BattleMaster Community
BattleMaster => Locals => Dwilight => Topic started by: Chenier on September 18, 2017, 01:24:54 PM
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Guess it's gone?
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Never mind that, wasn't showing on my map for some reason. Still there!
Gonna continue on my trek, then. 8)
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Too bad, I just embarked a ship to the Dancing Tides again, leaving Darfix. Guess we won't meet yet.
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:(
Spot anything?
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Nope, one advy, but he claims he didn't do it, so nothing more than that ???
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Wait until Vita` logs on. He has been somewhat inactive so will have to wait awhile.
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So any RPs in the region will be read then, or no?
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So any RPs in the region will be read then, or no?
No idea. Depends I guess.
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Monsters have been debugged. Alright y'all game over, GG!
Some realms haven't even recovered from the last wave. Curious to know what this invasion will look like. But the coming of an invasion is pretty much certain, considering how much realms grew since they hit the bottom.
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Monsters have been debugged. Alright y'all game over, GG!
Some realms haven't even recovered from the last wave. Curious to know what this invasion will look like. But the coming of an invasion is pretty much certain, considering how much realms grew since they hit the bottom.
You're sure they're debugged? That'll make things interesting
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Check the announcements
Dwilight Monster Bugfix
« Topic Start: Today at 04:28:44 PM »
A major bug in monster handling on Dwilight that has been preventing them from moving around for a while has just been fixed.
Good luck.
Now maybe the fix is not yet live or maybe the fix might itself be bugged, but still.
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Oh !@#$, time to brace ourselves. Actually, nah this works fine, but yeah some will get crushed
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Some: but who?
Astrum shoulda let us take Eidulb Outskirts. At least they'd have had a protective buffer for their city. ;) Though last time we really wanted to go and help defend Eidulb, but we just couldn't go that "far".
That said, Astrum did fine in the last invasion, and despite annexing almost all of Swordfell, still have a pretty decent near 2:1 density. Anor has a lower than 1:1 ratio and they got hit really hard last time, might repeat. Otherwise lots of people have a close to 1:1 density, and only Swordfell and Westgard have a density of 2:1 or greater.
We'll have to see just how eager the monsters are to target low density realms vs realms that just happen to be close to where they spawn. And how much spawn this time around.
I don't know who will hurt the most, but I'm sure a few will hurt a lot.
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The south may well end this time around, otherwise perhaps we should help the monsters out and force them southerners up north ::)
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The south may well end this time around, otherwise perhaps we should help the monsters out and force them southerners up north ::)
Haha, I wish. If I could have a second character on Dwi like in the good ol' days, I might have given a try in making that happen.
If the Zuma are truly gone, the mid-west has the right geography to house a bunch of neighborly realms, should Madina, Fissoa, and Luria (and D'Hara?) be wiped.
If just Fissoa and Madina get wiped, the "largest contiguous rogue area", assuming it crosses ferries, would stretch all the way to Luria/Swordfell. Swordfell could become the eastern Westgard. That'd be pretty badass. :P Please it would make the rogue spawns much, much closer to every single remaining realm.
A pity D'Hara didn't go for Paisly and Golden Farrow. Having a bunch of realms reduced to a few coastal regions would have made it feel like the early colonisation days.
Whatever happens, I'm sure some people will end up quite displeased.
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Westgard worrying about Astrum is the most hilarious thing ever. Monsters can never break Eidulb. They never managed even when the monster code was not broken. Westgard at its peak couldn't hold Eidulb Outskirt and I doubt the current will be able to once the code gets fixed. The sheer amount of monsters that will get funneled into EO will crush the region. Then they will slam against Eidulb or pour into inner Westgard regions again. I bet Westgard will complain a lot when the time comes.
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Astrum asked for our help last time around, and we said we'd give it... we really did mean to. :/
Astrum as a whole is a tough nut. Very defensible. Don't be too cocky for Eidulb, though. Your densities are fair so you should be okay, but if the monsters decided to slam there en masse? 20k after 20k after 20k after 20k... or more? Sure you've got walls, but you can't repair them when there has been battles. The monsters' forces aren't limited by gold, they will keep on spawning huge numbers until they've done enough harm to the human realms. Attrition could very well make you lose Eidulb, especially if you've got an undefeated enemy in the East and that monsters also start swimming to those parts.
Besides, the point of fortifying Eidulb Outskirts is not merely to slaughter the monsters there, but to give more time before the monsters move on to Eidulb. These mini invasions are kind of a survival "last man standing" mode: the point is to lose as few regions for as long as possible so that the *other realms'* losses bring the global density back to safe levels.
Who knows what the future will look like, but I don't recall complaining the last time around. Now that densities are considered and that monsters swim, it feels much more fair to us. Westfold aside, we are the densest realm on the continent and have the second most nobles. It didn't feel fair that density measures would hurt first and foremost the densest realm; we do need at least a skeleton of an economy to keep going, which is hard to do when we are constantly reduced to our capital. We didn't even lose all that much last time around, though, and we retook it a while back. The monster code broke some time after that, the invasion had already ended by then.
Let's not forget that "Westgard at its peak" faced a completely different monster situation. The code was tweaked many times since I rejoined BM, each time making it less and less harsh for us. At the beginning, the code was basically "Dense realms are better than thinned out realms, so let's force realms on Dwilight to be dense by sending insurmountable hordes against the one realm that lies in the spawn zone!". Now, they'll intentionally target other realms, and they won't even need to pass through us to get there. The situation is radically different.
I'm sure there will be complaining, but I doubt most of it will come from Westgard.
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Astrum asked for our help last time around, and we said we'd give it... we really did mean to. :/
Astrum as a whole is a tough nut. Very defensible. Don't be too cocky for Eidulb, though. Your densities are fair so you should be okay, but if the monsters decided to slam there en masse? 20k after 20k after 20k after 20k... or more? Sure you've got walls, but you can't repair them when there has been battles. The monsters' forces aren't limited by gold, they will keep on spawning huge numbers until they've done enough harm to the human realms. Attrition could very well make you lose Eidulb, especially if you've got an undefeated enemy in the East and that monsters also start swimming to those parts.
That's what exactly happened when the code was working properly. In 5 days, the city got attacked by 140k CS. 20-40k a day since scattered monsters recovered and came back to hit again. The wall started to take damage and it almost went down to lv4 at some point. Had to actually send our mobile army to push them out of the city to EO. Ended up fighting 80k outside of Eidulb to give the city time to repair the walls. Wasn't that hard to be honest. Westgard asked for help with Ammando but we couldn't move from EO so had to ignore them pretty much. Did help them after a refit. Everything went alright. I don't know what Astrum's current setting is but back then Astrum had mainly archer,MI and ranged SF. So we were grinding everything that was thrown at us before they could even touch us.
P.S: The fix has finally arrived it seems. I wonder what will happen now. Don't think monsters will funnel that badly. I don't know which part of the code was broken but if only the movement part was broken, they probably spawned a lot so you guys will probably see some big monster groups soon.
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Well, yea, it's a tough nut to crack, never said otherwise.
Who says the next wave will be exactly the same as the last? The bug meant that monsters: weren't looting, weren't doing takeovers, weren't rallying, weren't moving, and weren't spawning. Now that it's all unbugged, we could see a new unprecedented wave wash forth.
Last time, you didn't have a war in the East, you could focus your armies where the rogues hit. Now there's Westfold that is still in play. And who knows, HD or other neighbors could decide to try to take advantage of the rogue invasion to attack Astrum and help Westfold recover? Is it likely? Not really, but it's still a possibility. Still choices to make, though, if you send your armies West then Westfold will certainly take advantage of the opportunity to reclaim some regions, with or without any help.
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Yup, hordes started spawning all over. 11k the biggest so far, and that's straight in our lands, so I'm expecting a lot more to start showing itself.
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Last time, you didn't have a war in the East, you could focus your armies where the rogues hit. Now there's Westfold that is still in play. And who knows, HD or other neighbors could decide to try to take advantage of the rogue invasion to attack Astrum and help Westfold recover? Is it likely? Not really, but it's still a possibility. Still choices to make, though, if you send your armies West then Westfold will certainly take advantage of the opportunity to reclaim some regions, with or without any help.
HD is going to be on the monster's list considering their current density! Hopefully they'll eat some druids instead of Morek this time.
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I do not think realms with low density gets attacked more often. Did something change? The last time I heard anything about monsters, monsters only selected a destination and headed toward that region. They will simply use sea zones if that helped them get to that destination more quickly than going through land regions. Not sure how they select those destinations but I doubt they will pick on low density realms.
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I do not think realms with low density gets attacked more often. Did something change? The last time I heard anything about monsters, monsters only selected a destination and headed toward that region. They will simply use sea zones if that helped them get to that destination more quickly than going through land regions. Not sure how they select those destinations but I doubt they will pick on low density realms.
Yes, that was in the last(s) monster behavior change. They will now target low-density regions (realms?) more frequently.
Morek's kinda "on the way" to HD though. ;)
Avernus looting two far apart corners on the West instead of retaking their fortresses... Guess the monsters will be able to munch on their regions while nobody's home.
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Yes, that was in the last(s) monster behavior change. They will now target low-density regions (realms?) more frequently.
Morek's kinda "on the way" to HD though. ;)
Avernus looting two far apart corners on the West instead of retaking their fortresses... Guess the monsters will be able to munch on their regions while nobody's home.
Interesting. Think it is a good change to make monsters target less populated realms. Will weed out dead realms for sure.
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Interesting. Think it is a good change to make monsters target less populated realms. Will weed out dead realms for sure.
Yea, it seemed to pretty much work that way too, given how some sparser realms got hit way worse than the denser ones (Westgard and Astrum). Arnor worst of all, though I wouldn't have called it a dead realm.
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Yea, it seemed to pretty much work that way too, given how some sparser realms got hit way worse than the denser ones (Westgard and Astrum). Arnor worst of all, though I wouldn't have called it a dead realm.
Wait. Were you speculating the code worked that way or were you for certain that it worked that way?
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Wait. Were you speculating the code worked that way or were you for certain that it worked that way?
I'm pretty sure it was stated as such by Delvin. Looking back, the official newsticker just mentions vague behavior changes. The specifics I believe were announced somewhere on the forums.
I'm never 100% confident in my (or anyone's) memory. But I remember it having been explicitly stated.
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Look up the thread "Monster Problems"
There's actually a combination of different things going on.
Smart monsters, those spawning in the big rogue area in the west, have a chance of getting an actual long-distance target that they will then charge off across land and sea to wreck. At present, I believe these are now correctly going preferentially for low-density realms, and within those preferentially for regions without lords and/or without knights. (These are the ones that have an entry in the database.)
If they don't have one of these targets, they'll look in their general vicinity for a non-rogue region and attack it.
This is why Sabadell, in particular, gets hit so damn hard: it borders a LOT of regions, which means monsters from almost all of those regions see it as the only bordering non-rogue region. (And, of course, monsters slightly further away see it as a possible nearby target.)
I'm trying out a change to the system where monsters essentially see regions of high-density realms as being rogue for the purposes of targeting—that is to say, they might wander into them totally at random, but they'll never move in en masse deliberately. There was a small bug in that, that was causing some of the cases to fail to properly respect the high-density status, but I just located the source of it. It will be fixed for next turn change.
Well, not if something happened there like happened to Paisly the other day. I don't think you could ever stack enough militia in any region to repel over 100k CS of monsters in one go ;D
They're not prevented from using ferries, but they might very well decide to just hop on a raft at this point, depending on where they want to go to.
As far as monster targeting...I'm not entirely sure what you're asking.
At present, monsters never target realms. They target specific regions, and if they take it into their head to hit a particular region, they really don't care what's between them and it. They will charge for it in as straight a line as they can manage, until they forget about it (which they will do, after a certain number of turns).
And yes, holding that pass will now be much easier, as monsters should be vastly less interested in using it.
...For what it's worth, if you could manage to get enough people together (probably a coalition of realms would be required, starting a new monster-buffer-realm), you could cut the entire northwest section off from the main rogue area, pacifying the monsters there (somewhat), by holding Duil, Chrysantalys, Wallershire, and the Corridor of Torment.
Of course, that would probably be nigh-impossible to take, and hell to hold, but hey, life goals, right? ;D
I've made some of the changes I outlined: monsters will now have a much lower chance of attacking high-density realms, and more groups will take it into their heads to go charging off across the sea to hit random human-held regions in large bands.
Please keep me updated as to how the movement of monsters changes.
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Thx for clarifying it.
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No problem.
Eager to see if Sabadell resumes being the hotspot it always was. Mountain of Woe seems pretty darn popular right now, but it's still pretty early.
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So... when's this portal gonna be resolved? Kinda don't want to leave Darfix and miss it. But Darfix is so boring, can't even hunt anything past #2 without getting your ass kicked even on max stealth.
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So... when's this portal gonna be resolved? Kinda don't want to leave Darfix and miss it. But Darfix is so boring, can't even hunt anything past #2 without getting your ass kicked even on max stealth.
Check again! No undead in region but you can hunt monsters on max aggro with ease.
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Check again! No undead in region but you can hunt monsters on max aggro with ease.
The hell, no monsters nor undead left to hunt?
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I have arrived with popcorn at the ready!
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Hopefully y'all won't have to wait too much longer for something to happen...
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Maybe something already happen. Vita, where are you?
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Hope you brought enough popcorn to share - for many days, too!
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Vita seems to be absent.
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Is Vita the only portal guy or are there other portal guys?
Which beggs the question - on Beluaterra - is Vita the only daimon guys or are there other daimon guys?
Which beggs the biggest question - is Vita the guy?! The one and only? Don't we have a backup Vita?
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Which beggs the biggest question - is Vita the guy?! The one and only? Don't we have a backup Vita?
The back up Vita is Delvin and he's very busy. We're quite understaffed.
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Playing daimons and doing portal events probably require the live server excess meaning you can't just give the permission to anyone. Just wait until Vita or Anaris become less busy.
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Playing daimons and doing portal events probably require the live server excess meaning you can't just give the permission to anyone. Just wait until Vita or Anaris become less busy.
^ What he said.
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That's silly. You must have some GM/mods/titans interface/toolset. Why not expand it to allow for doing portal/daimon stuff?
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I mean - huge respect for Vita and other devs but honestly it would be one time effort that would yield soooo much in return.
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Because the kinds of things that have historically happened for portal events require a very high degree of control over the state of the game. Sure, we could fence it 'round with restrictions, so that whoever was doing the task couldn't just do whatever they wanted—but there's no way to allow the kinds of things we've done in the past without making it possible for the people with that access to have a devastating effect on the game if they chose to do so.
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The GM/mods/titans interface/toolset is what is used to do portal events.
But given that that toolset basically gives you god-like power over the entire game, there are very good reasons to restrict it to just two people.
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For instance, one portal event involved swapping the RCs from one city to another city and vice versa. There's no way to do that without the person who does the portal event having enough access to modify literally everything about a region.
So unless you absolutely trust someone to have the power to change your city to a desert, or similar, then you really don't want them in charge of portal events.
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The GM/mods/titans interface/toolset is what is used to do portal events.
But given that that toolset basically gives you god-like power over the entire game, there are very good reasons to restrict it to just two people.
To clarify:
The GM toolset (which has been used by the GMs running invasion factions on BT, and the GMs running the Zuma on Dwilight) is fairly limited. It allows only a little more power than a regular player has access to.
The Titan toolset is entirely structured around Titan cases. They have no other job or power beyond those.
The tools used to handle portal events are actually the admin tools that only Tom, Vita, and I have access to. They grant near-complete control over the game—which is a little redundant to say, when you're talking about the people who already have direct access to the game's code and it's database, and could edit either directly to achieve any result we wanted. The admin interface is just there to streamline common tasks. Like handling portal events.
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How about supervised control? I have no idea how admin interface looks so I have no idea if it's doable, but it should be doable in most cases (altough overly complicated and work-intesive in a lot of cases):
Make senior and junior instance of user, say: admin and gm.
Admins can execute the stuff they do in admin panel, gms can submit the requests. Admins can later accept the requests and making the stuff go live.
Rationale - it's much less job to click "yes" and accept portal event than make portal event happen.
PS. This:
To clarify:
The GM toolset (which has been used by the GMs running invasion factions on BT, and the GMs running the Zuma on Dwilight) is fairly limited. It allows only a little more power than a regular player has access to.
The Titan toolset is entirely structured around Titan cases. They have no other job or power beyond those.
I was unaware. It's pretty cool. And it makes me wonder then why oh why is Vita the only Daimon guy... They should make more of Vitas, Vitas are fun.
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EDIT:
What do portal events do? They send a continent-wide message and create/update stuff in DB. You would need a mechanic to prepare sql statements and write them down in .txt, read from .txt and display it in friendly format and execute statements after admin's review. Another .txt for game messages. It's actually less complicated than I initially thought.
EDIT 2:
I'm assuming that battlemaster is PHP & SQL (mySQL, postgres etc.), I don't know why I keep assuming that.
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How about supervised control? I have no idea how admin interface looks so I have no idea if it's doable, but it should be doable in most cases (altough overly complicated and work-intesive in a lot of cases):
Make senior and junior instance of user, say: admin and gm.
Admins can execute the stuff they do in admin panel, gms can submit the requests. Admins can later accept the requests and making the stuff go live.
A few things:
1) Any system that devolved control from the admins who currently run it would necessarily restrict the possible elements of a portal event. Building any kind of restricted system would by its very nature put limits on the kinds of things the people operating it could do; as admins, we are effectively unfettered in our decisions of how to respond to portals.
2) It's not really worth the amount of effort it would require to make a sort of duplicate, dumbed-down admin interface with restrictions on it; it's particularly not worth the amount of effort required to make one that tries to take even a modest subset of the current admin functionality and make it something that could be proposed and accepted. There are several worlds of difference between a system that just straight-up modifies values in the database, and one that creates a highly complex request, stores it in the database, and at a later trigger, executes it.
3) At least 85% of what you suggest could be done by simply having someone who is not me or Vita come up with ideas (complete with RP text) for the resolution of a portal event, which they proposed to us, and we then said "yeah, sure," and sent the message and executed whatever admin commands were needed to perform the changes it called for.
What do portal events do? They send a continent-wide message and create/update stuff in DB. You would need a mechanic to prepare sql statements and write them down in .txt, read from .txt and display it in friendly format and execute statements after admin's review. Another .txt for game messages. It's actually less complicated than I initially thought.
We are doing our level best to avoid raw SQL these days. That's how BM's code worked for way too many years, but it's far too fraught with potential pitfalls. We use a DB-abstraction framework called Doctrine now, and it makes the code both much easier to keep secure, and much easier to understand and modify.
I'm assuming that battlemaster is PHP & SQL (mySQL, postgres etc.), I don't know why I keep assuming that.
Well, I don't know why either, but it's true. PHP & MySQL.
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What about just removing the portal books? At least where there's no invasion? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm under the impression they rarely lead to much. Remove yourselves the trouble while removing the expectations.
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Like I said, I have no idea how admin panel works right now. I assumed it's something tailor made given BM's age. I assumed it's something decade old given the BM's age and I extrapolated from there.
I think you're right though. After giving it a second thought.
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I think the quickest solution is to get rid of currently opened portals and to just remove all the portal stones from the item pool. Even when Vita was around, half the time he dropped monsters and for the other half he gave out items.
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3) At least 85% of what you suggest could be done by simply having someone who is not me or Vita come up with ideas (complete with RP text) for the resolution of a portal event, which they proposed to us, and we then said "yeah, sure," and sent the message and executed whatever admin commands were needed to perform the changes it called for.
To come up with ideas, one would need all the RP that's being done in and around this Portal. As a supporting Dev, I don't have that kind of access to the live server. As a player involved in a portal happening, I'm quite biased and still do not have all information (what if I'm not in the region anymore when someone is roleplaying about the beam of light?).
Hence at this moment, only you and Vita are the persons who can gather all information about portal stones being used and thus are the only ones who can make an informed decision on how to respond to it.
I'm slightly interested in the suggestions that was made to deal with current portal events & strip them for the future, so they can no longer be used. Except for the fact that you probably still need them on BT for the invasion..
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Scrap the invasion too. It has gone on for long enough. Monsters are pretty much the next invasion at this point.
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Scrap the invasion too. It has gone on for long enough. Monsters are pretty much the next invasion at this point.
Haha. Have been saying that for months now. But it's coming to an end. We can't just abruptly stop it of course (well, *I* can't do anything), which I understand.
I think the realms are ready to rip themselves apart anyway. We don't need Daimons to have a goal anymore :P
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Scrap the invasion too. It has gone on for long enough. Monsters are pretty much the next invasion at this point.
You mean end this one abruptly and ruin what he has planned or what other players have planned and invested time in?
Or do you mean scrap the invasions on Beluaterra altogether?
Allthough i do hope Beluaterra will have good period of time without daimons once this invasion ends.
Perhaps trigger the next invasion by a declining amount of battles, let the daimons come once the island starts to get boring.
As for waiting for Vita, I geuss we just have to be patient, give the guy a break for now.
After all the gods do not require time, their plain of existence is timeless.
All mortals can do is be patient.
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You mean end this one abruptly and ruin what he has planned or what other players have planned and invested time in?
Or do you mean scrap the invasions on Beluaterra altogether?
Oh dear, I hope none of the above! I'm a year old player give or take, I never had the full daimon/invasion experience start-to-end. There's a bunch of new people who hadn't had one either and from what I heat it's sort of quintessence of BM's appeal. No formal system will ever be as fluid and limitless as someone's free, unhindered creative action, no player's guided storyline or RP thread will ever have as much impact on the gameworld as something reflected in mechanics. Invasions and GMs taking action from what I hear are the beautiful marriage of the two, or at least were at their best.
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Does every portal resolution require access to the live server, though? I understand some of the things that were done in the past totally do, but I reckon that probably GMs could give some of them a more modest resolution?
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Does every portal resolution require access to the live server, though? I understand some of the things that were done in the past totally do, but I reckon that probably GMs could give some of them a more modest resolution?
Yes? How else are they going to send portal event RPs? How else are they going to change things to make the RP come true?
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Yes? How else are they going to send portal event RPs? How else are they going to change things to make the RP come true?
I mean, don't the GMs have lesser powers? Aren't these powers sufficient for SOME potential outcomes? Switching RCs from different regions requires playing into the live code, sure, but not every portal event needs to have that effect. I won't presume to know what's in the gm toolbox, but surely there are some tools that could be used occasionally?
In this case, from what I'm told, the person just used it and left. Not many RPs were had in the region since.
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Most of what GMs can do is...be Daimons, and send Event RP messages from their characters.
Oh, and have their family details hidden.
Not exactly tailor-made for running portal events in arbitrary regions on arbitrary continents.
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Most of what GMs can do is...be Daimons, and send Event RP messages from their characters.
Oh, and have their family details hidden.
Not exactly tailor-made for running portal events in arbitrary regions on arbitrary continents.
Since the wiki is mostly dead these days, I'm just gonna go and assume no one's made a record of what previous portal events have meant. Could you give a few further examples?
Can GMs spawn daimons? Because spawning some daimons, a daimon NPC troop leader, and using Event RPs, sounds like enough to me.
But maybe I'm not seeing the "cool" potential due to just not being aware of what kind of things were done in the past and thus what kind of things you'd be willing to do. I just remember being told that many times people don't even bother with RPing it, and that what happens is based on RPs, so...
I mean, I kinda like the concept behind it all, that some rare items can be used and have wild custom impacts, but the appreciation for it kind of sours when told that such power doesn't get the respect it would deserve, by players just using them without even bothering to put any RP around it.
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Ominous music
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So, as examples:
On East Continent portals were opened at the same time in Krimml and Akesh Temple. The outcome was that roleplay messages were sent out about white light covering the cities, and then when the light disappeared the recruitment centres from the two regions had been swapped with each other.
In Outer Tilog there's a portal at the moment - the roleplay done at the time had demons come througj the portal only to be berated by a drunkard for not being up to the standards of the good old days, prompting them to shamefacedly retreat into the portal only to be pursued by the drunkard and forced to come back and leave behind a statue of Despoina (a former judge of Outer Tilog) made of toe and fingernail clippings with some bits of toe and finger still attached. I expect the mechanic outcome of that portal will be creating a new monument/memorial in the region or something.
Those are the only two examples that come to mind for me, but they show some of the things that portals can be used for.
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Maybe it can send all the monsters currently on Dwi to Outer Tilog. :P
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So, as examples:
On East Continent portals were opened at the same time in Krimml and Akesh Temple. The outcome was that roleplay messages were sent out about white light covering the cities, and then when the light disappeared the recruitment centres from the two regions had been swapped with each other.
In Outer Tilog there's a portal at the moment - the roleplay done at the time had demons come througj the portal only to be berated by a drunkard for not being up to the standards of the good old days, prompting them to shamefacedly retreat into the portal only to be pursued by the drunkard and forced to come back and leave behind a statue of Despoina (a former judge of Outer Tilog) made of toe and fingernail clippings with some bits of toe and finger still attached. I expect the mechanic outcome of that portal will be creating a new monument/memorial in the region or something.
Those are the only two examples that come to mind for me, but they show some of the things that portals can be used for.
That... *tear* Is glorious.
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Will it ever be resolved?
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Will it ever be resolved?
Never!