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BattleMaster => Locals => Colonies => Topic started by: Ketchum on January 25, 2013, 07:57:48 AM

Title: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on January 25, 2013, 07:57:48 AM: As title subject above suggest. Let me know what your opinion.

1) Which side will win? Oritolon? Lukon?

2) Is any other realm coming to help out? ;)

3) Should Lukon win, their Empire proposal come to bear fruit soon? ::)

4) Should Oritolon win, Lukon Empire will be treated as "Lukon, go home, you are drunk"? :P

For your information, both Lukon and Oritolon are 2 long time allies and federation mates. Since they fought together against fallen realms of Portion, Alebad, Alowca, Giblot, etc. Recently their relationship is strained due to Empire proposal from Lukon.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on January 25, 2013, 08:44:27 AM: 1. Lukon
2. No
3. No
4. Yes

That is all...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on January 25, 2013, 06:48:13 PM: 1. Lukon
2. Yes
3. No
4. High maybe but Lukon has stopped drinking due to a New Year's diet plan. However it now has the munchies.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on January 25, 2013, 07:10:51 PM: Quote from: Valast on January 25, 2013, 06:48:13 PM
2. Yes

That answer intrigues me!
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on January 25, 2013, 10:28:23 PM: Ahhh James... one thing I have learned is that SOMEONE is ALWAYS helping the other side.

The Assassins and MT do not have a direct way to recruit that I know of... but food and gold they do have. Perhaps even enough of a force to try and attack Lukon lands. Perhaps the Assassins are happy to let the thing take place because of the promise of the Dark Citadels return and the promise of laws to help infiltrators...but who knows.

As for OT... the rumors of war against MT have not been verified. Perhaps its power is poised to strike out against (and break its self on) Lukon, to end the madness gripping the world.

This is the first war in many many years that I have led Lukon into without knowing where everyone stands...

I know everyone would like to see Lukon broken. Beyond that, I do not know if they are willing to test the cracks in the Lukon armor...risking the very existence of the attacking nations...or if they are happy to see Lukon dismantle its self in the hope of a brighter day.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Solari on January 25, 2013, 11:53:40 PM: The more important question is, will the relationships and moles that Lukon has developed within Oritolon be the end of the Republic?
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on January 25, 2013, 11:59:38 PM: Quote from: Solari on January 25, 2013, 11:53:40 PM
The more important question is, will the relationships and moles that Lukon has developed within Oritolon be the end of the Republic?

Haha that's the funny part. Lukon has no moles. All information gained has always been with good intentions and from sources who are free to talk. It has not always been that way in all the realms but in Oritolon it has never been an issue, never a need.

Actually, I have not had any real spies for years. I just learned the temperament of each realm and that the temperament does not change much over time. Except for Oritolon who has gathered up so many from other realms that it has changed. Yet...it has not changed for the better. Oritolon has become slow to act and quick to talk.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on January 28, 2013, 06:48:17 AM: Quote from: Valast on January 25, 2013, 10:28:23 PM
Ahhh James... one thing I have learned is that SOMEONE is ALWAYS helping the other side.
Indeed unless everyone busy 8)

I bring you the first big battle between Lukon vs Oritolon in Alebad city.
Go guess who won! ;)

Quote
Total:
18 attackers (847 Inf, 83 MI, 153 Arch)
17 defenders (482 Inf, 111 Arch, 96 Cav, 83 SF)
Total combat strengths: 12132 vs. 10352
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on January 28, 2013, 03:20:38 PM: sick 2.4k charge to kill Ares unit
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on January 30, 2013, 03:07:17 AM: Quote from: Kai on January 28, 2013, 03:20:38 PM
sick 2.4k charge to kill Ares unit
Ares is the name of God of War. Surely it should be hard to kill him :P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ares (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ares)

Oritolon won the first big battle in Alebad city.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on February 22, 2013, 02:44:16 AM: Lukon is taking over Windaria. A TO is in progress.

Quote
Takeover in Windaria (1 day, 17 hours ago)
message to all nobles of Oritolon

Ares Reaver of Lukon has initiated a takeover of your region Windaria.
Troops of Lukon will try to remove this region from your realm and add it to their own through their actions throughout the next days. Troops of your realm can hinder and interrupt the takeover by engaging the enemy.

Quote
The region of Windaria has been looted by Lukon forces!

Quote
Lukon forces are killing, raping and burning in Windaria!
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on February 22, 2013, 04:12:08 AM: And that is only the beginning. *dramatic music*
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on February 22, 2013, 07:12:35 AM: Quote from: Valast on February 22, 2013, 04:12:08 AM
And that is only the beginning. *dramatic music*
Spearhead throws his fist in the air and says "How dare you attack my family home in Windaria?!"

Disclaimer: He never say this
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on February 24, 2013, 02:04:58 AM: Spearhead never says anything, actually.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Psyche on February 24, 2013, 03:04:17 PM: Still? You obviously haven't raised enough problems for him to go bitch at Lukon about.... oh, yea.. wait..
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on February 24, 2013, 04:16:42 PM: Today received report below ::)

Quote
Windaria
The local peasants laugh about the takeover activities of Lukon and have gone back to their normal lives. The takeover has been stopped.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on March 06, 2013, 10:17:12 PM: I think Spearhead went into retirement when he got the Alebad gig! ;-)

It's been a month or so now and I have to say, I didn't expect the war to turn out the way it has so far. Oritolon has a handful of victories and Alebad's walls are still intact for the time being. Turns out that Lukon Horde is more of a rabble! Not sure Oritolon's success is sustainable over the long term though. I reckon the disparity in nobles between Lukon and Oritolon will see Oritolon overwhelmed eventually.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 06, 2013, 11:54:01 PM: This was never thought of as a quick fight from Lukon's side of things. It has always been known that to make them give in would be expensive and time consuming. But Lukon has tons of gold and nothing but time.

The longer this war drags on...the more gold income they will loose due to militia. On top of that they can barely feed themselves.

The interesting part to me is that it did not have to come down to a war at all. Basically too many nobles from Giblot (and elsewhere) filled Oritolons ranks, making any vote on a pro Lukon idea unattainable.

That coupled with internal power plays by some nobles resulted in mass confusion about what was actually being proposed. Had Oritolon gone with the plan they would have ended up the most powerful Empire in the unified Colonies. Three cities with potential to bring the duchy of Lukon into their Oritolon Empire rather than the Lukon Empire.

The Unified Colonies was just a set of agreements monitored by group elected by each realm...basically to prevent genocide.

Now however they will likely end up loosing Alebad and any chance to bring Lukon into the Oritolon Empire...but in the end they will still be forced into the United Colonies (or what ever name the Colonial Senate eventually calls it).

Lukon still has thousands of gold on hand... and over a thousand recruits waiting to be recruited.

So far the battles have gone Oritolons way... but it has been Oritolons regions which have suffered and Oritolons honor that has been tainted by its use of priests in warfare...and failure to abide by combatant exchange.

All of that aside. It is Oritolon we are talking about here. Eventually someone or some group will choose to take power and that will be the end...if history is any indicator.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 07, 2013, 01:41:16 AM: Quote from: Revan on March 06, 2013, 10:17:12 PM
I think Spearhead went into retirement when he got the Alebad gig! ;-)

It's been a month or so now and I have to say, I didn't expect the war to turn out the way it has so far. Oritolon has a handful of victories and Alebad's walls are still intact for the time being. Turns out that Lukon Horde is more of a rabble! Not sure Oritolon's success is sustainable over the long term though. I reckon the disparity in nobles between Lukon and Oritolon will see Oritolon overwhelmed eventually.
A handsome reward for his hardwork in Oritolon previously. It is a bit strange that he does not secede Alebad duchy, even considering he was a long time Lukon supporter. I am pretty sure Lukon would have given away Vir el Mari Height region for Alebad city to munch on ::)

On another note, it looks like all Ketchum family members have an affinity or should I say, talent for become Oritolon realm Judge. After Ash retirement as Judge, now it is May turn to become Judge :)
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on March 07, 2013, 02:14:11 AM: Actually, Oritolon did not like being told "you must join the empire and take yourself apart, and you have no say in the matter".
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 07, 2013, 05:37:18 AM: Ahh well... egamma, we would still be sitting here waiting for Oritolon to vote on if they should have lunch before voting to see if a vote should be held to figure out the voting procedure on a vote to elect a voting official in charge of setting the vote for time frame of voting to see if they should have a vote.

I knew it was all a stall for time as soon as I found out the council had voted in a majority for it...then suddenly a new vote was being set for the entire realm. Yet the person who was against the Empire to begin with and gathered support while making all the facts muddy is no longer even in Oritolon.

But hey...Lukon loves a good war. We will battle to the death if need be. BUT you cant deny that the Oritolon/Lukon federation was nothing but a shell anymore. You guys did not trust Lukon which forced Lukon to not trust Oritolon.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on March 11, 2013, 04:39:46 AM: Quote from: Valast on March 07, 2013, 05:37:18 AM
Ahh well... egamma, we would still be sitting here waiting for Oritolon to vote on if they should have lunch before voting to see if a vote should be held to figure out the voting procedure on a vote to elect a voting official in charge of setting the vote for time frame of voting to see if they should have a vote.
Actually, the realm-wide vote was in progress when Lukon declared on us. That affected the vote quite a lot, and not in Lukon's favor.

As for lords in favor, or not, it's really up to the Dukes if they want to secede or not--unless you think that the judge should have banned them, which actually wouldn't have been possible with Spearhead since he's Royal? Quite simply, you couldn't force Spearhead to leave if he didn't want to, and it's obvious what his choice was.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 11, 2013, 05:19:02 PM: So your saying it was not all a stall tactic designed to keep Lukon waiting while militia was stockpiled?

That Malice was not stalling, Robin was not stalling? We were simply waiting for a vote of the people?

It was then unfortunate that the militia was being built up at the same time... as that was a key indicator that it was all a ruse to buy time for defense.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on March 11, 2013, 08:04:44 PM: I think we're learning more about Valakyrie's hypersensitivity on the diplomatic stage than anything that has happened in Oritolon ;-) When Malice called a referendum after the council vote it was because a handful of people were making enough of a ruckus that he had little choice but to hold a referendum. Another day of protests and Malice would have been forced out. And what would Lukon have done then? Probably assumed that Oritolon was saying no to empire. The first referendum was held for one purpose and that was to keep everything on track towards empire!

Of course, the outcome of that first referendum was a tie. It left Malice in a difficult position. He could have tried to force things through and damn the consequences, but it remained likely that would only lead to protests and trouble. So another referendum was started. It was then that Valakyrie started to get agitated and made sure no-one was under any illusions as to the consequences of a rejection. That's when things started turning against the idea of empire within Oritolon. The desperate act of Malice challenging Valakyrie was indeed a stalling tactic. But that's because almost out of the blue it became clear Lukon was about to declare war.

No-one in Oritolon had been expecting war. Valakyrie had been ambiguous enough (and to be fair, what Valakyrie told Malice in the beginning and what she was saying later on were completely different which didn't help much) that it didn't occur to anyone that Lukon might actually, seriously, declare war on Oritolon. The referendums had been about about making sure Oritolon was behind the empire. Only when it became obvious the second referendum was going to fail did Malice table the duel. It was mainly just to ensure Oritolon could make a half-decent effort at a defence before the Horde overwhelmed Alebad. The week that duel bought was just enough time for us to call in our nobles from across the realm, have them recruit and start heading toward Alebad. There wasn't time for militia placement. Maybe if the duel had forced a serious wound or a Lukon ruler election there would have been time but not otherwise! As I say, it was a desperate stalling tactic which Malice only resorted too once efforts to get Oritolon behind the empire were set to decisively fail.

I think given the way things have turned out, Malice did well to deliver a majority in favour of empire at all. But the old guard were never all that enthusiastic and Robin's caricature of Lukon got embedded in too many young minds. When Lukon's efforts of persuasion started getting ugly all it did was vindicate the naysayers and give more experienced hands the space they needed to change their minds on something they hadn't been all that fond of to begin with. That's the real problem. One or two former Giblot nobles didn't poison Oritolon against Lukon, Oritolon and Lukon simply drifted apart. Valakyrie might have all Valasts old contacts, but the old friendships and loyalties that used to underpin those links seem to have all-but disappeared. You can talk all day about how good everyone would have it under the empire but the peaceful division of Oritolon was simply asking too much.

If Lukon had been a bit more patient and less gung-ho in her communications, I still think Oritolon could have peacefully delivered on the empire. Oritolon never got the space to do it though. As things started getting fraught within Oritolon, Lukon started throwing wood onto the fire from outside. But even then, I suppose it comes back to the state of relations between Oritolon and Lukon. It's been a long time since Lukon had much faith in Oritolon's internal politics and that was reflected in Lukon's growing impatience and distrust. The truth is that the proposal of a Colonies empire came at possibly the lowest ebb in Oritolon and Lukon's shared history and war was probably always going to be the result.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 11, 2013, 09:54:44 PM: Ahhh there could be no other way and stay true to the Character of Lukon. Valakyrie is the daughter of a great leader of Lukon. The man who helped bring about the current age in the Colonies. There was a time when he knew who would be elected in any given realm well before an election was needed...and a time when it was his biggest concern to see Oritolon and Lukon both advance.

BUT as he grew older and Oritolon changed through rebellions and such he had to change his mentality to keep Oritolon secure only for Lukons security rather than for Oritolons. But he did it and kept doing it. Every plan made or plot set or foiled was designed to keep both realms strong.

but he died. The realm did not go with his son who was in exile in MT but to his daughter in Lukon. She is a fine warrior and alright in diplomatic....Lukon style. But just like in real life as people raise children...she did not grow up under the constant threat of destruction. No she grew up as the destroyer.

So without her fathers backing from past contacts and knowledge she has tried to continue on the same way he did yet without the ability to do it and not cause a bigger conflict.

Now as to the letters sent to Malice about the Empire. It has always been said that this WILL happen. It has always had the threat of violence if it did not come about.

And for all the talk about Valakyrie's failures to give Oritolon enough time to process it all and talk it out and work it out and on and on... Oritolon and Malice have also failed equally in remembering one very important thing. They are dealing with Lukon. Impatient, violent, unrelenting Lukon. Perhaps a better way to guide Valakyrie into what was going on inside Oritolon could have been used instead of telling her that the vote had failed and that Oritolon said no to the Empire. To Valakyrie no means no... no does not mean "so we shall talk it to death and see what comes about later"

Now. Revan has said that "a handful of people were making enough of a ruckus" but WHO were those hand full? How many of those handful were former Giblot and was Robin one of those handful. Where is Robin now? Off in OT? Hmm

It is all good of course. I understand we are all just talking about the path we took and all that. I am enjoying the best war the Colonies have seen in ages....
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on March 12, 2013, 12:44:44 AM: The empire plans seemed to change and become more fleshed out as time went on. What Valakyrie said to Malice in the beginning and what she was saying later on varied quite a bit. There were definitely some crossed wires as for a little while we were operating under the assumption Oritolon could join the empire even if she didn't divide. I know it was an oversight, but it did lead to a bit of confusion.

Once Oritolon had voted no, there was no more discussion to be had. At least, as far as Malice was concerned. What happened with Thorbjorn later was, I think, a surprise for everybody. He campaigned for office saying he opposed the empire then suddenly became a supporter of it almost overnight. But by then there was a feeling in Oritolon of 'well, we've already made our bed' and talk of temporary ceasefires didn't sound right given that this was Lukon. When Thorbjorn attempted to exile Actrial, Oritolon passed the point of no return, if she had not already.

Robin was the ringleader of the protests and ruckus. He basically rallied most of the younger nobles behind him. People that hadn't even been around for the war with Minas Thalion (and, crucially, to witness what a great friend Lukon could be). It really wasn't your usual suspects. I think Robin was a very active character behind the scenes who had probably been cultivating relationships with our younger nobles for a long while on the sly. In hindsight I think he seized upon Lukon's proposals as an opportunity to try and unseat Malice but it was bad timing as Malice felt he had to do everything he could to cling on in the circumstances. Maybe this is all Malice' fault for having such a poor relationship with such an ambitious fellow?

I suppose Malice could have become a ballsy Spearhead-type figure who would stop at nothing to deliver for our Lukon friends, but Malice is a survivor who has learned to change with the weather. He made a good fist of convincing Oritolon to back the empire but once it became obvious that Oritolon wouldn't do it or that the price would be too high in delivering it, he belatedly did what Oritolon really wanted and that was to start preparing for war. And now that the war is actually happening, I can't complain too much. It has been good fun. A nice change of pace!

I still expect that eventually Lukon will have the opportunity to get the empire off the ground (and I think it will be cracking when it does) but at least we're having a good time. I tell you though, I cringe every time our forces meet. Lukon bring a lot of soldiers to each battle. I think every engagement so far I have said 'we don't have enough men, this is going to be a disaster' but we've gotten through it. The Blinded God is clearly keeping an eye on us somehow :-P
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 12, 2013, 01:55:43 AM: Quote from: Valast on March 11, 2013, 05:19:02 PM
So your saying it was not all a stall tactic designed to keep Lukon waiting while militia was stockpiled?

That Malice was not stalling, Robin was not stalling? We were simply waiting for a vote of the people?

It was then unfortunate that the militia was being built up at the same time... as that was a key indicator that it was all a ruse to buy time for defense.
I have a feeling Valakyrie did not read Ash letters at all. Heh ;D
Ash was stating that Oritolon need a little bit of time for the referendum to conclude.

As this matter was long past point of no return, I gladly shared some of the events here.

Alebad city did not have militia prior to Lukon first attack. Its militia was hastily raised once it became clear to Oritolon that Lukon was being deadly serious. The Iglavik region militia was just barely enough to handle monsters/undead attacks. If that was what Lukon scout reports about Oritolon raising militia. Iglavik militia was raised by Priestess May, the latest Region Lord after Art Rowan went missing due to real life.

When Actrial the Marshal noticed too many priests(Blind God, Path of Chivalry and then later on, Shadowism priests) in Oritolon and requesting for them to become warriors, Actrial was reported to the Magistrate for IR violation. With too many priests, Oritolon has barely enough nobles head count for the army to fight off Lukon.

Quote from: Revan on March 12, 2013, 12:44:44 AM
Robin was the ringleader of the protests and ruckus. He basically rallied most of the younger nobles behind him. People that hadn't even been around for the war with Minas Thalion (and, crucially, to witness what a great friend Lukon could be). It really wasn't your usual suspects. I think Robin was a very active character behind the scenes who had probably been cultivating relationships with our younger nobles for a long while on the sly. In hindsight I think he seized upon Lukon's proposals as an opportunity to try and unseat Malice but it was bad timing as Malice felt he had to do everything he could to cling on in the circumstances. Maybe this is all Malice' fault for having such a poor relationship with such an ambitious fellow?

Ash already had an odd feeling that Robin had somehow been plotting behind the scene with others. It was long time ago when Ash was a Judge and caught Robin own brother who was in Minas Thalion during the Oritolon-Minas Thalion war. When his double-face whammy was discovered, he still dared to try weasel his way out by messaging both of us, me and our Judge Pyran at that time personally. Of course Pyran not that easy to fall for his bait and he informed Malice, our Prime Minister at that time. Being a proud loyal Oritolonian, Ash raised up this matter, included Queen Valakyrie letter as supporting evidence of Robin betrayal in the council.

Quote from: Revan on March 12, 2013, 12:44:44 AM
What happened with Thorbjorn later was, I think, a surprise for everybody. He campaigned for office saying he opposed the empire then suddenly became a supporter of it almost overnight. But by then there was a feeling in Oritolon of 'well, we've already made our bed' and talk of temporary ceasefires didn't sound right given that this was Lukon. When Thorbjorn attempted to exile Actrial, Oritolon passed the point of no return, if she had not already.
This is the part I will never understand. Thorbjorn at first opposed the empire, suddenly become empire supporter. When he exiled Actrial the decorated war veteran for looting Lukon lands, not many nobles supported his decision.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 12, 2013, 04:35:18 AM: Hmmm... do you think Thorbjorn is part of the Colonial Brotherhood? I know that group still exists... but not sure who all is in it other than Valakyrie's brother.

Ah well. I put a bit of pressure on Thorbjorn over the whole looting thing. Was not real fair to Thorbjorn hehe but I wanted to continue causing chaos in Oritolon thinking perhaps it would spur another uprising to bring about someone else I could try to talk into the Empire. I had no idea he would ban him...
..

As for the plans changing or becoming worked out more... that is because the whole goal of Empire was to bring everyone together to help create it. I had a basic outline but wanted everyone to have input. So I came to the rulers with the basics... then added my own thoughts to it as we went forward. By the time I was sending letters to Malice, I had already negotiated the return of the Dark Cit to the Assassins and also the idea of a senate (and guild houses) to lead the governing body...

I also over estimated how much people read on here... and suspected more comments on the idea.

IC dont forget that Valakyrie believes she is doing what is best for Oritolon and the Colonies. In her barbaric way she thinks that Oritolon not joining the Empire will result in OT or other realms going after Oritolon. After all Oritolon would not have the same protection as the Imperial nations. It could be destroyed.

ah well. We have months of war before this thing settles one way or another.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on March 13, 2013, 12:38:07 AM: Quote from: Valast on March 12, 2013, 04:35:18 AM
IC dont forget that Valakyrie believes she is doing what is best for Oritolon and the Colonies. In her barbaric way she thinks that Oritolon not joining the Empire will result in OT or other realms going after Oritolon. After all Oritolon would not have the same protection as the Imperial nations. It could be destroyed.

Really? My understanding was that realms in the Empire couldn't destroy any realms--whether they were in the empire or not. After all, that was the one rule that they have to abide by--no destroying realms.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 13, 2013, 02:01:13 AM: Quote from: egamma on March 13, 2013, 12:38:07 AM
Really? My understanding was that realms in the Empire couldn't destroy any realms--whether they were in the empire or not. After all, that was the one rule that they have to abide by--no destroying realms.

Realms of the Empire will not be allowed to destroy any realm of the Empire. Why would the Empire give a rogue nation any protection?
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 13, 2013, 03:45:11 AM: Quote from: Valast on March 13, 2013, 02:01:13 AM
Realms of the Empire will not be allowed to destroy any realm of the Empire. Why would the Empire give a rogue nation any protection?
That would be my understanding as well. Any realm outside the Empire will be destroyed by those realms already joined inside the Empire. In other word, submit to the Empire or die when all Empire realms coming after you :P
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on March 13, 2013, 07:01:11 AM: Quote from: Valast on March 13, 2013, 02:01:13 AM
Realms of the Empire will not be allowed to destroy any realm of the Empire. Why would the Empire give a rogue nation any protection?

...which is where the difference of opinion with Outer Tilog lies...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 14, 2013, 12:30:18 AM: The realms united would not destroy you... but the laws would not allow you to be protected if some of them wanted to. It would never have been a group effort on behalf of the empire.

BUT none of that matters because IC Val believes that OT would not have broken up its cities unless Oritolon did also. So...here we are.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 15, 2013, 03:21:23 PM: Oritolon is putting up a good fight! Well done!

Now the question is... can you keep it up! Going to be a good war.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 18, 2013, 01:25:34 AM: Quote from: Valast on March 14, 2013, 12:30:18 AM
The realms united would not destroy you... but the laws would not allow you to be protected if some of them wanted to. It would never have been a group effort on behalf of the empire.

BUT none of that matters because IC Val believes that OT would not have broken up its cities unless Oritolon did also. So...here we are.
A good belief you have there. So OT is trying to consume MT as fast as they could. Before Lukon-Ori war end... Heh ;D

Quote from: Valast on March 15, 2013, 03:21:23 PM
Oritolon is putting up a good fight! Well done!

Now the question is... can you keep it up! Going to be a good war.
Gimme money, Val and I promise to build a presidential palace in your name :P
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: feyeleanor on March 18, 2013, 01:47:10 AM: Quote from: Ketchum on March 18, 2013, 01:25:34 AM
A good belief you have there. So OT is trying to consume MT as fast as they could. Before Lukon-Ori war end... Heh ;D

Given how little of MT there is to consume, they're taking their bloody time ::) Unless this is all some cunning ploy to play down their potential threat level whilst preparing to swoop in from the wings and establish their own empire on the bloodied remains of Lukon and Oritolon. It would explain why Khain keeps skulking around our lands faking severe mental impairment...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on March 18, 2013, 06:59:12 PM: Quote from: Ketchum on March 18, 2013, 01:25:34 AM
A good belief you have there. So OT is trying to consume MT as fast as they could.

There's not really much to consume is there... Just taking occasional nibbles. We don't want the land, just want to be rid of the realm :)
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on March 20, 2013, 01:05:46 AM: There goes any possibility of long term fun and battles.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Penchant on March 20, 2013, 01:14:39 AM: Quote from: Kai on March 20, 2013, 01:05:46 AM
There goes any possibility of long term fun and battles.
What happened?
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on March 20, 2013, 01:24:47 AM: An alliance was forged (6 hours, 17 minutes ago)
The realms of Outer Tilog and Lukon have joined into an alliance.

Not the happiest news I've heard this week!
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on March 20, 2013, 07:09:47 AM: What I really like about the forums is that no one jumps to conclusions or makes assumptions before finding out actual reasons for events...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on March 20, 2013, 08:02:08 AM: I don't think I've ever been pleasantly surprised at how people play this game before.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 20, 2013, 02:28:23 PM: If that is the case, bring it on! 8)

It is not like all my characters never face such odds before. Wont be the first time.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 20, 2013, 03:59:57 PM: People amaze me some times. Not always in a good way.

What everyone is assuming is that the alliance is a unified effort in the current war between Lukon and Oritolon. Why would anyone think that considering there has been no discussion about it anywhere? Paranoia and narcissism?

Think for a moment from the view point of someone else... Lukon is trying to build something based off of the foundations which Outer Tilog have wanted for some time. Just like OT wants BBQ of many flavors...Lukon thrives on war... both of which have dwindled over time as the Colonies have come to where they are today. So OT has the idea of "hey lets all get back to roots so we can eat" Lukon has the idea of "hey lets get back to roots so we can have more war and more fun"....

So I have the idea of "hey lets do this right and provide a lasting structure to help keep this going so we do not end up right back here again."

So... Lukon and OT have the same end goal in mind and that makes perfect sense to unite them and any other realm who is on board (depending on the reclassifying of MT as a dwarf realm perhaps...lol sorry Fey, Val will do what she can)...

In other words, the Colonies are uniting without Oritolon because ONLY Oritolon has chosen not to. It wont stop the war but it does not mean any other realm is coming to fight in it....then again it does not mean they will not either. All it means is that Oritolon is loosing out on any say in the founding of what ever structure we end up creating for the Colonies.

Ortitolon will make themselves into an outcast who will one day find themselves wishing they had thought things through long term rather than acting on pride.

Then again... maybe you will destroy Lukon in the war. Then congratulations... you will have prolonged the boredom of the rest of the Colonies while placing your selves in the same position as Lukon.... which frankly is a position where you come to terms with your player responsibility to help make the game fun for others and your self. Now balance that with the effort to do it in a way that your character would.

Feel free to tremble in fear of seeing alliances made... but sheesh dont jump to conclusions. If you have a question ask it... or better yet get to the bottom of it IC.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on March 20, 2013, 04:07:02 PM: Quote from: Ketchum on March 20, 2013, 02:28:23 PM
If that is the case, bring it on! 8)

It is not like all my characters never face such odds before. Wont be the first time.

You are aware of the military prowess of Outer Tilog aren't you?
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on March 20, 2013, 06:05:25 PM: Hehe, Oritolon is good at over-reacting though. Just look at how we ended up in this war in the first place ;-) Either way, still probably a bad development for Oritolon. The cosier it gets between Lukon and everybody else, the harder it's going to be for Oritolon to carve her way out of this empire.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on March 20, 2013, 06:17:19 PM: Quote from: Revan on March 20, 2013, 06:05:25 PM
Hehe, Oritolon is good at over-reacting though. Just look at how we ended up in this war in the first place ;-) Either way, still probably a bad development for Oritolon. The cosier it gets between Lukon and everybody else, the harder it's going to be for Oritolon to carve her way out of this empire.

Stop calling it an Empire!!! :)
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on March 21, 2013, 12:04:39 AM: MT and Ass are only quasirealms so OT is the only one having boredom. 2/3 of the Colonies is atm interesting which is better than it has been in ages.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 21, 2013, 01:24:50 AM: Quote from: Revan on March 20, 2013, 06:05:25 PM
Hehe, Oritolon is good at over-reacting though. Just look at how we ended up in this war in the first place ;-) Either way, still probably a bad development for Oritolon. The cosier it gets between Lukon and everybody else, the harder it's going to be for Oritolon to carve her way out of this empire.
I think quick reaction saved us countless times in the past. When the ground is moving, we not waiting for it to happen. Better be safe than sorry later. Prevention is a better cure ;)

I agree about your second part. It is harder if only Oritolon against the whole Colonies world realms. By the way, Minas Thalion and Assassins, will have to follow and abide Lukon realm for fear of being destroyed if they not. If this goes on, I will not be surprise if OT help either Lukon or Oritolon. For one, Portion city is now open to attack while Lukon army is marching to Oritolon. *Hint hint* ::)
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on March 21, 2013, 03:42:19 PM: LoL... when did OT get military prowess...and who did they steal it from!?!

The Assassins will join the Unified Colonial Federation (seriously...wth should this be called) because they get their city back and a chance to recreate themselves back closer to what the Guild originally was...a realm of Assassins. Laws created to keep Infiltrators on the Island will make them a powerful nation.

MT...well...if they make it... will be a wild card. I have no idea what they will become but I would guess a religious holy site of some sort :P stupid shadowists. BUT that is a big IF because they are in a race for time between OT taking them out and Lukon/Oritolon war ending so that the Empire can be started while they are still around. The biggest gain for them is well...existence followed by religious freedom at a realm level. Lords and Ladies can still do what they want with priests but realms are going to be held back (if i can get that passed through the senate...when there is a senate). This will make the Colonies a cool place for priests and infiltrators to play.... and help bring excitement to a personal level rather than a realm to realm level...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on March 21, 2013, 06:45:22 PM: Quote from: Valast on March 21, 2013, 03:42:19 PM
The Assassins will join the Unified Colonial Federation (seriously...wth should this be called)

I always thought it should take inspiration from one of the three Colonies regions we can't visit. That way it is a neutral name but it also give the whole thing a more entrenched Colonies identity than if we just came up with something at random. We could have a Confederation of the Arakir, the Arak League, Lendan Empire or some such. You could even cheekily draw parallels with what ~~your~~ you're trying to achieve and how the Lich King acted to prevent the destruction of Outer Tilog all those years ago!

Edit: Awful.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on March 21, 2013, 10:52:55 PM: The Imaginary Empire of Lukon

Empire of Arakis
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on March 25, 2013, 04:19:41 AM: Quote from: James on March 20, 2013, 06:17:19 PM
Stop calling it an Empire!!! :)

"The thing we were told we had to join but we refuse to join" just takes too much typing. ;D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: feyeleanor on March 26, 2013, 11:54:29 AM: If MT survives then my aim is to make it a safe haven for priests of all religions, and Cathal will probably reestablish the Church Militant to act as spiritual guardians of the Empire. Those are both projects we can pursue without any particular need for a city ;D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 27, 2013, 12:47:03 AM: Quote from: feyeleanor on March 26, 2013, 11:54:29 AM
If MT survives then my aim is to make it a safe haven for priests of all religions, and Cathal will probably reestablish the Church Militant to act as spiritual guardians of the Empire. Those are both projects we can pursue without any particular need for a city ;D
But you need capital, right? ;)

Let us call this Empire of the Lich King.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: feyeleanor on March 27, 2013, 10:12:25 AM: Quote from: Ketchum on March 27, 2013, 12:47:03 AM
But you need capital, right? ;)

We've managed without one for almost a year now so I don't see why we need a capital. :o
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 27, 2013, 10:18:54 AM: Quote from: feyeleanor on March 27, 2013, 10:12:25 AM
We've managed without one for almost a year now so I don't see why we need a capital. :o
Unable to cash bond, can be a headache. Wish I do play at such interesting realms 8)

By the way, the temples do not require gold to maintain?? Got goodwill donater out there? ???
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Psyche on March 28, 2013, 07:50:28 AM: You really only get bonds from transfers, being out of the realm on tax day, and selling food. With no banks, transfers aren't an issue. With so few nobles and troops, being out of the realm should hardly an issue. With their only region being mountains that are more or less self-sufficient, food sales aren't an issue, and purchasing extra food can be done by camping past the border on tax day to get bonds.

You can still shuffle gold in guilds/temples.

I do hope that the long ago mentioned possible estate buildings do come to play one day. One that spoils be awesome in such cases would be a bank, or recruitment building.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 28, 2013, 08:26:37 AM: Quote from: feyeleanor on March 27, 2013, 10:12:25 AM
We've managed without one for almost a year now so I don't see why we need a capital. :o
Should Oritolon lose Alebad city, I think MT realm can consider settle down at their old capital once again. When Ash was a Judge, Robin brother in MT did message Ash to request capital transfer as some sort of good will. Not gonna happen with Ash around, anyone who know Ash, he is too loyal for his own good.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on March 28, 2013, 09:41:33 AM: Back to Oritolon vs Lukon war. Seems a lot Lukon players not able login due to DNS issue, and Oritolon not taking advantage much. Vir el Mari Heights and Padaost are as good as gone rogue from Lukon hand due to recent Oritolon attacks earlier. Good gamesmanship here, yes? :D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on April 01, 2013, 09:01:13 PM: Yep. Seemed that anyone who could issue any orders were out for a day or two. Good timing for Easter I suppose. We are all back in action now!
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on April 02, 2013, 05:06:50 AM: The war is coming back. Lukon will strike again. Same thing with Oritolon, this war is becoming war of attrition, whoever can last longer ::)

Someone really should go create Outer Tilog vs Minas Thalion war thread. Finally OT overcome MT, and they really take their sweet time doing so, considering they are much bigger and with more resources than MT. Now if only RTO is not having bug at the moment, MT would bounce back mightily, keeping my fingers crossed 8)
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: feyeleanor on April 14, 2013, 04:38:23 AM: MT has served it's purpose, time to move on ;D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on April 15, 2013, 02:39:54 AM: Quote from: feyeleanor on April 14, 2013, 04:38:23 AM
MT has served it's purpose, time to move on ;D
No... Life without capital is hard. What's next now? Come join us ;D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on April 15, 2013, 06:50:34 AM: You should join Lukon, they need a hand.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on April 15, 2013, 03:27:26 PM: Region Lost (8 hours, 11 minutes ago)
A peasant uprising caused by religious fanaticism of believers in Shadowism has overthrown the regional lord of Vir el Mari heights in a bloody revolt. 277 pesants died, but the leader of the uprising, Innocent Noble, Knight of Alowca, Priest of Shadowism has been proclaimed as the new lord, and the region has become a part of Oritolon.

lol... the irony is the elephant in the room these days... Oritolon has stooped so so low. Going from a realm against the priests to being a realm dependent on them. Those priests being the former infiltrators who Oritolon despised... Just cant make this stuff up lol
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on April 15, 2013, 07:08:50 PM: Of course, thanks to a bug, it didn't actually happen.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on April 15, 2013, 10:23:15 PM: Eh it will go soon enough tho... and you guys dident really want to feed it anyway after looting it did ya?
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on April 16, 2013, 01:45:07 AM: Quote from: Valast on April 15, 2013, 03:27:26 PM
Region Lost (8 hours, 11 minutes ago)
A peasant uprising caused by religious fanaticism of believers in Shadowism has overthrown the regional lord of Vir el Mari heights in a bloody revolt. 277 pesants died, but the leader of the uprising, Innocent Noble, Knight of Alowca, Priest of Shadowism has been proclaimed as the new lord, and the region has become a part of Oritolon.

lol... the irony is the elephant in the room these days... Oritolon has stooped so so low. Going from a realm against the priests to being a realm dependent on them. Those priests being the former infiltrators who Oritolon despised... Just cant make this stuff up lol

Quote from: Valast on April 15, 2013, 10:23:15 PM
Eh it will go soon enough tho... and you guys dident really want to feed it anyway after looting it did ya?

I think you can put two and two together.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on April 18, 2013, 08:38:47 AM: Quote from: Valast on April 15, 2013, 03:27:26 PM
Region Lost (8 hours, 11 minutes ago)
A peasant uprising caused by religious fanaticism of believers in Shadowism has overthrown the regional lord of Vir el Mari heights in a bloody revolt. 277 pesants died, but the leader of the uprising, Innocent Noble, Knight of Alowca, Priest of Shadowism has been proclaimed as the new lord, and the region has become a part of Oritolon.

lol... the irony is the elephant in the room these days... Oritolon has stooped so so low. Going from a realm against the priests to being a realm dependent on them. Those priests being the former infiltrators who Oritolon despised... Just cant make this stuff up lol
You and I going have a good laugh down the road when looking back at all these events. The decision by a few shape many in the future.
When my character Ash as Judge allows the first religion(Blind God) to be founded in Oritolon in addition to Path of Chivalry religion, he does not anticipate in future that all religions will come here. Since then, it is religion freedom allowed in Oritolon 8)
Hey, I thought I told Innocent that RTO is bugged before he attempt this ;)

Quote from: Valast on April 15, 2013, 10:23:15 PM
Eh it will go soon enough tho... and you guys dident really want to feed it anyway after looting it did ya?
Shhh, that is strategy ;D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on April 18, 2013, 04:10:40 PM: Maybe our strategy is to leave a wall of starving regions between Oritolon and Lukon, so that Lukon's armies cant reach us.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on May 09, 2013, 09:57:24 AM: Nothing much happening, no battle. We have a staring match, looking to see who has a bigger abs perhaps :D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Eduardo Almighty on June 01, 2013, 05:11:41 PM: I must say... Lukon is very boring. I have a new char there for one week without a single order to march. I can understand 1 turn per day, but one battle per month!? Time to seek another realm/continent.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Wolfsong on June 05, 2013, 04:20:04 AM: Pretty sure that's the Colonies in general.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on June 06, 2013, 05:07:51 AM: Colonies is a slow moving island, for those players who prefer slow pace game. Especially older players, or the young one who wish to learn the game rope slowly. Most of the time, those unwanted infiltrators and banned ones at that, got deported here as well, which bring a lot of intriguing as they will leave after stabbing someone or two.

Next up, seems war gotten pretty slow. Many of the characters must have been old wars veteran at one point or another, which could explain the slow travel times and less hours the characters get each turn.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on June 06, 2013, 11:37:24 PM: Problem is units are bigger these days because of more money (all those carrots stacking up from estate system changes) and less players.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on June 07, 2013, 08:07:39 PM: This will change in a bit. Lukon wants more wars too. So we are working to make it happen. Dumb old stinky Oritolon is all noooo we are greedy and want to win...

LoL just kidding guys. but we will see some changes coming! Should provide for a faster paced world once Oritolon is subjected...errr I mean talked into it.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on June 13, 2013, 05:09:20 AM: For those keeping track, one of Lukon Townsland city, Padaost city is driven rogue by Oritolon army recently. Lukon has refitted and is on their way to the frontline...... to be continue...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on June 13, 2013, 05:26:51 PM: Quote from: Valast on June 07, 2013, 08:07:39 PM
This will change in a bit. Lukon wants more wars too. So we are working to make it happen. Dumb old stinky Oritolon is all noooo we are greedy and want to win...

Don't be silly, Oritolon and Lukon are in a war. Doesn't that count? And it's 3 cities versus 3 cities, so it's a pretty even match.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on June 14, 2013, 02:33:07 PM: Although I was all in favour of Empire to begin with, I have to say this war has been jolly good fun so far. Certainly made things more interesting in Oritolon at any rate. And no more political infighting either! There appears to be some kind of unspoken truce whilst we deal with the barbarian hordes.

It does seem like Lukon has lost a bit of puff recently. The war seems to be going marginally in Oritolon's favour for the moment. It'll be interesting to see how things develop from here.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Jaden on June 14, 2013, 06:09:05 PM: What is going on in the North, i thought the Tilogians would have join in by now, they are missing all the fun...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on June 15, 2013, 04:55:41 AM: Quote from: Jaron on June 14, 2013, 06:09:05 PM
What is going on in the North, i thought the Tilogians would have join in by now, they are missing all the fun...

Perhaps you are mistaken as to which side they will really join?
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Jaden on June 15, 2013, 07:18:01 AM: well if the Tilogians join in with Oritolon then we win.. if they join in with Lukon, then more heads for headball... all is good.. :D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on June 17, 2013, 07:35:24 PM: If OT wishes to win the war for Oritolon... they would just have to say so. Perhaps they will in the end...but you must remember that the idea of a city state Colonies began with OT... Lukon has added some other things to the idea such as an agreement preventing the taking of more than once city by a nation... Infiltrator agreements such as standard prices they can pay to lift a ban (in the hopes of keeping more nobles in the colonies)... religious agreements (putting it to the priests to fight it out instead of acts against nations)...

So who knows... Only OT knows.

As for the war its self... One blunder after another. Lukon built its self up on precise moves and agility with its armies... but none of that has been seen thus far. Our military has looked more like an old man picking up his sword after years in retirement. All the knowledge and skills ready but all stiff and unable to move.

But... things are changing now. It has taken a bit for the rust to fall off... but big changes in Lukon taking place.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on June 17, 2013, 08:41:49 PM: Quote from: Valast on June 17, 2013, 07:35:24 PM
But... things are changing now. It has taken a bit for the rust to fall off... but big changes in Lukon taking place.

Like...running low on your stockpile of gold?
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on June 18, 2013, 03:35:44 AM: Quote from: Revan on June 14, 2013, 02:33:07 PM
Although I was all in favour of Empire to begin with, I have to say this war has been jolly good fun so far. Certainly made things more interesting in Oritolon at any rate. And no more political infighting either! There appears to be some kind of unspoken truce whilst we deal with the barbarian hordes.

It does seem like Lukon has lost a bit of puff recently. The war seems to be going marginally in Oritolon's favour for the moment. It'll be interesting to see how things develop from here.
Oritolon politics sometime amaze me. I think the saying "Enemy of my enemy is my friend" aptly describe our internal stuff. When we have a common enemy, we will put aside all our differences. Together we are one :D

If Lukon cheerful Judge, Blackbeard is still here and witness this war, he would have say jollily. "Puff, here we go again". He did warn Ash this would come to pass after all :o

Quote from: Jaron on June 15, 2013, 07:18:01 AM
well if the Tilogians join in with Oritolon then we win.. if they join in with Lukon, then more heads for headball... all is good.. :D
About OT, they seems to be making all the changes according to their liking up north: MT demise. They will find a new realm north soon. Or they could join in the war for a change. Or could it be OT is waiting for the victor of this war to attack the victorious realm and become ugh!... Colonies new biggest realm. Since either Orit or Lukon are bound to be weaken by this war after this no matter which side win. There are so many possibilities :P
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on June 18, 2013, 07:44:51 PM: Quote from: egamma on June 17, 2013, 08:41:49 PM
Like...running low on your stockpile of gold?

LOL You should always take what Robin tells you with a grain of salt. Two bits of misinformation were taking place while Robin spent such a short time in Lukon...

1. I made sure he thought we were going to assault Alebad city... by easily making sure he could see the orders being given while excluding him on the real orders...
2. The view that Lukon is hurting for funds. Truth is we operate differently than most realms when it comes to economics. Everyone has a consistent income but all excess flows up the chain of command to the Duchesses and Ruler. We call it the "Slush Fund" and have had it in operation for 8 years or so. It basically means that any time we go to recruit we have the Duchesses or Ruler handing out the funds to everyone who asks. In this special case, having Robin as a guest for a week, we made sure to act out a bit.

But no...the big changes I referred to is the stepping down of Ares. The player of Ares has been trying to run the war while his life has been busy and crazy. He has only been able to log in every few days so thought it best step down after a bit of infighting cropped up over the mounting military losses.

Whom will lead the army of Lukon next? Stay tuned!
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on June 19, 2013, 02:47:40 AM: Quote from: Valast on June 18, 2013, 07:44:51 PM
*Bit of what my characters dont know*
As player OOC, I do know Lukon has "Slush Fund". The misinformation Lukon done is pretty good.

As characters IG, Ash and May dont know. Especially May, as she not a woman of war, she dislike war and politic. Good to know on forum that Lukon is still doing fine, despite whatever Oritolon done. After all, Lukon is a big force to be reckon with. Would be disappointed if Lukon does not live up to our expectation :P

Speaking from May perspective. She dislike war and politic. This is due to her past experience on EC island. The very main reason why she became a religion priestess in the first place. She wont run for Oritolon Judge until Malice requests her to do so(Thank you Revan) ;)

As for Ash. Personally Ash dislike Robin and will take everything Robin says with a pinch of salt. Considering Queen Valakyrie of Lukon did help Ash to get out the Robin true intention in the past. Before the war. Coupled with Robin self-initiated Lords Referendum to remove Ash Ambassador title, it really does not pay much to understand why Ash dislike Robin. As a fellow politician, Ash does respect Robin on certain things while disagree on other things 8)

About Ares, Lukon's God of War. I am sad to hear he going to step down from General. As a young Warrior, Ash has heard a lot of Ares stories, legends :(
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on June 19, 2013, 03:05:20 AM: Ya... I hope Ares sticks around. If so he will be General again I am sure. He is just working hard at the moment.

Lukon is NOT doing find tho. Oh man we are struggling. I mean we are not falling apart at the seams or anything like that... and the regions that have been lost are just fluff. We could loose Vir, Bode and Rola also and still be sitting find with food and gold. No our problem is that we have done so well for so long...and so well at politics of fear and power for so long...that no one remembers how to fight! lol... We had a huge army that would have finally removed the blockage in Iglawhatsit and we ended up fowling up the move so that we hit in 3 or 4 waves :-P such basic mistakes like that.

Part of it was game mechanics... Part of it was character age... and part of it is just the fact that players have been able to chill out for so long that everyone was only half paying attention or too busy in RL and not reading all the messages or logging in. Not much anyone can do about that. I mean for a while Lukon was able to start and end wars just by acting diplomatically...

So the sword of Lukon was rusty. Now tempered in blood. :) Should be a much better war from here out.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on June 19, 2013, 04:01:43 AM: We still don't trust Robin--we basically encouraged him to defect to OT to get rid of him. Meanwhile, he thinks that he's our greatest friend, and sends him whatever information he can get--although we don't rely on that information, knowing that sending two sets of orders is a common practice whenever someone untrustworthy is around.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on June 19, 2013, 01:53:05 PM: Quote from: Valast on June 17, 2013, 07:35:24 PM
As for the war its self... One blunder after another. Lukon built its self up on precise moves and agility with its armies... but none of that has been seen thus far. Our military has looked more like an old man picking up his sword after years in retirement. All the knowledge and skills ready but all stiff and unable to move.

But... things are changing now. It has taken a bit for the rust to fall off... but big changes in Lukon taking place.

Ironically, after many years of Oritolon building a reputation as a shambolic military power that could barely hold herself together, Oritolon is now a force to be reckoned with. Never thought I'd see the day when Oritolon had one of the best run armies on the Colonies :-P
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on June 20, 2013, 12:24:55 AM: Quote from: Revan on June 19, 2013, 01:53:05 PM
Ironically, after many years of Oritolon building a reputation as a shambolic military power that could barely hold herself together, Oritolon is now a force to be reckoned with. Never thought I'd see the day when Oritolon had one of the best run armies on the Colonies :-P

It's because the best players from Giblot, Wetham, and the Assassins have joined Oritolon. Lukon has spent 6 years distilling its enemies into one realm.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on June 20, 2013, 01:49:51 AM: Amazing huh? lol... Had I known ALL Lukons enemies from the last decade would be invited into Oritolon I may have not tried so hard to prevent a few rebellions or radical leaders.

*sigh*
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on June 20, 2013, 02:40:56 AM: Quote from: Valast on June 20, 2013, 01:49:51 AM
Amazing huh? lol... Had I known ALL Lukons enemies from the last decade would be invited into Oritolon I may have not tried so hard to prevent a few rebellions or radical leaders.

*sigh*
This is the best chance to wipe out all your enemies as they gather in one place. Ahem 8)

Still you should really blame Oritolon Judges for allowing them in, in the first place. *Hint hint*

Military statistics wise, Oritolon has more CS than Lukon today. Wow ;D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on June 20, 2013, 03:10:47 PM: Quote from: Ketchum on June 20, 2013, 02:40:56 AM
This is the best chance to wipe out all your enemies as they gather in one place. Ahem 8)

They'd all just move to Outer Tilog and take the realm over by democracy, and THEN Lukon will really be in trouble!
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on June 21, 2013, 07:56:08 PM: Die hard enemies of Lukon were a very important tool for the Hendrix family. I would never know for sure where they would go next but I knew they would go somewhere...I needed them to go somewhere. After all the only way Lukon could remain in power was to be perceived as having great power and influence...but also be seen as giving and caring. One way to do this was to try and find the internal conflicts going on in other realms. This was never a big problem because one side or the other would always let slip of a political crack I could open wider.

So if the energetic enemy from realm one moves to a realm which I had good relations with... it was a traveling antagonist. Innocent is a good example. I know where ever he would go, he would stand against Lukon interests. So I promised Wetham to the Assassins...then when Innocent took it over I had reason for conflict to keep Lukon busy and reclaim that city as our own.

The same could be said for MT in Alebad. When MT was founded it was done so by putting people in it that we did not want in Oritolon or Lukon. It was a sort of exile without actually telling everyone they were exiled. So I already knew it would become a focal point later on...one that would draw out any hidden enemies and contain some of the known ones.

So yes... if OT were taken over by numbers that would be bad. Then again we are talking about the colonies here. You would have to take nobles from Oritolon and put them in OT... then Oritolon would be less defended.

Anyway. Lukon will be a new army soon. Just polishing the last of the rust off at the moment. Oritolon will fall and then we will help raise it up as a Southern Empire to join into the Colonial Federation.

Then Lukon can break apart... OT seperates from Giblot... and we are off and running.

I envision Wetham wanting land from Portion... Lukon wanting to raid OT... Alebad in a food war with Giblot... All sorts of great things. Meanwhile Infiltrators are encouraged...because they can pay off bans in order to continue growing strong in the colonies rather than being deported all the time. Priests can begin priestly wars without the interference of government (direct military interference that is)... Realms will join into empires or federations...all while remaining under the umbrella of Colonial Federation which is governed by senators from every realm.

In the future some realms will likely break off from the federation and we will see huge wars from it all... but first... Ortiolon must crumble.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kwanstein on June 22, 2013, 09:35:34 PM: I think that you are all overlooking a very obvious advantage that Oritolon has, which is it's city on the front line, Alebad. The advantages it offers are great, so it comes as no surprise to me that Lukon has been unable to break Oritolon. In order to assail such a defensive position, Lukon would have had to field an army about twice as large as Oritolon's, an unlikely feat.

Perhaps player activity had something to do with it as well, but I think that the key to Oritolon's success has to do with the strategic position it finds itself in.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on June 24, 2013, 07:41:03 AM: War will be stalemate until OT joins with Lukon and then Oritolon will obviously lose because battlemaster is about ganking to end wars ASAP and get back to peace-fun.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on June 25, 2013, 08:09:47 PM: Quote from: Kai on June 24, 2013, 07:41:03 AM
...because battlemaster is about ganking to end wars ASAP and get back to peace-fun.

What are you talking about? If everything in the Colonies goes the way some are trying to take it then there will be a lot of action and the future there will be great.

Sounds a bit like a pre-emptive OOC moan to try to get people to change their minds IC about their intended actions...
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Wolfsong on June 26, 2013, 02:34:32 AM: Lukon: We're reorganizing, it'll be great and we'll beat your faces in! We're getting new leadership!

...

Lukon's New General: Hey everybody, let's do this.
Lukon's New King, Aka the Old General: Ignore the General, I now control the military! Do this instead!

It's kind of amusing... We had a turnover in leadership to stop what we had been doing, but the new leadership wants to go straight back to what we were doing before.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on June 26, 2013, 11:00:42 AM: City states are absurd.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Jaden on June 26, 2013, 01:38:46 PM: The colonies were all city states until Lukon started to win :P....
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on June 26, 2013, 07:40:28 PM: Quote from: Wolfsong on June 26, 2013, 02:34:32 AM
It's kind of amusing... We had a turnover in leadership to stop what we had been doing, but the new leadership wants to go straight back to what we were doing before.

What we were doing... was not getting people interested in playing the game because of the long periods of nothing between events. Suddenly we are at war and many players who have been skimming messages for months have not been paying attention. That is how we could have CS advantage and end up loosing the battles due to arriving in 3 separate waves...people not caring.

What you fail to think about is that Lukon has won war after war with tactics that are different than everyone else. We have always fought that way because its what barbarians do. Now the new General has some good ideas...but does not have the political clout to make big changes yet. This is a social game after all.

Now with the change in leadership, people are paying more attention. The whole thing riled some people up and they have renewed interest in the game again....

Hmm... For those of you who thing the entire city state idea is "absurd" should consider the actions taken in Lukon to revive the attention of its nobles and put the idea into a larger scale. That is what you have...a rejuvenation of the Colonies but in a way that allows for the story progression to continue in a real way which is important to me.

Now I expect the entire thing to dissolve into anarchy... but hope some of the effects will be long lasting such as letting priests and infiltrators do their thing without too much national threat against them. This will help boost noble population. The Colonies only has about 110 active characters, 9 of those being adventurers...I know at least 10 players in Lukon who have two in the Colonies...When you consider that it is very telling.

Lukon killed the Colonies. We did not do anything wrong and I would not change it...but its true. Now it will be repaired. *shrug* If you want it stopped IC... then stop it IC. If you dont like it OOC... time to deal with disappointment.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on July 26, 2013, 02:21:22 AM: Peace Lukon and Oritolon? Will it happen? :D
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on July 26, 2013, 04:01:04 PM: Hmm it may happen but I doubt we will see it while Oritolon still thinks they are winning the war...Lukon is too proud to make peace while perception shows them to be loosing.

Besides that Lukon leaders know how this works... they will be asked to give up all sorts of things for peace... lands gold food status. Lukon wont surrender.

Perhaps they will find a common ground for a neutral stance between the two realms... but I do not think we will see anything like that until Oritolon realizes they do not have things under control as much as they think.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on July 26, 2013, 06:40:54 PM: Yeah cause when you get into serious trouble you'll get everyone to gank Oritolon and that will be so much fun.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: SaDiablo on July 26, 2013, 08:00:45 PM: Peace can always happen but the cost has no bearing if the island stays stuck at 3 realms... assassins doesn't count really.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on July 26, 2013, 11:21:57 PM: Kai, Oritolon has needed and Asked Lukon to step into its wars... multiple times with Alebad and Alowca... more recently with MT... and a few times with Oritolon Rulers who were going off base from what the majority of the realm wanted (not to mention a clan or two trying to take over)... I do not believe accusing Lukon of "ganking" will accomplish much more than returned fingers pointing in Oritolons direction.

It is a game of politics as much as it is a game of battle. That part of the game has been dominated by Lukon for a long time also... now a chance to balance both aspects is on the table and Oritolon fights against it. Thats great and cool, more power to them playing how they play... but any accusation of "ganking" is really just a whine about not being on the winning side of politics.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on July 27, 2013, 06:42:45 AM: Quote from: Valast on July 26, 2013, 11:21:57 PM
but any accusation of "ganking" is really just a whine about not being on the winning side of politics.

But is a 3-on-1 war really "playing with friends"? If you were playing, say, Risk, with 4 friends, would you feel totally fine about getting two of your friends to gang up on the odd-man-out?

In character, yes, it's all politics, and/or Lukon threatening/bullying/bribing the other realms to do its' bidding. Out of Character, you still have the social contract to consider. No, I'm not threatening you, I'm merely asking you to go read the Social Contract, think about how you play, and how your actions effect others, and then do what seems right.

I urge you to leave the war as a 3-city-realm versus 3-city-realm affair. I think it's been a lot of fun so far, but the amount of fun would drop considerably if you just brought in the other realms.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Jaden on July 27, 2013, 10:02:49 AM: Although I am in Oritolon, but I don't see a 1v1 war going anywhere actually unless one side just gives up or the players lose interest..
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kwanstein on July 27, 2013, 10:45:22 AM: Risk is nothing but king of the hill.

And the current war, as Jaron says, is not going anywhere. The realms are about the same size, so there cannot be a clean-cut victory. Gold no longer serves a functional purpose, so there cannot be victory through attrition. The realms are left fumbling with each other for eternity.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Revan on July 27, 2013, 12:52:56 PM: I think Lukon pulling others in to help them is fair enough. For a long, long time Oritolon kept to herself in the south, bickering and squabbling and ignoring the rest of the continent. Even if Lukon has occasionally put the boot into Outer Tilog and the Assassins when it has suited them, they've always maintained links and relations and had some sort of a relationship. Oritolon hasn't. If the war does end up 3vs1 it will be due to a long term weakness and failure on our own part I think. We can't have too many complaints.

Quote from: egamma on July 27, 2013, 06:42:45 AM
But is a 3-on-1 war really "playing with friends"? If you were playing, say, Risk, with 4 friends, would you feel totally fine about getting two of your friends to gang up on the odd-man-out?

Ironically, I was playing Risk last night and got absolutely schooled after two of my opponents formed an alliance against me. What I found myself ruing though is not that they had aligned against me but that I hadn't managed to form an alliance with one of them myself!
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Kai on July 27, 2013, 01:42:01 PM: Well if they are better OOC friends you never had a chance to begin with. It was pretty amusing to play WI with a friend and kill people, who apparently just need to make alliances before my birth or something.

In the long past Lukon/Oritolon vs Alebad Alowca and northstuff was even. Anything past that is bull!@#$ with multiaccs/MT.

Hey I remember some guy from OT saying that they had no intention to join in the war but that seems to have been deleted which is comforting.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Valast on July 29, 2013, 10:14:14 PM: If I were playing a board game with friends I would show no mercy. In fact at my house we do not 'let' the children win at games... We help them understand how to play and what options they have but in the end it is a game with rules and strategy...and not everyone can win. I am fully comfortable with the way I play Battlemaster. I have also evolved away from caring much for what others think of how I play the game... I learned that lesson in the first year of playing.

I will not change direction because of a difference in view on what fair play is. In my view I am playing well with others... including those from the Assassins and OT... also using my influence in character to provide a future for the nobles in my realm aka the players... just because I am working to force that future on the entire island does not mean it is not fair play or unfriendly.

That goal may never come about... or it may come about without my character anywhere near the final results but if that happens it will be because of player action and not because my ooc mind was changed.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Velax on July 30, 2013, 11:43:16 PM: Tone down the hostility, Kai.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: Ketchum on July 31, 2013, 03:04:12 AM: Maybe we will get to see a toned-down Empire happening after all. A revised version. There are discussion going on...... It is only a matter of time.

Quote
Oritolon has needed and Asked Lukon to step into its wars... multiple times with Alebad and Alowca... more recently with MT... and a few times with Oritolon Rulers who were going off base from what the majority of the realm wanted (not to mention a clan or two trying to take over)...
I do agree with Valast on the part above. At most times, Oritolon has been instable internally. Its military is not that good in all the wars up until this current war with Lukon. I still remember we have a hard time to field even enough military to kill off those Khain and his rogue force which had been harassing our realm borders. Our small force was even defeated, humiliated is an understatement. By the time war with MT, our military started to lose Alowca duchy regions until Lukon stepped in. In fact, I agree Lukon did a lot of hard work back then :)

Maybe Republic system does not work out well for Oritolon realm. As the frequent elections have seen either a group of players with hidden agenda trying to takeover, or even elections won by those who were quiet and without any so-called declared campaigns.
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: James on July 31, 2013, 07:04:31 AM: Outer Tilog has been very clear in game and in character about what it wants from all of this and is certainly not pressured or swayed into anything we choose to do... I think the comment I gave was along the lines of hoping not to get involved in the war because Oritolon would have done the sensible thing by then (Outer Tilog were committed to removing Minas and then doing some land exchanges with the Assasssins first...)
Title: Re: Lukon vs Oritolon
Post by: egamma on July 31, 2013, 07:43:46 PM: Insulting posts (and responses) removed.

If you don't like Lukon, go play on another continent. I've played with the Hendrix family on FEI and they're actually quite decent; I've played with the non-Lukon Hendrixes as well and had the same experience.