With the new trade system being introduced will the option to be a Priest/Trader be available?
Quote from: dustole on June 14, 2012, 03:47:38 PM
With the new trade system being introduced will the option to be a Priest/Trader be available?
Pretty please?
Quote from: dustole on June 14, 2012, 03:47:38 PM
With the new trade system being introduced will the option to be a Priest/Trader be available?
I was actually thinking about this as well, wondering if it would be implemented.
Priest movement would still give priests a marked advantage over non-priests. I'm not sure, myself, if this is enough of an issue to prevent it from being allowed.
Would there be any *disadvantage* to being a P/T? A warrior switxhing to Trader incurs some serious disadvantages. If there are none for P/T, then will we see a rush of priests headed to Trader class? While that wouldn't necessarily hurt anything, it would turn the priest class into something not intended.
I can't comment on the coding, but would it be possible for the P/T to be able to broker deals, but have reduced trading range compared to a normal trader? I suspect that would balance things out somewhat.
I can't think of anyway that being a trader would disadvantage a priest.
It would not be hard to code a different range for P/T as opposed to W/T.
Quote from: Indirik on June 18, 2012, 09:09:31 PM
Priest movement would still give priests a marked advantage over non-priests. I'm not sure, myself, if this is enough of an issue to prevent it from being allowed.
Would there be any *disadvantage* to being a P/T? A warrior switxhing to Trader incurs some serious disadvantages. If there are none for P/T, then will we see a rush of priests headed to Trader class? While that wouldn't necessarily hurt anything, it would turn the priest class into something not intended.
priest/hero gets all of the hero's benefits (like being able to escape prisons) and none of the drawbacks (mortality). Priest/ambassadors get more hours to modify loyalty and sympathy.
Priest/trader seems like a much more balanced combo than these two.
Quote from: Chénier on June 18, 2012, 11:47:03 PM
priest/hero gets all of the hero's benefits (like being able to escape prisons) and none of the drawbacks (mortality). Priest/ambassadors get more hours to modify loyalty and sympathy.
Priest/trader seems like a much more balanced combo than these two.
I disagree with the reasoning of it being ok for priests to have an advantage over regular traders is that they get advantages with other subclasses without drawbacks. With the trader subclass you would be the ultimate trader since you get all advantages and 0 disadvantages from being one. Hero subclass from my knowledge their only benefit would be the prison escape like you said so its not some huge unbalance. And on the ambassador note it makes sense in a roleplay sense though since you bring it up I think it should be changed because that allows for a massive advantage.
Quote from: Penchant on June 19, 2012, 12:04:13 AM
I disagree with the reasoning of it being ok for priests to have an advantage over regular traders is that they get advantages with other subclasses without drawbacks. With the trader subclass you would be the ultimate trader since you get all advantages and 0 disadvantages from being one. Hero subclass from my knowledge their only benefit would be the prison escape like you said so its not some huge unbalance. And on the ambassador note it makes sense in a roleplay sense though since you bring it up I think it should be changed because that allows for a massive advantage.
Being able to actively escape dungeons is a great advantage to a class that is relatively easy to put there to begin with. Priests are much more likely than heroes to be captured.
Lordly priests can already take advantage of the beneficial travel times to go trade with others. So can priest stewards.
If you have to balance the class combo, hit them where it hurts- in the pockets.
Any profit from trade brokering goes into religions global treasury.
Quote from: Psyche on June 19, 2012, 01:32:31 AM
If you have to balance the class combo, hit them where it hurts- in the pockets.
Any profit from trade brokering goes into religions global treasury.
lol, I really wouldn't mind this, as a priest. Doesn't seem like at drawback at all. xD
^
None of my characters are priests to get rich. They want to spread the Faith, save souls and lives, etc. The global treasury thing would actually be something I would -want-. lol
Well, the priest game being so different I'm not sure it really matters - I mean what sort of advantage can you really derive by being a P/T versus a W/T or a C/T? Does more hours or instant travel really benefit a P/T when food now moves instantly and doesn't have to be carried from place to place?
As far as it being a better combo than W/T or C/T since the drawbacks don't kick in, who cares? I mean, I sincerely doubt you'll see people becoming priests just to avoid the drawbacks of one of the other two combos. "Ha-HA! I'll avoid the troop restrictions of becoming a trader by switching to a main class that can't lead any troops at all! Take that, Game Balance!" See what I mean?
Besides, you've got to have some commitment to being a priest - you give up pretty much half the game when you do. No troops, no battles or wars, no looting, no civil or police work. Virtually no H/P gain for the class means you may actually not even have enough H/P to gain some positions (I have seen this happen to a couple priests). You get a lot in return, but I don't think that a P/T combo creates a ridiculous combo the way that, say, P/I would.
Quote from: Geronus on June 19, 2012, 04:25:02 AM
Well, the priest game being so different I'm not sure it really matters - I mean what sort of advantage can you really derive by being a P/T versus a W/T or a C/T? Does more hours or instant travel really benefit a P/T when food now moves instantly and doesn't have to be carried from place to place?
As far as it being a better combo than W/T or C/T since the drawbacks don't kick in, who cares? I mean, I sincerely doubt you'll see people becoming priests just to avoid the drawbacks of one of the other two combos. "Ha-HA! I'll avoid the troop restrictions of becoming a trader by switching to a main class that can't lead any troops at all! Take that, Game Balance!" See what I mean?
Besides, you've got to have some commitment to being a priest - you give up pretty much half the game when you do. No troops, no battles or wars, no looting, no civil or police work. Virtually no H/P gain for the class means you may actually not even have enough H/P to gain some positions (I have seen this happen to a couple priests). You get a lot in return, but I don't think that a P/T combo creates a ridiculous combo the way that, say, P/I would.
Plus you can be arrested easily by realms with which you are at war.
Priests have a lot of restrictions that warriors don't have. This is true.
What's more medieval than a wealthy priest/abbess profiting from the trade which flows through their market? Or is that just an English thing?
Profit or no profit which is small either way doesn't matter because for the priests that have an estate, they don't need to worry about gold since they have nothing to spend it on except for their religion. If they are a lord they might use some on the region but they still don't need to pay for a unit to get it or to maintain which allows them to become quite wealthy.
Quote from: feyeleanor on June 19, 2012, 07:27:20 PM
What's more medieval than a wealthy priest/abbess profiting from the trade which flows through their market? Or is that just an English thing?
They profited from taxes, not from doing the trading themselves.
Quote from: Tom on June 19, 2012, 08:26:25 PM
They profited from taxes, not from doing the trading themselves.
So... is that a no to the idea?
Quote from: Tom on June 19, 2012, 08:26:25 PM
They profited from taxes, not from doing the trading themselves.
Yet muslim merchants were key to the spread of islam to the various parts of the world where it can today be found.
Quote from: Chénier on June 20, 2012, 03:23:02 AM
Yet muslim merchants were key to the spread of islam to the various parts of the world where it can today be found.
Yet they were not priests. Traders can be members of a religion, no problem at all.
Quote from: Tom on June 20, 2012, 08:13:47 AM
Yet they were not priests. Traders can be members of a religion, no problem at all.
But they cannot spread the faith in any way. Only priests can convert the masses, and only elder priests can convert nobles. Yet in the real world, it wasn't bishops that were sent to convert foreign people from all over (or their Muslim equivalents).
Priest/Trader doesn't seem like a very realistic combination.
Quote from: egamma on June 20, 2012, 06:43:54 PM
Priest/Trader doesn't seem like a very realistic combination.
What about Priest/Cavalier?
Or Courtier/Hero?
It was forbidden because it was found impossible to balance it. Realism never came into play before, why should it now?
Quote from: vonGenf on June 20, 2012, 06:56:38 PM
What about Priest/Cavalier?
Or Courtier/Hero?
It was forbidden because it was found impossible to balance it. Realism never came into play before, why should it now?
I would be okay with locking out those as well as Priest/Hero.
Quote from: egamma on June 20, 2012, 07:05:09 PM
I would be okay with locking out those as well as Priest/Hero.
Don't lock my character, plox. :'(
Quote from: JPierreD on June 20, 2012, 07:56:53 PM
Don't lock my character, plox. :'(
I have a courtier/hero as well, lol. I meant prevent new users from selecting the combinations.
Quote from: Tom on June 20, 2012, 08:13:47 AM
Yet they were not priests. Traders can be members of a religion, no problem at all.
They weren't warriors either. They were traders, merchants. We're not changing Trader into its own main-class option, are we?
Quote from: Draco Tanos on June 20, 2012, 09:49:59 PM
They weren't warriors either. They were traders, merchants. We're not changing Trader into its own main-class option, are we?
I think you just accidentally suggested a really great idea.
While it would fix many of the issues in the current discussion, is there really enough for a lone Merchant/Trader to do that would justify its own main class?
Nope.
Quote from: Draco Tanos on June 20, 2012, 11:21:32 PM
While it would fix many of the issues in the current discussion, is there really enough for a lone Merchant/Trader to do that would justify its own main class?
As opposed to a courtier?
I'm fine with traders being a main class, but I really, really think there should be a religious subclass for less church-inclined individuals to still be able to spread the faith (crusaders, merchants).
Quote from: Chénier on June 21, 2012, 03:38:19 AM
As opposed to a courtier?
I'm fine with traders being a main class, but I really, really think there should be a religious subclass for less church-inclined individuals to still be able to spread the faith (crusaders, merchants).
I've never played a Courtier.
It'd certainly be interesting. Warrior/(religious) being a sterotypical Crusader or fantasy-style Paladin...