, times change, and they are hardly the single instance, but in my experience, Madina is extremely isolationist and suspicious/paranoid about anything outside their realm.
Imagine a realm where religious life is dead and some active character decides to liven it up. He has had precisely zero interaction with priests of existing faiths. There is no way for him to learn anything about other religions except reading the wiki. I tried to read about old religions btw and it just left me confounded. There is no surprise said player will just simply start a new religion because there is no benefit for him in doing otherwise, rather lots of trouble and inconveniences.
Fair enough point upon old info. I wouldn't stress theological details early on, myself, for the same reason I wouldn't recommend a large number of roleplays about a realm. I did like that astroism has a catechism of simple beliefs. I would say that starting a religion is just as much trouble and inconvenience as joining one, just a different sort of trouble and inconvenience.
I understand that for the game in general it would be better to have less religions with more members in each. But we must also realize that players need to be incentivised. There needs to be a reason to become a proselyte of some established faith when you can just become a high priest of your own tiny sect instead. Right now there is none. See my point?
Well, my opinion is that you should not be allowed to create a new religion if there are at least 4 religions. One of those four dies? Open game for a new religion! My opinion is not likely to happen anytime soon. I'd also like to see the religious famepoint changed from the founder, to be available to any priest-elder who has enlarged a temple over a certain very-expensive size. This has already been discussed and approved.
And again, I would say the ultimate reason is communication. Unless you have a decent base of support you've built up first, being a priest of your own tiny sect will consist of having 2-10 members of your own realm, who never talk to each other in the religion because they are already members of the same realm and have no incentive to talk to each other in the religion, and many hours, days, weeks, and months figuring out how to expand religion on your own without any other priests, elders, ex-priests, or ex-elders to get advice from. And again, if religious membership is as default as realm membership, its not about incentive, its just 'normal'. Incentive is in choosing which one, just like choosing a realm. I am suddenly reminded of parenting - asking whether a child wants to wear the green shirt or the orange shirt instead of whether they want to wear a shirt in the first place that will likely get a 'no'.
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I have mixed views on this. Most religions are dead. Just as some realms are dead. The way to get them not-dead is to join them and try to shake them up into doing something, not by continuing to pretend they do not exist. At the same time, especially with my EC character, I have joined and left plenty of religions that refused to do anything.
My thoughts exactly. You can't just join the religion and make it alive because church leaders are often the ones who do the least RP-wise but will actively stomp you down as a threat to their authority when you try to do something.
And as to contributional significance of modern views, as someone who has tried to share religion, I cannot count the number of times I have been rebuffed for simply 'I do not do religion'.
Yes, some players might be like that (although isn't atheism explicitly not allowed on BM?), my point is there are still many players who don't get into a religion for different reasons, like lack of interaction and information.
As someone who *has* tried to actively proselytize, its has felt quite sisyphean, resulting in myself putting less and less effort into converting others as time passed, furthering the cycle. Especially when it takes so little effort to wash out the effort put into converting. Such as temples destroyed in Fissoa, Morek, and Swordfell with little to no roleplay behind it or even against standing roleplay, which are important for being able to attract nobles in different realms by giving them a place to register at. So I can see how some get burnt out on trying to make efforts that do not pay off. Religious frustration was actually the final straw/cause of my pausing my characters. I also see some do not try, like the VE priest you mention. And, I'm not trying to single anyone out, as each realm has different folks in in, times change, and they are hardly the single instance, but in my experience, Madina is extremely isolationist and suspicious/paranoid about anything outside their realm.
In my defence, being the one who actually destroyed defunct temples in Madina, my goal was exactly to make religious leaders do something.
An SA temple in a realm where there are no SA priests or laymen is not something that adds to the game. It's not active proselytizing by any means. I specifically called SA to send a priest to preach in Madina and promised to rebuild temples if that happens. But there was no reaction. In hindsight I realize my plan wasn't very good but I can't even say I regret what I did because it made exactly zero impact on anything in the end.
Madina is not isolationist when it comes to religion either. Every priest can preach freely and no religions are banned. It's rather isolated than isolationist, no one just comes to visit.
Well, my opinion is that you should not be allowed to create a new religion if there are at least 4 religions. One dies? Open game.
That sounds really terrible. Seeing how religions tend to die de facto but go on de jure we'd just end up with 4 defunct but undying religions no one cares about every time.
And again, I would say the ultimate reason is communication.
I was a member of a fairly large religion on Atamara and communication was pretty much limited to three high-ranking characters continuously telling me to know my place as an acolyte. Needless to say there was no chance of being elevated in rank either. It's not as simple as you present it to be.
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Ah, religion, I'm tempted to do one, but at the same time, I wish I had a second character to do it with. A monster/undead worshipping one in Westgard just seems so fitting.
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Ah, religion, I'm tempted to do one, but at the same time, I wish I had a second character to do it with. A monster/undead worshipping one in Westgard just seems so fitting.
If you want to make a religion, don't do it until you have at least a half-dozen people committed to joining and being active in it. Otherwise it will end up as just another tiny, pointless also-ran.
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My thoughts exactly. You can't just join the religion and make it alive because church leaders are often the ones who do the least RP-wise but will actively stomp you down as a threat to their authority when you try to do something.
I guess I was just saying 'we can only try', rather than give up entirely.
Yes, some players might be like that (although isn't atheism explicitly not allowed on BM?)
Yeah, but I think more in the sense of anyone claiming to be an atheist is seen as crazy as some advy claiming he is the King of Sirion and the Prime Minister of the Democracy of Xavax. Tom's Words (http://wiki.battlemaster.org/wiki/FAQ/Tom%27s_Position_on_Atheism)
In my defence, being the one who actually destroyed defunct temples in Madina, my goal was exactly to make religious leaders do something.
Well, it did achieve that. My character was defensive of astroism-in-general, even though it was an SA, not ESA temple destroyed. And I recall our characters had some dialogue at the time. And I think that Seoras speaking up about the temple closure in Madina Gardens may have contributed to either the creation or expansion of the Interfaith Council, a guild dedicated to maintaining relationships between astroist churches.
An SA temple in a realm where there are no SA priests or laymen is not something that adds to the game. It's not active proselytizing by any means. I specifically called SA to send a priest to preach in Madina and promised to rebuild temples if that happens. But there was no reaction. In hindsight I realize my plan wasn't very good but I can't even say I regret what I did because it made exactly zero impact on anything in the end.
The thing is, its really difficult to always have priests and laymen in a realm. Take ESA and Swordfell for instance. Our first non-lurian priest (and elder) was in Swordfell. Built a temple. Then he left when he got some minimal flak and founded Trinitism on EC. We had no members in Luria. Sometime later, we did gain a member or two. Then they disappeared for various reasons. Then another, disappared etc. Then someone closes the temple. Then another member joins Swordfell, having to travel to another realm just to find a temple, and delaying for several weeks because of the inconvenience. But having a temple in a realm allows anyone who is in the region to send a message to elders and to join the religion to check it out. Which they might not even know exists if the temple hadn't been there and they were a particularly lightweight player. As I remember, when my character discussed ESA with your character after you closed the SA temple, you required a priest to be a member of the realm, which wasn't possible unless I changed realms, even though I had been willing to come visit personally. And as the only priest (or one of two, or one of three), trying to proselytize foreigners. There's a lot of travel. One cannot be all places at once and takes time to meet up with everyone. Oh, how a priest dreams of a bundle of teleportation scrolls!
If you reached out to SA and they ignored you, good (well, not good, but good on you making the effort). Even moreso, if you made more than one attempt before closure. My point was mostly directed at closing temples with no previous interaction more than trying to get a religion to interact with others. In addition to also pointing out that its really difficult to get members to join if they have to travel far away to join a temple. And depressing after one does put effort into it. But if a religion, or guild, refuses to respond, I think its perfectly fair to remove their institutions to no longer provide a temptation to others to join a dead institution. I have advocated this ICly against another advy guild for precisely the same reason of contacting their elders several times with not a single reply.
Madina is not isolationist when it comes to religion either. Every priest can preach freely and no religions are banned.
I think last time I visited, I was asked to leave because only priests of the realm were allowed to preach in Madina.
It's rather isolated than isolationist, no one just comes to visit.
My character visited at least twice, if not more. Madina was actually where I spent several months paused, roleplaying it as being in deep meditation; now he's paused/in-deep-meditation within Port Nebel. Also, Madina actively sought to avoid being networked into an international advy guild to create its own realm-centric isolationist advy group.
That sounds really terrible. Seeing how religions tend to die de facto but go on de jure we'd just end up with 4 defunct but undying religions no one cares about every time.
No, because everyone would be in one of those four religions, communicating with each other, and creating bonds and conflict with different characters.
I was a member of a fairly large religion on Atamara and communication was pretty much limited to three high-ranking characters continuously telling me to know my place as an acolyte. Needless to say there was no chance of being elevated in rank either. It's not as simple as you present it to be.
The Order? Worse than SA in political corruption. Specifically founded when religions were created to provide the religious half of CE's control. I was actually around for this...there was a General Tsubaki Sanjuro of CE, awesome general, who founded the Order of Ered Luin in Tarasac as a non-partial guild. Around the same time, Tomism happened in Norland (the first test religion shortly before religions were implemented in BM). So Tsubaki and my character were cooperating to create a religious counterpart for the guild. I created a second character for this, was building up the roleplay (Naicotoism on the wiki, if you're curious) etc. Then Tsubaki went inactive and my second char did not get the lordship. Religions were implemented and almost immediately, a long-time CE family (ruler when I had joined) founded The Order (from Order of Ered Luin) with no previous mention to the realm, ignoring the '-ism' recommended religion name, and proceeded to use it as a political tool of CE. I have long thought that religions should be more similar to realms in terms of governance and that something similar (but not the same) as the protest or rebel mechanics should be available. But that requires a large revamp in religions first...
Also, sorry, I made some minor edits on my previous reply, before you quoted me.
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I actually think that that interfaith council is becoming more useless as more idiotic fanatics of ESA started burning down SA temples and stuff and SA will prob return the favor (although they've been doing it for a while now).
But frankly, with Oligarch at a pickle I simply don't have enough time to jump in and go full faith and with Seoras gone...I think ESA is at a troubling spot atm.
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Yeah, it seems that a lot of what ESA has stood for is being championed by the newest members of SA, combined with those who pushed ESA the hardest (Seoras, Goriad, Idesbald) stepping back for various OOC reasons. It's unfortunate, but I know I gave a good effort. I don't think it'll die (at least from internal collapse, it could die from external war) as we did expand it wide enough, but I agree its in a troubling spot. I'd hate for it to be seen as purely-war-oriented with the fanatics, but at the same time, Dwilight does need more war, not less. It's just that ESA has always followed orthodox Mathurin teachings where SA followed each time's whims, so I'd hate to now lose that focus on balance between war and peace each having their time and place because SA uses the more pro-war attitude and ESA defending against SA closing its temples and doing nothing for OOC months/IC years to wage an anti-ESA war and go back to their alliance-happy peace federation boring players away from the game once the 'threat' is over.
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But having a temple in a realm allows anyone who is in the region to send a message to elders and to join the religion to check it out.
Oh, I get that. There is still one tiny SA temple in Madina exactly for that reason. But I'm willing to bet it has seen zero action for years.
As I remember, when my character discussed ESA with your character after you closed the SA temple, you required a priest to be a member of the realm, which wasn't possible unless I changed realms, even though I had been willing to come visit personally.
Fair enough, I think that was my biggest mistake at the time.
On the other hand I do understand why kings are not so willing to allow foreign priests preach in their lands. Wasn't it your character who arrived to a foreign realm and ousted a lord from his very own city? Large religion is a power that can really get out of hand and if you're pondering over joining one you have to at least make sure you have some priests committed to your realm too, not all coming from other realms where they occupy important secular offices to boot. That would be just like giving a weapon against you to a foreign realm without getting anything back.
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Ah, religion, I'm tempted to do one, but at the same time, I wish I had a second character to do it with. A monster/undead worshipping one in Westgard just seems so fitting.
Actually a zealot religious sect set on bringing new light and exterminating monsters would be more fitting. We do kinda of a theme with that, the "Lightbearer" army, the duchy of "The Light in the West", before it was duchy of the "Eternal Lightbringer". The west is dark and full of monsters afterall.
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Wasn't it your character who arrived to a foreign realm and ousted a lord from his very own city?
I do not *think* Seoras ever did that, but it wouldn't be something he would *never* do, just not something done without good justification. Perhaps you remember some more details?
EDIT: I just remembered Seoras removing a lord from their city. It was the capital of Luria Boreal, a theocracy of ESA, with a lord who had just threatened to destroy the ESA temple (he later did destroy), after having gone Mad/Imbalanced, banned the Bishop of Luria Boreal from the theocratic realm, and made many heretical statements. Even promoted the idea that the rulers of a theocracy should be above the priests, which was against one of the earliest ESA ideas. I think it qualifies under good justification. Seoras hadn't traveled to the realm to even do it, Seoras had informed that very lord he was visiting soon, and arrived under independent cause, coincidentally finding himself in the region just as all this went down. Is that the incident you remember?
Large religion is a power that can really get out of hand and if you're pondering over joining one you have to at least make sure you have some priests committed to your realm too
I agree. From the beginning, and still, ESA has held that the highest-ranked (ruler > royal > duke > councillor > lord > marshal iirc) priest in a realm should be a Bishop, the lowest-ranked elder position in ESA. Bishop is basically responsible for the faith within their realm, providing virtuous counsel to their realm, nurturing the faith's growth and protecting it from attacks etc. I had witnessed how having rulers of each realm subverted SA into being a pawn of the ruler's interests. So I wanted to bring the focus to the priesthood ruling, yet at the same time a priesthood without title was powerless. So the priority was made priesthood first, secular rank second, but using secular rank to incentive having influence within the realm without (hopefully) being tied to the realm's secular interests.
I think religious power should be used, but it must be done carefully, and not for any realm's benefit. The way I approach it is by trying to focus on promoting certain virtues or traits and rewarding them (such as expanding Morek's temple after Morek defeated my realm in a war) for fulfilling such, and only using religious power against individuals condemned as being particularly Anti-Virtuous. For instance, protesting a ruler out who has not and will not communicate with anyone, for Silence is Sin. Or removing someone as lord with auto da fe because in over 3 weeks, they have never setup estates despite being asked nicely several times.
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Actually a zealot religious sect set on bringing new light and exterminating monsters would be more fitting. We do kinda of a theme with that, the "Lightbearer" army, the duchy of "The Light in the West", before it was duchy of the "Eternal Lightbringer". The west is dark and full of monsters afterall.
ESA has held since the Freeze that the monsters come to challenge us as they challenged the early astroists, because humanity choked their lands in peace for far too long that the monsters surged forth to spill blood where humans won't.
I think the Order of the Storm Maid has also been using a couple Portal events to proclaim they have divine support against daimons, undead, monsters etc.
SA I think more simply blames Jonsu for the monsters, but still holds a generic monsters are evil idea that most anyone holds against rogues.
You can join any of those and build on what already exists with far more reach than starting another new church.
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Is that the incident you remember?
Yep. It was just an example off the top of my head. I'm not saying it was a bad thing to do, on the contrary, I thought it was pretty cool for I didn't even know priests could do that. I just brought it up to illustrate why realms might be scared to get entangled with big religions with HQ in a potentially hostile realm and no priestly representation in their own.
I think religious power should be used, but it must be done carefully, and not for any realm's benefit. The way I approach it is by trying to focus on promoting certain virtues or traits and rewarding them
Which is great but does not prevent ESA from going bonkers after you leave. You can't prevent people from using religions for political gains so there will always be some circumspection.
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No differently than how one can change how a realm warps after one departs. Oh, Melhed, what happened to thee after I left! Such is time...
I'd also note that I have been very careful in who is chosen as Light of the Church, the three priests considered rulers of the Church and highest rank besides Seoras, for both that reason and astroist-flavor reasons. So far, my character appointed one character, Cuvelier family, to Light because I knew I could trust them to carry on my vision of how I see religion. And he's done it well, when he has had time for it, seeking Balance between the both the priests who must lead the Church and the warrior-heroes who are most-praised for their sacrifice. Both are necessary and vital. And I've made it clear that selection into Lights is a very distinct role that is seen along the level of how rulers used to be played with an OOC care to the enjoyment of their realm and island.
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The main difference here is that you can oust a bad king and start anew but can never topple church leadership.
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And I agree that that needs changed. I would even consider it approved for change. Unfortunately, the motivation to Tackle All The Tasks has been lacking within me, delvin's been busy, and Wimpie keeps busy with smaller bugs, so we're back to limited volunteer effort.
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Personally I think it'd be interesting if we started a new theocracy realm on DWI. One that is located in the west and worships the daimons and is allied with the Zuma Coalition and is in direct conflict with SA and ESA.
I mean we've already witnessed the power of the daimons on DWI when Haktoo (Haktu?) took Aletha Kabrinski. It wouldnt be very far fetched for some nobles to interpret this as some sort of divine action.
In exchance for worshipping the daimons, Haktu allows us cities and regions in the West, an alliance with the Zuma, and some but not perfect protection against the monsters and undead.
This would allow the realm to directly challenge other human realms while not worrying as much about rogue forces.
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There were some Zuma messages a month or two ago, but I'd venture a guess that wasn't shared to Morek.
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The only Zuma messages we got was "There are too many monsters for all of us", and then silence.
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I forgot this forum existed.
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The only Zuma messages we got was "There are too many monsters for all of us", and then silence.
Zuma been busy beating monsters too. Or indecisive battles ::)
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No mention of the Cult of Bloodmoon, which had over a dozen members or more at one time and priests and temples and followers from allover only killed off by the destruction of the west lands. Also people hated 'drug taking' and the word 'cult' because of their real world distaste for it instead of embracing imagination and potential roleplay.
I feel the religion was a success, it was fun and we built a strange world of belief that was player driven but ultimately was stymied by peoples inability to seperate their characters from real life.
The Wiki page still holds a tiny bit of our faith, the last remaining part of the faith is a guildhouse in Nihm with maybe 6 members.
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First you take an interesing war with Arnor and declare peace in order to appease them.
Then you give away a city to Astrum, just cause theres been some controversy over it, even though the majority of your nobles wanted to keep it.
Then you let a bunch of "Terran" nobles hijack your realm (which I'm okay with, keeps stuff interesting) who then launch a rebellion when theyre colony fails and rebel in order to keep a placeholder position for Katrina Dragul.
Lastly you let a duke cecede your CAPITAL city and form their own realm, and then declare an alliance with them.
Talk about trying to keep things status quo and not wanting to fight any wars or contribute to any discussions with other rulers on the continent. Way to continue being the most boring realm in BM.
Let get back to Morek topic.
Yes, it is sad that Morek does all these actions above. And the last part has my character in a big turmoil, conflicted himself.
Yeah...I could add a couple items to that list from my perspective as an allied ruler trying to cooperate with Morek against its foes. But instead, just lots of empty words (or silence), inaction, and 'make-nice-with-everyone-in-alliance-block'. SA is an Alliance, not a Church. It's sole focus is on retaining political power. Not that some players within it cannot have different objectives, but for many years now, the Church as a collective-elders-government has put their hegemony above the fun of players, to the detriment of themselves losing players getting bored.
I started ESA to do something different, but I'm burnt out on any IC action anymore, especially after dealing with Morek, who I had invested thousands of gold into a temple built by Morek's ruler with express roleplays about the temple-expansion being dedicated to Morek's victory *over my own realm*, trying to demonstrate a religion independent of realm politics. All it takes is a new noble in the realm to tear the temple down, Katrina to spend months saying 'we will do something about that', nothing to ever happen, and then to see that same noble elected ruler. That noble not even being SA, but pagan, which you think a dual SA-ESA theocracy could at least agree that a pagan closing any astroist temple is perhaps...concerning? Nope. That would create conflict and end Pax Sanguisa. That was one of the final frustrations of exerting effort to work with others only to have minimal effort spent to completely destroy the little progress we had made to try to have a wider reach and provide more connections to more characters in more realms.
It is sad. I even thought with one General who has a little disagreement with my character General, I could expand the conflict further. But now with what Skirting has said about the recent actions, my character need a serious deep own reflection within. I do not even know what my character can do to spice things up. I mean, who on earth let our capital city to be secede? Never in any my character life this sort of event happens before. Okay, not earth apparently. Who on Battlemaster? ::)
About religion. I thought letting my character joining SA is a good idea to bring life to a depressed SA. However now with an elder priestess apparently go around kicking many people out of SA, now my character has a lot of thinkings to do IC. I gotta thank Bronnen for that ;)
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I would roleplay that some Westfold and Lurian ESA temples had had Bloodmoon Groves planted. I tried to play Seoras as rather moderate upon the fruit. He considers overconsumption to be Imbalanced, but was open to it as a helping-aid in seeking the divine.
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::)
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With only 3 regions left including its own new capital city, Morek looks pretty small size. Time to look for big brothers and sisters realms >:(
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If Morek becomes too dysfunctional, they can merge with another realm. They are slowly reaching that point I feel. But they can still fill their government spots so they are okay for now.
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If Morek becomes too dysfunctional, they can merge with another realm. They are slowly reaching that point I feel. But they can still fill their government spots so they are okay for now.
Mergers are still a no-no, AFAIK.
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Mergers are still a no-no, AFAIK.
That is to prevent 2 strong realms from forming one mega realm. If your realm becomes too dysfunctional, ask a dev. They are not trying to make your BM life a living hell by letting you suffer.
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That is to prevent 2 strong realms from forming one mega realm. If your realm becomes too dysfunctional, ask a dev. They are not trying to make your BM life a living hell by letting you suffer.
Actually it's a hard and fast rule regarding friendly mergers. If a realm becomes too unstable, it should naturally be declared on and absorbed by another realm, not ally with everything around it like has happened.
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Mergers are not allowed much for the same reason as strategic capital moves are not allowed. You can surrender to another realm including the absorption of your realm, but you cannot partner and share power with another realm as one merged realm because it makes you strategically-stronger. As Zakky mentions though, if a realm cannot even keep its council filled, it can surrender to another realm.
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Exceptions to the merger rule are handled on a case-by-case basis, and should be communicated to the dev team in advance if you think you are in a situation that warrants it.