BattleMaster Community
BattleMaster => Locals => Dwilight => Topic started by: songqu88@gmail.com on December 19, 2011, 04:48:30 PM
-
Let's talk SMA, and what are the aspects. But this time...If you are going to post anything of substance regarding what is SMA or what is not, tell us your credentials too.
Why?
Well, it's a bit like anything else. We can claim we know all about something like stem cell research, but unless we've got some sort of advanced degree in some sort of medical research field, any claims are naturally suspect. Likewise you wouldn't want someone without a Ph.D in chemistry or at least an MPH telling you that the new chemical plant some company built in your backyard is safe. Or at least you'd be less likely to trust their word.
Same here. Yeah, you got freedom of opinion. How much it's worth depends on a little piece of paper with some initials on it. Yeah, pretty weird, but hey, we do it all the time. I mean, if you had appendicitis and needed surgery, would YOU want someone without an MD performing surgery on you? Would YOU want to go to school to learn and be graded in a course by someone who doesn't even hold a degree in said field?
So I'll just put it out right now that I have no qualifications in terms of Medieval history, culture, whatever related to that time period. I'm not even qualified in history or anthropology. But this isn't about me. It's about YOU. Let's see if we have anyone among us who actually went to school to study Medieval Europe, or has done research, maybe even written scholarly articles on various topics.
-
Probably Longmange over in the Background thread.
-
I have written scholarly articles on Shakespeare. I have noted that much of the simulated culture on Dwilight and in BM in general is derived from Shakespeare -- or at least from Elizabethan England.
-
I have written scholarly articles on Shakespeare. I have noted that much of the simulated culture on Dwilight and in BM in general is derived from Shakespeare -- or at least from Elizabethan England.
This can hardly be seen as surprising, given that this is by far the most exposure most people have to anything close to medieval European culture.
-
This can hardly be seen as surprising, given that this is by far the most exposure most people have to anything close to medieval European culture.
I'm not as sure about that as you are. What about Tolkien?
-
I'm not as sure about that as you are. What about Tolkien?
I hate to break it to you, but Tolkien's work is, by and large, fantasy, not historical.
-
I'm not as sure about that as you are. What about Tolkien?
... I can't tell if you're being serious, or just joking.
So, I guess that's kind of like British humour. Therefore, I must laugh. ;D ;D
-
I'm not as sure about that as you are. What about Tolkien?
There are two main differences:
-Tolkien is high fantasy at its highest. BM actually tries to be low fantasy, despite some magical elements (e.g. daimons).
-The characters in BM are noblemen, which also happens to be the characters in most of Shakespeare's plays. Conan is also low fantasy, but a noble character based on Conan would be out of place in BM (as an adventurer, maybe). Macbeth, however, is perfect.
-
I'm pretty sure he meant that Indirik claiming exposure to (pseudo-)medieval settings mainly comes from Shakespeare is wrong. I concur; popular fiction has probably shaped most of our minds way more than William did. Then again, BM might be attracting a fanbase of WS-junkies?
-
I'm pretty sure he meant that Indirik claiming exposure to (pseudo-)medieval settings mainly comes from Shakespeare is wrong. I concur; popular fiction has probably shaped most of our minds way more than William did. Then again, BM might be attracting a fanbase of WS-junkies?
It was me, not Indirik.
And I meant that our exposure to actual Renaissance culture comes from there—which I think is likely closer to actual Medieval culture than many (if not most) modern fictional portrayals of Medieval culture.
-
I hate to break it to you, but Tolkien's work is, by and large, fantasy, not historical.
I'm tired of your condescending bull!@#$. You think I don't know Tolkien is fantasy?
I'm pretty sure he meant that Indirik claiming exposure to (pseudo-)medieval settings mainly comes from Shakespeare is wrong. I concur; popular fiction has probably shaped most of our minds way more than William did. Then again, BM might be attracting a fanbase of WS-junkies?
YES, this is what I meant. Thank you for understanding me, Shizzle, and not being a condescending jerk.
-
It was me, not Indirik.
And I meant that our exposure to actual Renaissance culture comes from there—which I think is likely closer to actual Medieval culture than many (if not most) modern fictional portrayals of Medieval culture.
Having read or seen Shakespeare by itself doesn't really give much understanding of Renaissance culture . . . which is part of why you see so much bad Shakespeare performed.
And it really depends which fictional portrayal, I think. And regardless of what is closer, I think there are probably people who are influenced by either . . . even though neither really gives the perfect picture.
-
Having read or seen Shakespeare by itself doesn't really give much understanding of Renaissance culture . . . which is part of why you see so much bad Shakespeare performed.
Reading the plays themselves gives you some idea, but I think that most people study at least some about Shakespeare himself, and the time in which he lived, as part of learning about his plays.
And it really depends which fictional portrayal, I think. And regardless of what is closer, I think there are probably people who are influenced by either . . . even though neither really gives the perfect picture.
That's certainly true. There's going to be a wide variation in accuracy and usefulness between different portrayals :)
-
There are plenty of characters that appear to model their interpretation of SMA on the Three Musketeers, and plenty that bring some of their favourite (insert fantasy series here). I study Christian History as part of my theology masters, so most of what I post is going to be based on the bits and pieces of medieval life that I pick up from that.
-
-The characters in BM are noblemen, which also happens to be the characters in most of Shakespeare's plays. Conan is also low fantasy, but a noble character based on Conan would be out of place in BM (as an adventurer, maybe). Macbeth, however, is perfect.
Conan is practically the epitome of the adventurer class in BM.
-
I base bm off of Shardik by Richard Adams of watership down fame. Read it
-
Personally, I highly doubt most people who play this also study Shakespeare in any significant way, and if they have, that's probably not what they base their characters on. *comment removed at the request of Tom*
-
There are two main differences:
-Tolkien is high fantasy at its highest. BM actually tries to be low fantasy, despite some magical elements (e.g. daimons).
-The characters in BM are noblemen, which also happens to be the characters in most of Shakespeare's plays. Conan is also low fantasy, but a noble character based on Conan would be out of place in BM (as an adventurer, maybe). Macbeth, however, is perfect.
King Lear, Henry VI, and Richard III are all perfect examples as well from Shakespeare, in terms of SMA. Personally, I would suggest A Man for All Seasons, by Robert Bolt in 1960; based around Henry VIII's time. Fantastic play and present inspiration for my characters .
-
Personally, I highly doubt most people who play this also study Shakespeare in any significant way, and if they have, that's probably not what they base their characters on. And I, too, am tired of Anaris being a condescending jerk.
You just haven't learnt to see his charms :)
-
Personally, I highly doubt most people who play this also study Shakespeare in any significant way, and if they have, that's probably not what they base their characters on. And I, too, am tired of Anaris being a condescending jerk.
It would be nice if you could phrase that differently. Whatever your personal opinion of him, I'm happy to have him, aside from myself nobody is doing as much coding as he does.
-
I have no formal credentials of any kind on any subject. Am working on my undergraduate degree in economics, so not medieval history. I just read a lot.
-
I appreciate his coding, and am thankful that he is part of the dev team. That doesn't mean he has to have such a condescending attitude when answering a response on the forums. I removed the comment relating to him, by the way.
-
That doesn't mean he has to have such a condescending attitude when answering a response on the forums.
It was intended to be humorous. Indeed, Vaylon seems to have an uncanny ability to read condescension into my posts where none exists. I generally try to simply ignore this.
-
It was intended to be humorous. Indeed, Vaylon seems to have an uncanny ability to read condescension into my posts where none exists. I generally try to simply ignore this.
A problem with all forms of communication, but especially prevalent with with written English. Once you have a preconception about the behaviour of the other party, it is very easy to see evidence of it in nearly everything that is written
-
A problem with all forms of communication, but especially prevalent with with written English. Once you have a preconception about the behaviour of the other party, it is very easy to see evidence of it in nearly everything that is written
That's what a racist would say!
(I kid, I kid...leaving now)
-
A problem with all forms of communication, but especially prevalent with with written English. Once you have a preconception about the behaviour of the other party, it is very easy to see evidence of it in nearly everything that is written
Indeed.
I would also say that though it is more easy to misinterpret written messages, preconceived notions can have a significant effect on your perceptions of people in almost all social situations.
A good rule that I try to follow, online and in real life, is to always assume that the people interacting with me are not purposefully trying to be !@#$%^&s. This way people don't feel like they're stepping on eggshells when having a conversation with me out of fear that I may misinterpret something they said. Because let's face, trying to have a "politically correct" conversation all the time is !@#$ing boring.
Was Anaris being short? Yeah probably, but that doesn't mean he was purposefully being "condescending". I can't say that Anaris' no nonsense response to some questions haven't irked me on occasion, but if you assume that fundamentally he's a nice guy, his personality (or at least the online aspect of it) actually seems quite colorful, and in most cases very appropriate.
-
Was Anaris being short? Yeah probably, but that doesn't mean he was purposefully being "condescending". I can't say that Anaris' no nonsense response to some questions haven't irked me on occasion, but if you assume that fundamentally he's a nice guy, his personality (or at least the online aspect of it) actually seems quite colorful, and in most cases very appropriate.
He's generally a very nice guy, and you also have to remember that he answers (and has answered for years) lots of questions, and has seen many many many discussions about the game both here and on the d-list. Lord of the Rings and Battlemaster has come up a lot, and been shot down many a time (although personally, I think with the way the Invasions have been developed, it's a lot more reasonable comparison these days. Picture BT as Gondor/Mordor, Dwilight as Rohan, and everywhere else as the Shire...)
-
Picture BT as Gondor/Mordor, Dwilight as Rohan, and everywhere else as the Shire...)
I always picture Terran (the 'Moot) as Gondor.
Asylon as Rohan.
And the rest of the oblivious dwilight continent unawares of what it is like living day in and day out in the shadow of Dragon's Roost (Mt. Doom). :P
-
I always picture Terran (the 'Moot) as Gondor.
Asylon as Rohan.
And the rest of the oblivious dwilight continent unawares of what it is like living day in and day out in the shadow of Dragon's Roost (Mt. Doom). :P
That makes the eastern island Numenor... and Madina the Umbar pirates. As appropriate.
-
That makes the eastern island Numenor... and Madina the Umbar pirates. As appropriate.
And the D'Harans are hobbits. that makes sense, 6 meals a day explains all the starvation.
-
And the D'Harans are hobbits. that makes sense, 6 meals a day explains all the starvation.
And Morek and Libero are the wasted ruins of Arnor, a fitting comparison. And Kabrinskia is a strange and isolated kingdom ruled by a witch-queen... oh yeah, Lothlorien.
-
All this talk about LOTR ignores the very real parallels between Dwilight and Game of Thrones. To wit: our monsters and the Others, our undead and the white walkers, and the fact that Dwilight looks almost exactly like a map of the Seven Kingdoms.
-
Ever since I read Game of Thrones, I've thought that the world of ASoIaF and BattleMaster were the perfect fit. The entire political maneuvering and scenarios, with just a touch of magic in the background .. it's perfect.
-
Ever since I read Game of Thrones, I've thought that the world of ASoIaF and BattleMaster were the perfect fit. The entire political maneuvering and scenarios, with just a touch of magic in the background .. it's perfect.
Well, you got any connections to the right-holders of Game of Thrones? I'd be willing to allow them to run a Game-of-Thrones official BM world. For the right amount of cash, of course. :-)
-
...I know his web site address...
Probably not enough of a connection, though.
-
Well, you got any connections to the right-holders of Game of Thrones? I'd be willing to allow them to run a Game-of-Thrones official BM world. For the right amount of cash, of course. :-)
Damn, that would be a good way to get more players.