BattleMaster Community
BattleMaster => Locals => Dwilight => Topic started by: Foundation on April 27, 2012, 10:36:58 PM
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Who buys food at more than 10 gold per 100 bushels, and why?
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Who buys food at more than 10 gold per 100 bushels, and why?
Many people. Because no one posts food at that price.
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20, because I'm lazy.
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And yet the market data indicates that prevailing prices are so much higher.
This is why we need transactional data.
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"transactional data"
Sounds way too modern.
Maybe stats for food sales should be regional, and not continent-wide. Then restrict them to traders, and make them spend hours to accumulate the data. You spend your hours, and learn about what happens in your area.
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"transactional data"
Sounds way too modern.
Maybe stats for food sales should be regional, and not continent-wide. Then restrict them to traders, and make them spend hours to accumulate the data. You spend your hours, and learn about what happens in your area.
Sounds like an interesting feature that could definently be useful. If someone is selling at 30 gold per 100 bushels but everyone else locally has been selling at 10 gold per 100 bushels you know they are ripping you off. If this was restricted to traders it could force lord-trader interaction for a better knowledge of the local market.
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"transactional data"
Sounds way too modern.
Maybe stats for food sales should be regional, and not continent-wide. Then restrict them to traders, and make them spend hours to accumulate the data. You spend your hours, and learn about what happens in your area.
Then call it "Market price" or "Sale price." Basically, the data currently provided are simply irrelevant; they reflect literally nothing. Continental average actual sale prices would be useful.
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but what is food worth? that is, in respect of how much income a rural should get vs a city/etc.. after food transaction
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Food is worth 20 gold per 100 bushels, else it cost too much time to change prices ;P
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Food's value per 100b can be derived two ways. First, as whatever the prevailing market price for food currently is. Second, as 10g per 100b, which covers the transactional costs alone. There are more than 275,000 bushels of food on Dwilight right now. Surplus. That means a bunch of knuckleheads are paying for food that has no market value. Why? As a rural subsidy program?
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That means a bunch of knuckleheads are paying for food that has no market value. Why? As a rural subsidy program?
“Only when the last tree has died, and the last river has been poisoned, and the last fish has been caught, will we realize that we cannot eat money.”
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There are more than 275,000 bushels of food on Dwilight right now. Surplus.
Errr..... no?
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Then call it "Market price" or "Sale price." Basically, the data currently provided are simply irrelevant; they reflect literally nothing. Continental average actual sale prices would be useful.
But local prices are whats relevant, whats the point of knowing theres cheap food to be hand somewhere when you can't reach it.
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But local prices are whats relevant, whats the point of knowing theres cheap food to be hand somewhere when you can't reach it.
They're seven days delayed anyways.
The data's purpose isn't to give you intel. It's to satisfy the curiosity of players, and provide them a general framework for understanding the balance of the game.
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Food's value per 100b can be derived two ways. First, as whatever the prevailing market price for food currently is. Second, as 10g per 100b, which covers the transactional costs alone. There are more than 275,000 bushels of food on Dwilight right now. Surplus. That means a bunch of knuckleheads are paying for food that has no market value. Why? As a rural subsidy program?
Subsidy to rural regions, or rural realms.
Trade is not only economical, it's also very political.
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Errr..... no?
Yes. Every month, another 26,000+ surplus bushels are created. There are 275,200 (as of a few days ago) bushels stored across the continent. Storage is not the same as what's on the market.
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Yes. Every month, another 26,000+ surplus bushels are created. There are 275,200 (as of a few days ago) bushels stored across the continent. Storage is not the same as what's on the market.
How do you know that?
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How do you know that?
He's a member of the development team. How do you expect he knows it?
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He's a member of the development team. How do you expect he knows it?
Magic?
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Magic?
Reading tea leaves?
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The price is simply what people are willing to give for food. If all the biggest food producers collectively decide to cripple the food supply of the others and then jack up prices... you're looking at an interesting situation ;)
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The price is simply what people are willing to give for food. If all the biggest food producers collectively decide to cripple the food supply of the others and then jack up prices... you're looking at an interesting situation ;)
The big food producers are far apart and probably don't talk to each other at all. Then there's all the minor food producers.
It's far more feasible that the buys team up to decide market prices than the sellers doing so.
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The big food producers are far apart and probably don't talk to each other at all. Then there's all the minor food producers.
It's far more feasible that the buys team up to decide market prices than the sellers doing so.
The buyers will starve, the sellers just make a bit less gold. I think we all know who has the bargaining power here.
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The buyers will starve, the sellers just make a bit less gold. I think we all know who has the bargaining power here.
Not really, because the buyers have friends and plenty of realms to chose to buy from.
For example, while D'Hara may not be self-sufficient in terms of food, the 'moot is as a whole. We trade with other realms because that's what we do more than out of need. But if they want to jack the prices of their food, then too bad for them, we'll just pass and buy elsewhere.
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BUY FROM ASYLON!
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BUY FROM ASYLON!
See?
Why should we be concerned when all sellers are so desperate to trade with us?
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I'll buy from anyone willing to sell.
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I'll buy from anyone willing to sell.
I was selling, but it got bought up by Sergio at 18 gold/100.
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I'll buy from anyone willing to sell.
See? D'Hara too. In fact, we have 3 traders in three corners of the map, and a purchase agreement for the fourth.
I will admit to asking our traders to only buy when the food is below a certain price.
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Hm...too bad rotting is introduced again. I have 11k bushels stored and only space for 6k.. And a new granary cost like 1240 gold..
Guess it's cheaper to buy food then a new granary.
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11k stored is not normal. -_-
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It's only for 55 days with no rotting. With rotting it's for around 30-35 days, so it isn't that much....
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11k stored is not normal. -_-
I have a constant negative deficit of food on Atamara, on the order of 150 bushels a day. (with 0 storage). If you could just sell some of this food to me on Atamara, I'd gladly buy all of it at 30 gold per 100 bushels.
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I know you can sell dat food at 50-65 gold/100 bushels, Dante! :P
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I know you can sell dat food at 50-65 gold/100 bushels, Dante! :P
Nope, I never sell food. I have one of the most difficult to feed cities on the continent. Not to mention, its made worse by my realm's situation.
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I have a constant negative deficit of food on Atamara, on the order of 150 bushels a day. (with 0 storage). If you could just sell some of this food to me on Atamara, I'd gladly buy all of it at 30 gold per 100 bushels.
As long as you pay up front...
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Hm...too bad rotting is introduced again. I have 11k bushels stored and only space for 6k.. And a new granary cost like 1240 gold..
Guess it's cheaper to buy food then a new granary.
Someone will have do help direct investment programs and food transfers to make sure everyone has as many granaries as possible, to minimize rot and costs.
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Someone will have do help direct investment programs and food transfers to make sure everyone has as many granaries as possible, to minimize rot and costs.
Or we can fight wars and negotiate treaties over grain, the way the gods intended!
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Or we can fight wars and negotiate treaties over grain, the way the gods intended!
I don't see how fighting wars would help our food safety.
War means gold in soldiers and recruitment centers instead of food and granaries.
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I don't see how fighting wars would help our food safety.
Who said anything about helping food safety through war? Quite the opposite: food safety is now a legitimate tactic once more.
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Who said anything about helping food safety through war? Quite the opposite: food safety is now a legitimate tactic once more.
How so? We can't go steal other people's food anymore (or have others steal other peoples' food to sell it to us).
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Or we can fight wars and negotiate treaties over grain, the way the gods intended!
So, we have your promise that you're going to work on New Diplomacy for 20 hours a week?
:) :D ;D
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I present to you...
FoodMaster!
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With respect to the rot, I had messages saying that some food had to be burnt because of rot. The message included a statement saying it was not yet in effect, but are those numbers close to accurate? If so, rot will happen to all food, but in greater numbers for food not stored in a granary? I have space for 6000 bushels, and have slightly more than 2000. I thought I would not have any rot.
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From the Trader's Feedback topic:
1% is correct. Over storage limit, it depends on the season, but is on average twice as high.
Numbers are subject to further tweaking.
There's indeed currently a 1% rot when you're under your storage limit. When you're over your limit the percentage will be higher.
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How so? We can't go steal other people's food anymore (or have others steal other peoples' food to sell it to us).
LOL steal food. I think you meant to say burn.
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LOL steal food. I think you meant to say burn.
No, I mean steal.
You can't sell burnt food, but you could sell stolen food...
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No, I mean steal.
You can't sell burnt food, but you could sell stolen food...
And Solari meant, "How do you expect to steal food when you have no caravans?"
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And Solari meant, "How do you expect to steal food when you have no caravans?"
Chenier said that indirectly if you read what Solaria quoted.
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Chenier said that indirectly if you read what Solaria quoted.
He said he'd have other people steal it. But they don't have caravans, either. Nobody does. Looting food is impossible for the time being.
We do have some plans to change that, but they'll depend on how things go over the next few months.
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How so? We can't go steal other people's food anymore (or have others steal other peoples' food to sell it to us).
The key word was can't as in he can't because there are no caravans like you said. Hope I am not too annoying, just trying to point out that.
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The key word was can't as in he can't because there are no caravans like you said. Hope I am not too annoying, just trying to point out that.
Oh. Duh. Thanks, you're right ;D
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Well... actually...
Looting Activity (17 days ago)
message to all nobles of Luria Nova
Someone from our realm has plundered Nuas (Grand Duchy of Fissoa), stealing food from the grain stores.
Report from Eddard Huntington (17 days ago)
Message sent to everyone in your realm (21 recipients)
"Your men take 4 in gold and valuables from the people of Nuas.
Production in this region falls by 4% to 51%.
Your men steal 73 bushels of food from the local grain stores and send it towards your home region, Grodno.
3 local peasants were killed by your men."
Eddard Huntington
Margrave of Grodno
I'm not sure if it actually works yet, but the reports say it does at least. :)
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Well... actually...
I'm not sure if it actually works yet, but the reports say it does at least. :)
The bushels either went to the region of the one doing the looting, or you have some really fat soldiers now.
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From the Trader's Feedback topic:
There's indeed currently a 1% rot when you're under your storage limit. When you're over your limit the percentage will be higher.
That's annoying. But I suppose no food last forever so it is a realistic aspect.
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The key word was can't as in he can't because there are no caravans like you said. Hope I am not too annoying, just trying to point out that.
I did originally mention that it was no longer possible to do it, therefore that food wasn't as much as a motivator as it could once be.
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I did originally mention that it was no longer possible to do it, therefore that food wasn't as much as a motivator as it could once be.
Why would anyone only consider stealing food to be effective? For D'Hara's circumstances? Sure, makes sense. For anyone not running a deficit? Burn every field you come across. While it's true that stealing grain both benefits you and harms your foe, too many people think about things in that order only. Sometimes, it's better to hurt your foe first and last.
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Why would anyone only consider stealing food to be effective? For D'Hara's circumstances? Sure, makes sense. For anyone not running a deficit? Burn every field you come across. While it's true that stealing grain both benefits you and harms your foe, too many people think about things in that order only. Sometimes, it's better to hurt your foe first and last.
Because you can then sell the food you stole. To D'Hara, of course. :P
Then you have gold to steal some more!
Seems like it's now being automatically done, though. A change I was not aware of.