| Summary: | Realm Merger of Tara and Coria |
| Violation: | Realm Mergers are prohibited |
| World: | Atamara |
| Complainer: | TH (http://battlemaster.org/UserDetails.php?ID=26113) |
| About: | James White (http://battlemaster.org/UserDetails.php?ID=26293) |
Honestly, when it's just 2 regions and not even a city, is there really any notion of a 'realm' merger? Coria didn't even have a capital, so IMHO it wasn't even a realm anymore.
Honestly, when it's just 2 regions and not even a city, is there really any notion of a 'realm' merger? Coria didn't even have a capital, so IMHO it wasn't even a realm anymore.
In addition, Lothruin revolted and joined Tara; it wasn't an action intentionally undertaken by the lord of Lothruin, but a result of game mechanics.
In that case, why does the game continue to recognize realms that lose their last city? I'm not talking about the need for manual deletion but shouldn't the game automatically force all regions and nobles of the realm rogue then once they lose their last city because the realm is dead under your interpretation?
Yet, the game continues to recognize the realm as functioning. Militia can still be recruited and armies still utilized. In addition, all RP I have seen indicates that the playerbase believes a realm to still exist so long as it holds regions and nobles both.
In that case, why does the game continue to recognize realms that lose their last city? I'm not talking about the need for manual deletion but shouldn't the game automatically force all regions and nobles of the realm rogue then once they lose their last city because the realm is dead under your interpretation?
Yet, the game continues to recognize the realm as functioning. Militia can still be recruited and armies still utilized. In addition, all RP I have seen indicates that the playerbase believes a realm to still exist so long as it holds regions and nobles both.
You're the one who kept claiming Coria was a dead realm, but now they're suddenly quite alive? Can't have your cake and eat it too, you know.
You are correct on the technical aspects of this statement, but you are missing what I believe to be the intent of the rule. It is intended to prevent realms from peacefully agreeing to band together to form superpowers, as this stifles conflict. If two realms have been at war and one of them is eventually beaten down and surrenders, it is acceptable for that realm to agree to terms that involve its regions being transferred away, within the limits of game mechanics. It's the two realms at peace merging together that we're trying to prevent. You can point out that Tara and Coria are at peace, but the important element in this case is that Coria has been effectively destroyed; with no capital, the realm is doomed. Its nobles cannot recruit or cash bonds, and its regions are slowly going rogue with no capital support. Their decision as a defeated realm to join Tara is acceptable within the spirit of the realm merger rule, or at least that is my interpretation.
Seeing as I'm rather close to this case (being a noble of Silnaria) I will recuse myself from voting on the outcome.
Well based upon Anaris' s stated purpose for this rule in my Q and A thread about realm mergers you are wrong about the purpose of the rule therefore your interpretation is invalid. The point of the rule is that no Ruler would ever accede that another Ruler is their sovereign.I disagree with this interpretation. The OOC game play purpose of the rule is exactly as Geronus has described it: To prevent realms from deciding to merge peacefully to create a single larger, more powerful realm. The IC rationalization is as Anaris has stated.
Also as far as i know Silnaria sees her self as the real Coria, meaning the other is just regions the real Coria rejected.Not a realm.
Just so we're clear on the timeline, Menedor changed allegiance to Tara, and THEN Lothruin rebelled and defected to Tara due to game mechanics?
You are correct on the technical aspects of this statement, but you are missing what I believe to be the intent of the rule. It is intended to prevent realms from peacefully agreeing to band together to form superpowers, as this stifles conflict. If two realms have been at war and one of them is eventually beaten down and surrenders, it is acceptable for that realm to agree to terms that involve its regions being transferred away, within the limits of game mechanics. It's the two realms at peace merging together that we're trying to prevent. You can point out that Tara and Coria are at peace, but the important element in this case is that Coria has been effectively destroyed; with no capital, the realm is doomed. Its nobles cannot recruit or cash bonds, and its regions are slowly going rogue with no capital support. Their decision as a defeated realm to join Tara is acceptable within the spirit of the realm merger rule, or at least that is my interpretation.
Seeing as I'm rather close to this case (being a noble of Silnaria) I will recuse myself from voting on the outcome.
A rule can be intended to prevent more than one thing, for example, a realm which has largely lost a war moving its remaining territories as much as possible into a third realm to prevent there enemy gaining there lands, realms merging into super powers certainly has its issues in the game however, setting precedent that upon defeat realms can dive for cover in a neutral realm allowing players to keep titles and such forth sets a terrible precedent which damages the game immensely. Claiming the "spirit" of a rule like this is bull!@#$ and limits the restrictions that a very good intelligent rule places on the game
Merlin had ordered the use of torture against him
I'm assuming TH didn't know that Lothruin revolted rather and thought I'd changed Duchies, otherwise I'd state this was a very petty accusation against me.
I received no information of the region revolting prior to posting this. My realm was quite confused how it was even possible so I assumed a bug had occurred to allow it to happen. We were in the middle of a takeover of Menedor when Saeculo switched allegiance of Menedor to Tara. Then, we moved our troops to Lothruin immediately thereafter, which while it was a Corian region when we left, was a Taran region when we arrived. We had no idea how this occurred.
If either the fact of the revolt or the failure of Silnaria to receive notification of the revolt are bugs, I am presently unaware of that. Maybe one of the Devs can comment on whether this is working as designed.
No, from what I've heard here, I don't think a bug is involved in this in any way.
If the case is dropped, then there should be no ruling at all. This board is not a place to discuss theoretical cases. If you want to do that, head over to the Q&A board.