Messages

Constructive critism :

In the Case of Atanamir, I would like to have seen more lightning bolts ( when was the last time that was used on EI? ) and more and longer locks. Also a more detailed and to the point reasoning from the Titans. I never knew about the many OOC argues or that of Drobomir. It might give me a reason to help him or caution him. Now I lose a great player, and 2 other fine players that left the game in the last hours, without me able to do something about it.

+1

It is obvious that this won't change a thing to the Titans's decision since they had a white paper signed from Tom for it.It is after all his game and we happen to play it so i respect it.

When having though a game you play by yourself the rules can be as strict, when playing among other people and trying to create aside the game a strong community you cannot underestimate the human factor.

We are grown upw playing a game that involves strategy and occasionally role play.It is a competitive game and the role playing is there to light it up but there are certain black holes in this game, certain continents and realms that constantly" throw up" issues of ooc, multi cheating, whining and the constant need of titans to view upon them. It is EC.It is a fact. I actually voted for EC to sink :P

Alex was a passionate player since day one. 10 years and none of it ever changed, he was playing this game as he was playing it back then, always thirsty for something. I remember him pissing people off in many realms, he surely pissed off 3 of my chars so far but he was always doing it in game, he was excellent in strategy and active enough to make things happen.
I ve never saw him play as enthusiastically as he was playing in Perdan in any other realm, ever. Darka had a 3 front war  for example and he couldn't care less and he was General there too.Yes he was addicted to Perdan.

When you judge an old player like him, that never paused, never stopped playing the game and realize that all this hate comes from one continent and are made for the same char well you notice the "disease" and cut it right off :P You don't just command kill the player

For future reference that is my opinion and i believe i do well in expressing it since this is an irreversible and fatal decision for any player and i hate to see people leave the game for ever.

Except that all this stuff was OOC. That makes it the player.

Do you really think that if Atanamir the character was killed, he wouldn't just make a new character in Perdan within a week? And work his way up with it very quickly?

You could have forbid him to play there, or receive position. A titans decision that he should have just abide with.

Do remember it was the realm electing him though. Perdan does worshiped his chars, it was his many enemies who hated him :P

weird it kept happening only in Perdan isn't it?  The Titans judged 10 years of gaming over a Realm and a char. That's all i know.

That people are supposedly leaving the game because of this ban is sad, but it goes to show that perhaps they did not know what it was like to not be in Atanamir's good graces.

Pretty pathetic to say something like that Simon.

All i see is that in 10 years of playing Perdan took him down because he was so into it as a realm.

I still believe it is a very bad decision and nothing i would expect from the Titans, it is obvious the root of the problem against others was that character and you could have bolted him out and keep the player.

He was a great player and you people make him look like a monster.

Jaune,

i m so glad you made the first move because i was about to start a thread as well for the matter.

Many of you know me and Alex (aka Atanamir) are friends in real life and i don't mean two people who met once or two ,but actual friends.

It is a player that dedicated time and soul into this game for 10 years. Yes he is competitive, yes certain chars of his are power hungry and manipulating but he has also shown in many realms strong and loyal dedication
Rp wise i have fought valiantly near to his chars and i have dueled to the death another and won his head.
He is a very good player. He is a player that is either loved or hated and that happens to strong personalities.

Speaking as a player and an ex Magistrate, yes sometimes he becomes too stubborn and competitive but a permanent lock?
As Jaune said multi cheaters that were caught in action twice were not perm banned from the game.

I thought we were trying to expand the community, not weaken it.

I took a pause of over a year in the game and learned news only through my boyfriend and about his family. I came back to see the downfall of Darka and what i ve noticed so far in both irc and game is OOC crap.

People get accused as players because other players can't stand their chars. Well qq and run to your corner.That  "butthurt" type of playing is not my style and i m sure it is none of the old players's style.

Every damn in game message comes with an OOC crap tag and people get dragged into ooc disputes over nothing. I am pretty sure this is the case as well for Alex only in this case it was most convenient because Alex had actually already one verdict on his neck.

You do not permanent lock people who love this game and community, people who have dedicated a pretty long time in this game while you leave the game to be driven by ooc crap.

As Evi i vouch for Alex.

Still a few people who are intent on dueling everyone for the least imagined slight.

"You got picked to be lord of that region I wanted?! I demand that you duel me the death for the right to hold that office!"

HAHA so true :D we had that in the beginning a lot :D We still have one mad person like this , i love him lol  ;D

I guess it is too early but we re stuck with some ppl that want to mess up things their own way...but i m guessing it won't last long.

Has the bickering stopped in other realms or is it just Ikalak now? XD

If Actrial was provoked to write those OOC messages then that is another case and it should be raised by him and no other and  of course be judged individually.

His actions cannot be justified just because there may be a motivation behind them and it is not the job of Magistrates to play detectives and search behind the scenes. The one who feels offended ends ups here and claims his right for justice. It's pretty simple.

If someone defends himself with offense then he automatically becomes an offender himself.

Disappointing and sad. Atamara can indeed break you , can't say i wasn't expecting the player of Merlin to crack at a point ....but i was hoping his stubborn and ambitious char would keep him going.

Well played so far, i feel like i should say that.

But secession and rebellions are sort of different though...
Rebellions: The government of Kepler is corrupt/weak and we are gonna change it
Secessions: F you Kepler, we are now Evilstani

lol :D

If you remove all of it once or twice, it will never happen again, at least not with same players around.
This can make cases really more evident and clear for the magistrates to judge.
I still have doubts if will not be better to have the cases handled away form everyone or even if magistrates should have a second account just for this, a anonymous account.

Ι like the idea of doing it in a non public way and anonymously but that wouldn't be all different from the Titans? I mean apart the different case handling.Not sure this is what Tom wants.

Also, closing an island down always makes people leave. There are people who have been playing for years because they became attached to history they made for their characters. Once that disappears, why should they stay?

So true.

To perhaps take it a step further, might it be prudent to discuss enacting a protocol where Magistrates whose characters will be personally effected by their own decisions may be obligated to recuse themselves? Is that already a part of the code of conduct for Magistrates? Or would it be too difficult to enforce? Because if the Magistrate's characters could potentially benefit from their own ruling, wouldn't it be safe to say that it is a conflict of interest?

This  has happened in some cases without the need of a rule. Magistrates chose to abstain because there was a conflict  of interest, if we can call it that way. But yes i wouldn't mind if that actually became a rule which of course will remind a lot the way the Titans worked, meaning they were excluded from continents in which they had characters and such.

What i could suggest but i m afraid to do so because i fear it will become too much of a real life trial is the following.

Complainant and defendant once the case is open can bring 3 names each to support the case.Call people to testify for them that is.
Those people will be heard only if they have real evidence to bring forth.

In a real trial this is how it works . Testimonies come either from people that can bring evidence to support a case , some are what we call eye witnesses , others are simply stating what they know from a third party ( no need to say those aren't always reliable but are still valid to be brought forth).

I am suggesting this knowing it is  a bit too far but i am trying to find a solution that will benefit both sides when their case is public and at the mercy of everyone who reads it in the forum.
Those cases are important not only because the verdict does become a rule itself in some way but also because the verdict leaves a "mark" to both the defendant and the complainant once the verdict is reached. Both should have the right to see their perspective enforced as long as there is a valid reason for it to be enforced and not just a comment like " he is a good guy , he would never do that" or " i know him, he sucks as a player and it doesn't surprises me". This is WRONG.

I will say that one thing I appreciated about the Titans that seems less the case with the Magistrates is that the Titans' characters had a lower profile.  The magistrates sometimes seem like an OOC version of some of the big IC personas in the game. Several of the Titans definitely had characters with high profiles, but maybe it was just that we always emailed each other and so it wasn't our IG names or forum names that were pasted to everything...it just had a feel of 'hey guys, what should we do about this' and not 'wasn't that the same guy who was just celebrating his realm kicking ass.'

This is correct. It happens and it actually happens because this public way of dealing things pretty much ends to it. First of all if we take a real trial as example .... not every one can drop and say his opinion, a trial shouldn't become a discussion....it brings personal opinions forth more than actual evidence and to the point that even the Magistrates forget who they are in all this chit chat. Of course i am not pointing fingers , i include myself to this.
Only people relevant to a case should be able to comment , only people who can actually add something to the case itself.What someone may heard, or dealt with in a similar yet different case shouldn't be used, it brings the personal opinion to the surface more than the evidence itself so instead of aiding it actually works against a good judgement by the Magistrates.

To be honest i am not all that happy with how this works. Yes we should be harsher and not allow bickering but i think that every "personal opinion" or any defending line of that kind should be prohibited. It creates an atmosphere that has nothing to do with a "trial" , because it is supposed to be one in a way ,and it leads to impressions that most of the times are wrong.

Also a thing that pretty much upsets me is stating the opinion of how childish or meaningless someone believes that a complain is.
This is not the case.Some people do find offensive certain things that other may not.No one can judge that. We can judge wether it is a violation or not, but how childish it is or not or how important it is to the person that fills the complain cannot be judged by any of us.

Anyway, i believe the forum is not the problem here, the problem is that all this publicity either it is a simple forum discussion, an irc discussion or a complain gets consumed due to the publicity itself. The more people that receive such info the more it gets discussed and reproduced so ending up in bickering is a natural result.