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Messages - Ays

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Feature Requests / Re: Holding Unique Items
« on: March 19, 2011, 09:27:35 PM »
That is what adventurer guilds are designed to help.  Remember,  the game even at the adventurer level supports cooperative efforts.  Having a fellow adventurer become part of such a transaction seems to be a solid cooperative solution to the 'unique' problem.

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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 17, 2011, 04:25:04 AM »
To keep us all on-track ... here is a summary:
  • Remove the Mentor subclass.
  • Make mentoring an option selectable by any character in the realm that has been playing the game for more than 6 months. (Too long? Maybe 3 months? Anyway, more than 30 days.)
  • Allow rulers to appoint official mentor(s) -- or Chief Mentor -- for the realm.
  • Create a Newbie Corner (probably with a different name...) on the forum dedicated to basic game play questions, geared specifically at new players. All new players should get an IG message to go there and ask questions.
  • Mentors who receive too many bad reviews from the students should be removed from the Mentor program.
  • Some way to encourage more mentor/student communications. Maybe put the Mentor/Student channel options at the top of the Messages screen, possibly highlighted in a separate colored box, with some explanatory text directing the to ask questions of their mentors? Also, put a link to the forum Newbie Corner there, too.
  • Update wiki  (in a community-based and inclusive manner) to include non-realm specific mentor/student page.
  • Ingame sortable chart to track student progress and timing of lessons.
  • Maintain mentor points and relevant rewards.
  • Open mentor option to immigrants -- or perhaps any new character (without family in realm) as Bedwyr suggests that a mentor's main task is realm customs and practices.
  • Make an automatic IG mentor message to guide new players to resources (forum, wiki, student subclass).


I have to say that the new students seem only interested in people with titles.

This is so true, and another good reason why rulers should appoint -- and the realm leadership team should interact -- with mentors.  It sends a clear message to new players to listen ... because mentors are important and BM is a team game.

I originally wrote Gregor's "book" as a supplement to what I was already writing to students.  But it does need to be interactive, and more importantly it needs to give new players a sense of what's going on politically, and militarily.  Giving a brief overview of history helps new people out a ton, and makes them feel like they can join in.

Loren's idea of a 'book' to supplement what mentors focus on in-game is what I was attempting to convey earlier with my request for a wiki project.  Changes in all three areas would be brilliant: more interactive/timely/realm specific in-game mentoring, clearer non-realm wiki information, and responsive/supportive forum 'corner' for newbs.


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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 14, 2011, 02:54:46 PM »
Chenier, are you suggesting that the student option should be open to immigrants? 
Or,  that  the option should be open X days,  regardless of realm movements? 

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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 14, 2011, 12:36:32 AM »
Are we in agreement to brainstorm changes needed to the mentor aspect of the game?  Once all of the ideas are gathered, perhaps a master plan should be created. 

Please look at Indirik's summary list and add/change anything you wish.

Having someone right in your realm, that is easily accessible in-game, who is dedicated to helping *you*, is a very good idea.

  • Remove the Mentor subclass.
  • Make mentoring an option selectable by any character in the realm that has been playing the game for more than 6 months. (Too long? Maybe 3 months? Anyway, more than 30 days.)
  • Allow rulers to appoint official mentors for the realm.
  • Create a Newbie Corner (probably with a different name...) on the forum dedicated to basic game play questions, geared specifically at new players. All new players should get an IG message to go there and ask questions.
  • Mentors who receive too many bad reviews from the students should be removed from the Mentor program.
  • Some way to encourage more mentor/student communications. Maybe put the Mentor/Student channel options at the top of the Messages screen, possibly highlighted in a separate colored box, with some explanatory text directing the to ask questions of their mentors? Also, put a link to the forum Newbie Corner there, too.


I agree with Indirik's list and am adding:

  • updating wiki using a team of  realm-appointed mentors (since the group is keen on this idea :))
  • use a private forum for the mentor group to collaborate final product.
  • ingame sortable chart to track student progress and timing of lessons.

If wiki is used,  the format should follow the topics of the mentor lessons so that mentors can 'assign' wiki reading sections.  This would also be a sweet way to set up the threads in the forum.   I would love to get more people using the forums.  What better way than encouraging our mentors and students ?


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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 12, 2011, 12:59:30 PM »
The forum is for discussions. The wiki is for storing information.

You are right.   Can we do a both?

As egamma said, the links on wiki need gathered and updated.  It is a huge thankless task.  Let's use the forum for discussion and wiki for information.

As part of our discussions, rulers shall elect official mentors. From this group, form a Mentor Commission to collaborate/write mentor lessons based on the set topics.  The commission would be temporary organization and would use a private forum section for discussions and collaboration. The result would posted on wiki. 

This proposal allows strong players to update/write mentor lessons, rewards these players by being on a commission, encourages more forum use, keeps wiki as information, and provides all new players with updated quality information. 

Mentors would refer students to wiki for general information, the forum for discussions, and support players with realm/individual help.   Game knowledge would come from a balanced combination of fellow players (mentors), wiki, and the forum.

In turn, the new wiki page would cite the contributing mentors and encourage new players to become a student to learn more.  When updates are needed a new team of mentors from the 'official realm' list can be called upon to work in the forum.

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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 11, 2011, 11:58:58 PM »
  • Remove the Mentor subclass.
  • Make mentoring an option selectable by any character in the realm that has been playing the game for more than 6 months. (Too long? Maybe 3 months? Anyway, more than 30 days.)
  • Allow rulers to appoint official mentors for the realm.
  • Create a Newbie Corner (probably with a different name...) on the forum dedicated to basic game play questions, geared specifically at new players. All new players should get an IG message to go there and ask questions.
  • Mentors who receive too many bad reviews from the students should be removed from the Mentor program.
  • Some way to encourage more mentor/student communications. Maybe put the Mentor/Student channel options at the top of the Messages screen, possibly highlighted in a separate colored box, with some explanatory text directing the to ask questions of their mentors? Also, put a link to the forum Newbie Corner there, too.


Sweetness!   You are right.  It is not a complete list,  but it is brilliant start.   

Now, let us talk about mentor lessons.  A complete mentor session now includes over six letters, even without student questions.   
Would we still need the structured list of lessons?  And, if so, how to support mentors in that task?

If this format is still deemed necessary, mentor lesson resources/tools would be a positive change.   I see three options:
  • Post resources in a mentor-only part of the forum  -- which opens the forum to other private group sections.   A private forum section provide a place for mentors to post/share solid information, without undermining the mentor/student experience.   Such a mentor forum would also allow realms easy consistent/approved mentor lessons.
  • Provide a clear mentor section on wiki.  Some realms already attempted to use wiki to standardize realm mentor lessons.
  • Bake standard lessons into the game as templates.
   

How big of change in mentoring do we want? 







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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 11, 2011, 01:36:43 PM »
... a dedicated "Newbie Corner" kind of thing. Perhaps we could do that, including giving new players a link to that board in their IG welcome message.

Excellent.   As Artemesia said, a devoted forum section for is a good use of this new resource.  It would also answer Foundations concerns about player versus character mentoring. Including the forum link in an ingame realm mentor message would offer players a solid options to getting questions answered (and solve/fix key confusions newb players have).

However, I think there's still room for an in-game type of mentor.

Indeed, the forum section must not supersede our talks on improving the mentor position.  Mentors are key greeters, hand-holders and teachers within a realm. 

I suppose the question is, should this all be done by the individual mentors, or something filled out by mentors, or something that's the same for every player and baked in to the game?

This is also my question.   

Asking mentors to recreate the wheel to explain game functions seems a waste.  Yet, there are realm specific information mentors must impart.

The structure should support mentors time/effort and player understanding.  Mentor templates (creating solid information a mentor can build on), interactive quizzes and/or reports (enabling the mentor to know/support the student actions), and mentor links with visuals would be the good.

Changes must always build the connection between character and realm -- and player and game.

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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 10, 2011, 09:46:35 PM »
Thing is, we could use a more structured system. As it is right now, everything is entirely up to the mentor working with the student. There is nothing to see whether the student is doing anything to learn.

Hear, hear!   Mentors must become more than thankless scribes.  That means making the position more than an afterthought.  It needs to be a structured position.  As you say, mentors need  tools.  Possibilities include:

  • automatic welcome message from mentor(s)
  • color for mentor messages
  • workable charts allowing mentors to track progress
  • a way to see if student is active
  • automatic reports on gaining liege and army placement
 

Mentor goodies are nice and all -- but not about teaching players to be better players.  A structure system in-game and this forum would go a long way toward retaining players and improving game play.

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Commoners are essentially slaves. they work our land, produce our food, give us their earnings, and we protect them. What nobles want to do is keep this distinction strong and keep the commoners calm.

If you want to keep commoners calm, stop the slave talk.  Like jaune stated in an earlier post, certain words cause  people to go into a frenzy.  Slave is one of them.

Adventurers understand noble arses exist in any realm; they take due note and avoid them.  No adventurer signs up to become a slave. 

Nobles, who are smart enough to understand that 'nobility' holds one to a higher standard of conduct, treat adventurers with due respect.   "Due respect" for some nobles may indeed mean treating adventurers as dogs.    Good realms and good nobles know better.  These nobles reap the rewards of magical items,  easy item repair and beast-free lands. 



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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 10, 2011, 02:44:36 PM »
Peter, I see your point, you can have the best mentor on the worst kingdom and it would not serve the player or the game.

The underlying role of mentor is to help new players make connections.  Connection with the rules, the flavor and the running of the game.  And, connection with the realm, its leadership and customs. 

The last connections are missing in BM, and it is vital.  BM is a complex game, with collaboration at its heart.  Mentors must become an integral part of realm to sustain growth and foster collaboration.   

Having leadership appoint mentors would be many benefits:
  • stronger players (because mentors are hand-picked experts)
  • stronger realms (because leadership would/could consider new player needs)
  • stronger game (because more players would connect and play)

It is always easier for realms to ignore new players, and recruit skilled/active players from other realms.  The game mechanics must encourage and reward mentoring.

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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 09, 2011, 09:18:26 PM »
What I think would make a big difference would be divorcing Mentorship from the class system....

Exactly,  mentorship should be divorced from the class system. As rulers would choose one or more mentors, ruler-appointed mentorship must be divorced from the class system.  Otherwise, ruler appointments could violate a player's inalienable right.  Ruler appointment would also follow the medieval focus of the game.  Should anyone of that time get to opt into such a key position?   

I simply want some assurance of quality.  Ruler appointment might accomplish this. However it is accomplished, allowing advanced players such as Indirik to be mentors would assure strong new players.

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Feature Requests / Re: Change to Mentor position
« on: March 09, 2011, 06:29:34 PM »
... in general it seems like mentors aren't getting much in terms of mechanics. The last time I tried teaching, my students said nothing. They pretty much just left.

A change would be good.  Being a good mentor takes time and effort, which is largely ignored.   More importantly, mentors have a unique power over young players and can shape the future of a realm -- and the growth of the game. 

Ruler-appointed mentors would be a step forward in securing strong people as mentors.  The appointed mentors would then present a clear and congruous idea of how to play within that realm.  They would be more likely to be a good surrogate between new players and leadership.   For their efforts, mentors would have a real position in the realm, rather than being a  thankless scribe.

Along with appointing mentors, the game mechanics allow little in the way of lesson organization.  Students seem to get lost in the forums. A color for mentor messages would help.   On the mentor side, a workable chart allowing the mentor to track student lessons (like a checklist) would be good.   


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