Messages

151

Dwilight / Re: What is your greatest dream on Dwilight?

« on: April 13, 2011, 12:51:19 AM »

I think my greatest dream has to be for Sanguis Astroism to dominate Dwilight, but through conversion as well as conquest and colonisation. For example an SA Madina, with its Constitution and independent Lords combined with inter-SA politics and theological splits would be awesome.

152

BM General Discussion / Re: New Religion: PLEASE HELP ME :)

« on: April 13, 2011, 12:41:19 AM »

It would be great to see another religion SA could actually be friends with; that would make for some much more interesting dynamics and interaction than 'everyone outside SA hates it'.

It would be very interesting, but I think the problem is that SA is (understandably) entirely Bloodstars focused to the extent that we are agnostic as to the existence of other gods. Unless another religion holds the Bloodstars in high-esteem its hard to consider them variants as all our theology is entirely dependant on the Stars.

Its like the situation with Triunism; we have very similar beliefs (three way split between passion, logic and balance; the need for enlightenment; the significance of the number three ect.) however because they consider the Bloodstars to be empty bastions once belonging to their logic/order deity we can't consider them variants as all of our shared beliefs are only important in SA if they are directly linked with the Bloodstars.

153

BM General Discussion / Re: New Religion: PLEASE HELP ME :)

« on: April 13, 2011, 12:35:11 AM »

Not much in the current system allows for very effective intra-religion conflict though, which is one of the few things I do find lacking in the current system (Yeah, I'm not always status quo). Especially if a hated figure in a religion whom no one likes is a priest. I think there was even an extensive thread on the Dlist, initiated in response to dustole's character, in fact, about how a priest can't be kicked out of a religion.

Agreed. There needs to be ways for Elders to reprimand troublesome priests while at the same time those priests with large noble followings should have some way to react against the Elders and "break-away" from the main body (the currant "found a new religion" system is simply not feasible in cases of religious schism where the peasant populations would still adhere to the old faith and all temples would have to be rebuilt from scratch)

154

BM General Discussion / Re: New Religion: PLEASE HELP ME :)

« on: April 13, 2011, 12:32:04 AM »

Hahaha!   True that, true that.    I know of several that hate my character.   I think that is part of what makes SA so much fun.  SA's biggest threat is SA itself.

Yup, guilty on my part

And yes definitely its the inter SA conflicts that make things exiting. Despite the efforts of the "free-realms" its OOC fact that a religion as large as SA is not really under any serious external threat, and so while it might alarm my character these wars add little in terms of the "danger-element" as a player. Inter-SA conflict however really shakes thing up as if anything will destroy SA it will be schisms.

One thing this war has done is swing things very much in favour of Allison. Almost overnight she is back to being a recognised member of the good standing in the Church and she has the war she always dreamed of. Plus her main opponents amongst the Elders are gradually leaving office; Varchilde and Medugnatos have already left and Constantine will probably leave after the war is over (he was actually considering resignation after Varchilde left but once the war broke out he considers it "irresponsible" to "abandon the Church at its time of need"). Add this to the fact that the strong pro-war sentiment in which Allison thrives means that most of the new Consuls will probably end up as her allies I think its safe to say post-war SA is going to be quite different from pre-war SA. One interesting factor will be the Prophet, as no one really knows what his views are and whether he will act on them (although naturally Constantine is convinced Mathurin would agree with him and is merely not acting in order to avoid schism).

In short interesting times are ahead for SA politics 

155

Dwilight / Re: Sanguis Astroism

« on: April 07, 2011, 11:51:45 PM »

Lol well that's no fun!

If you want "fun" then you can always go around trying to convert people and denounce SA.... just don't expect any leniency

Another way of finding "fun" would be to join SA and try to syncretise Magna Serpaensism with Sanguis Astroism however that could end up with you being investigated for heresy, depending on to what extend you are altering the fundamental teachings. If you are found guilty the consequences may be just as bad as if you tried converting people.

156

Dwilight / Re: Sanguis Astroism

« on: April 07, 2011, 11:12:17 PM »

Soooo what happns when a noble appears in Astrum who comes from strong Magna Serpaensism roots?

If I remember correctly we had a similar case in Astrum's early days with a noble who claimed to follow "Thor".... generally as long as you keep your religion to yourself and don't try to convert people or build any temples then I doubt anything drastic will occur

157

BM General Discussion / Re: New Religion: PLEASE HELP ME :)

« on: April 03, 2011, 06:30:10 PM »

Oooh sounds like a very interesting concept. I like the way that it is different; concepts (like blood-drinking) that might seem abhorrent to us as players certainly give it a unique flavour compared to other BM religions.
Perhaps after the war is over Constantine might pop down and investigate. Although the two religions probably wouldn't really get along ((tritheism vs. monotheism) they both seem to share an emphasis on the importance of blood (in SA the Bloodstars are so named because they exert their influence via the blood).

158

Background / Re: Religion descriptions

« on: March 28, 2011, 09:23:53 PM »

I'd like to see some posts explaining various religions in the medival time period. Ideally, it should be fairly condensed, with links to additional information, so that players interested in starting an in-game religion have some good source material.

Druids, for example. Anyone have good information on them?

Give me a few days and I could put something small together regarding the Byzantine Church and perhaps its relationship with the State (they don't call it Byzantine politics for nothing!) however my reading into that area is really only a hobby so there are probably others far more knowledgeable on the subject here in BM who would do a better job.

Also if I remember correctly the Druids were not a religious force in the Middle Ages; indeed its highly questionable whether any existed at such a time at all. After the conversion of the British Isles to Christianity any traces of British polytheism (including the Druids) could only have survived in a much diluted form in local folk-lore, and even that is debatable.

159

Dwilight / Re: Dwilight IC and OOC updates and news!

« on: March 24, 2011, 07:28:47 PM »

Or Allison herself. You shoulda seen the lies she spat about SA and Astrum when she was ruler of Entai.

Ah, I should have suspected Allison would have been involved; I don't think I've ever encountered a more cunning character.

The irony is that Allison's zeal to defend SA has brought about a temporary reconciliation with even her most staunch opponents in the Church and everyone (including Constantine) is convinced that Caerwyn's false accusations are the result of Caerwynian hatred and Thulsomian lies.

Although the fact that Caerwyn took the words of a noble who was known to be in conflict with the Church authorities as an authoritative source of information about SA's plans shows that there was already a great willingness to go to war.

160

Dwilight / Re: Sanguis Astroism

« on: March 15, 2011, 12:23:24 AM »

Really? I can't agree with that one. He's avoided the entire topic. The only time I ever heard him address it was when he said something like: "I don't know if I'm infallible." When the elders of the church are threatening excommunication toward anyone who denies the Prophet's infallibility, you'd think the Prophet would speak up.

I think its this avoidance that actually stops the schism. We Elders weren't able to excommunicate Allison for the simple reason that there was no concrete Church document contradicting her words (the Magestratum refused to condemn her for this very reason); thats why we helped form the Creed so that in the future there could be a definitive document. As it stands there is a sort of stalemate regarding the infallibility issue; a majority of Elders support it and are aware that some prominent nobles do not but we are restricted as to what actions we can take without a decree from Mathurin.

IMO clarity is a double edged sword- on one hand it would stop this kind of limbo with regards to infallibility that we currently have but on the other hand it would allow one side form being able to excommunicate the other. Of course Constantine wishes the Prophet would just declare infallibility but as a player I think the silence is what prevents a schism.

161

Dwilight / Re: Sanguis Astroism

« on: March 14, 2011, 09:49:16 PM »

My character, Brance Indirik, having been present at the founding of the religion, vehemently disputes this assertion. He has argued constantly against the Holy Prophet's infallibility for IG years.

As a player, my biggest disappointment with SA has been with the strong Catholic influence in Sanguis Astroism. There was a trend within SA at some to for all the priests and elders to call other people "son" or "daughter", and to refer to priests as "father". We had positions named "cardinal" and "bishop". And once someone started doing it, others quickly fell in line and started doing it, too. I am fairly certain that the infallibility trend started along the same lines as Papal Infallibility.

I found it extremely irritating. In fact, one of my biggest personal goals during the time I was regent was to revamp the rank structure to get rid of stuff like that.

Indeed, I remember the old infallibility debate with Brance and Allison; finished inconclusively but Constantine is still a firm believer.

Although I agree there has been some Catholic/SA crossovers in places I'm don't think infallibility is one of them. Essentially the Pope's infallibility in Catholicism is very much based on whether the doctrine declared was already accepted (he can't make new stuff up only reaffirm old stuff that is not yet dogma) and he can use his infallibility only when teaching "ex cathedra".
 The Prophetic infallibility held by some in SA (including Constantine) is much more powerful; essentially comparable to the status of the OT Prophets in Christianity and Judaism and the Prophet Mohammed in Islam; a "words coming directly from the divine" kind of thing that the Papacy never enjoyed.

Of course I can't speak for the other players but I can say for certain that Constantine's views on Infallibility weren't drawn on any perceived relations with Catholicism but rather from his understanding of the nature of Prophet-hood as well as his personal encounters with Mathurin.

In any case I think Mathurin has done a great job of ensuring that there isn't a schism on the matter 

162

Dwilight / Re: Sanguis Astroism

« on: March 14, 2011, 09:14:37 PM »

Come to think of it since being in SA and the prophet sleeping most of  the time, people spend more time arguing and charging people with heresy than they do actually bringing new teachings or ideas to the church. I myself being a victim of that mentality to to a degree.

Although as others have said this is very much to do with the nature of religion itself.

Most religions, both past and present, require their teachings to come from the divine and for Constantine and many others in SA the only way we can verifiably say that a teaching has come from the Stars is if it comes through or is approved by the Holy Prophet himself.

It may not be nice for those with new ideas that we keep pouncing on new things and calling them heresy but it makes sense from an SMA POV.

163

Dwilight / Re: Sanguis Astroism

« on: March 10, 2011, 01:11:13 AM »

I generalize too much. I didn't mean "not a single person does", I meant generally speaking.

I think the perception outside SA is such that it is viewed as a political rather than a religious entity however this is certainly not true within SA itself.

In fact only a few months ago there was a very heated debate regarding the role of the Prophet, the authority of scripture and the true meaning of "harmony", "balance" and "enlightenment". Plus the priests are currently formulating a creed that should be ready soon. Of course this is very much intertwined with politics (just as in RL medieval times different religious views are associated with different political factions) and I'm not going to pretend its anywhere as near as complex as a RL religion.

However overall SA has been the most "religious" religion I've seen on Battlemaster; certainly its true that many people do take it seriously as a religion.