Author Topic: North East Thread  (Read 24352 times)

De-Legro

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #30: September 09, 2011, 06:04:34 AM »
The Lurians demanded the Lighthouse, didn't they? I can't imagine how D'Hara or anyone else in the Moot would be able to stomache a shared realm project when the Lurians clearly want to take advantage of D'Hara, its previous situation a clear example. Matt himself even pointed out the relative importance of Qubel to D'Hara. Makes you wonder...

You realise Matt WAS the Duke of the lighthouse, and the Lurian claim is based on his families claim right? After all D'Hara can barely hold Port Nebel, without some radical change the chances of them EVER holding the lighthouse again are marginal.

Besides, it isn't the Lurian empire that is making suggestions of a shared effort, we are generally attracting enough new player to make us look to the next colony effort once the current one is completed, all the back stabbing seems to be a great recruitment tool.
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Bedwyr

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #31: September 09, 2011, 06:36:23 AM »
The Lurians demanded the Lighthouse, didn't they? I can't imagine how D'Hara or anyone else in the Moot would be able to stomache a shared realm project when the Lurians clearly want to take advantage of D'Hara, its previous situation a clear example. Matt himself even pointed out the relative importance of Qubel to D'Hara. Makes you wonder...

"The Lurians" demanded nothing of the sort.  House Bedwyr, in the person of Koli, the son of the last legitimate Duke of the Lighthouse, was making it clear that he still holds his father's claim.

And D'hara's continued inability to feed Port Nebel is deeply offensive to Koli's religion, and resulted in the death of one of his uncles (on his mother's side).

Of course...It's not like Koli would shed any tears if D'hara gave him an excuse to sail an army into the Ports, but there are real and good reasons for what he did.
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Chenier

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #32: September 09, 2011, 07:34:31 AM »
Again, you forget that De-Legro and I had two lordships, a duchy, and a Council position in D'hara at various times.  Taking Paisly and Paisland and letting the food-producing Qubel and QL go rogue made your situation untenable.  The fact that D'hara continues on the same stupid path doesn't excuse anything.

You seem to forget that we don't play in the BattleMaster of 2006. To expand, we need nobles. We didn't have enough nobles to go back eastwards. And should you have not noticed, Port Nebel must be conquered first before any expansion into the eastern rurals can be made.

De-Legro was in D'Hara... when it was small, when all the cities had 1% production due to low population at all times basically, and when there were more nobles. We had more rurals back then to feed smaller cities. Port Raviel and Paisly have grown considerably since these days. We didn't even need to import any food at all in these days, even when we had Sallowtown (which was lost due to rogues, not lack of food).

As soon as the new estates system will be implemented, we'll be more than happy to go back to colonize all of our claimed lands. Until then, estates won't allow us. We were already stretched thin before someone started a TO of Qubel, and that was thanks to a few migrants from Caerwyn and beyond. Wouldn't have even been imaginable before. Estate cover would have been so bad that the cities would have been absolutely worthless.

We are always knocking on everyone's door for food. But the war against Caerwyn screwed us on an important supplier. And other realms are also seeing their cities grow and therefore their surpluses shrink.

If the Lurians had the ability to feed Port Nebel, then if he cares about his religion so much he can sell D'Hara that very same food he'd give them. D'Hara isn't holding any food back from it's stupid peasants, and we can't do anything to stop immigration either. D'Hara is the land of retarded peasants that join en masse places they know they won't be able to find food in, and who complain against the government's taxes all the time therefore cutting the government's power to buy that very food they require. And if we expand to acquire more farmlands for them, well then they'll just burn it all down because there won't be enough nobles to watch over them. D'Haran peasants *want* to die. They worship the god of starvation, and pray every day for their warehouses to run out on the next day.

If any other realm could do better, then that just means they are the problem themselves, as they are stockpiling food and refusing to feed the city.

Koli's family could also just move out if they are too poor or stupid to use their noble powers to keep themselves fed. Hell, they must be like the peasants I mention, if they chose to live in Port Nebel instead of Paisly or Port Raviel. Port Nebel always was the poorest child. Since it rarely ever produced much gold, it was always sacrificed in favor of the cities that actually made an income and therefore had the power to purchase food from abroad. Better have one city starve than all of them, after all.
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JPierreD

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #33: September 09, 2011, 07:38:45 AM »
Koli's family could also just move out if they are too poor or stupid to use their noble powers to keep themselves fed. Hell, they must be like the peasants I mention, if they chose to live in Port Nebel instead of Paisly or Port Raviel. Port Nebel always was the poorest child. Since it rarely ever produced much gold, it was always sacrificed in favor of the cities that actually made an income and therefore had the power to purchase food from abroad. Better have one city starve than all of them, after all.

Do say this IC, and give Koli a casus belli...  8)
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De-Legro

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #34: September 09, 2011, 07:53:43 AM »
You seem to forget that we don't play in the BattleMaster of 2006. To expand, we need nobles. We didn't have enough nobles to go back eastwards. And should you have not noticed, Port Nebel must be conquered first before any expansion into the eastern rurals can be made.

East would seem to be a poor way to expand, expanding west should give much more scope for actual food production.

We are always knocking on everyone's door for food. But the war against Caerwyn screwed us on an important supplier. And other realms are also seeing their cities grow and therefore their surpluses shrink

Exactly the insistence of D'Hara in maintaining both a main land and a island presence has resulted in an untenable food import situation. When your realm insists on being composed of 2 cities (sometimes 3) 3 townslands and only 1-2 rurals, well its time to reconsider what regions are worth holding and what options are available for more lands.

If the Lurians had the ability to feed Port Nebel, then if he cares about his religion so much he can sell D'Hara that very same food he'd give them. D'Hara isn't holding any food back from it's stupid peasants, and we can't do anything to stop immigration either. D'Hara is the land of retarded peasants that join en masse places they know they won't be able to find food in, and who complain against the government's taxes all the time therefore cutting the government's power to buy that very food they require. And if we expand to acquire more farmlands for them, well then they'll just burn it all down because there won't be enough nobles to watch over them. D'Haran peasants *want* to die. They worship the god of starvation, and pray every day for their warehouses to run out on the next day.

It is feasible the Lurians could feed the city, but then its unlikely that a realm notorious for infighting is going to do so just to keep Koli happy. If the City was part of the empire though, that would have been very different. I guess we could have done it for gold, but there rarely seems to be a lack of gold in the realm, I know several times I've offered several hundred gold for knights to improve their units and had no takers.
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Bedwyr

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #35: September 09, 2011, 08:07:17 AM »
You seem to forget that we don't play in the BattleMaster of 2006. To expand, we need nobles. We didn't have enough nobles to go back eastwards. And should you have not noticed, Port Nebel must be conquered first before any expansion into the eastern rurals can be made.

Absolute nonsense.  D'hara held Port Nebel and Nebel for years without making a go at Qubel or the Lighthouse, and my entire point was that holding onto cities when you can't feed them is silly.  If you couldn't secure additional food sources, you needed to abandon either Port Nebel or Paisly to focus on securing further food production.

Quote
De-Legro was in D'Hara... when it was small, when all the cities had 1% production due to low population at all times basically, and when there were more nobles. We had more rurals back then to feed smaller cities. Port Raviel and Paisly have grown considerably since these days. We didn't even need to import any food at all in these days, even when we had Sallowtown (which was lost due to rogues, not lack of food).

Also absolute nonsense.  I recall the Ports with tens of thousands in population, and I know De-Legro was there at the same time.  Food needed to be imported, but it wasn't until Paisly was taken that the issue became devastating.

Quote
As soon as the new estates system will be implemented, we'll be more than happy to go back to colonize all of our claimed lands. Until then, estates won't allow us. We were already stretched thin before someone started a TO of Qubel, and that was thanks to a few migrants from Caerwyn and beyond. Wouldn't have even been imaginable before. Estate cover would have been so bad that the cities would have been absolutely worthless.

Again, my entire point was that you should have given up a city ages ago.

Quote
We are always knocking on everyone's door for food. But the war against Caerwyn screwed us on an important supplier. And other realms are also seeing their cities grow and therefore their surpluses shrink.

If the Lurians had the ability to feed Port Nebel, then if he cares about his religion so much he can sell D'Hara that very same food he'd give them. D'Hara isn't holding any food back from it's stupid peasants, and we can't do anything to stop immigration either. D'Hara is the land of retarded peasants that join en masse places they know they won't be able to find food in, and who complain against the government's taxes all the time therefore cutting the government's power to buy that very food they require. And if we expand to acquire more farmlands for them, well then they'll just burn it all down because there won't be enough nobles to watch over them. D'Haran peasants *want* to die. They worship the god of starvation, and pray every day for their warehouses to run out on the next day.

See my above points about giving up a city.

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If any other realm could do better, then that just means they are the problem themselves, as they are stockpiling food and refusing to feed the city.

No, it means we are working on increasing the population of our cities.

Quote
Koli's family could also just move out if they are too poor or stupid to use their noble powers to keep themselves fed. Hell, they must be like the peasants I mention, if they chose to live in Port Nebel instead of Paisly or Port Raviel. Port Nebel always was the poorest child. Since it rarely ever produced much gold, it was always sacrificed in favor of the cities that actually made an income and therefore had the power to purchase food from abroad. Better have one city starve than all of them, after all.

Koli's uncle was killed when the officials working for D'hara were lynched in the revolt.  Every region in the game has minor nobles (see diplomat action reports for confirmation) who serve as officials and the like, and when a region revolts the officials working for the government are lynched.

And again, if you cannot feed the city to the point where it starves down that far, then why are you bothering to hold it?
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Nosferatus

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #36: September 09, 2011, 08:47:02 AM »
you see how cool the south is kids?
What ever tread you start, it always ends up in a discussion about south Dwilight (or the saxons).
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Indirik

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #37: September 09, 2011, 02:40:38 PM »
Given the demonstrated D'Haran ability to manage cities, who the hell would give them one?
It's a D'Haran thing, losing control of cities. Just like rebelling is a Lurian thing.
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Ramiel

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #38: September 09, 2011, 04:06:29 PM »
Hmm I find myself toying with the idea of asking an SA realm if they would be prepared to share a joint colonization of a new Crusader State that would upset D'hara a ton. But then the price IC would be too high... at the moment anyway :D
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Indirik

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #39: September 09, 2011, 04:09:00 PM »
Hmm I find myself toying with the idea of asking an SA realm if they would be prepared to share a joint colonization of a new Crusader State that would upset D'hara a ton. But then the price IC would be too high... at the moment anyway :D
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Glaumring the Fox

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #40: September 09, 2011, 05:00:52 PM »
I inadvertly created the Saxons...  :(
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Ramiel

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #41: September 09, 2011, 05:04:02 PM »
Who has the nobles to spare?

Your the SA man, you tell me :D
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Peri

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #42: September 09, 2011, 05:35:56 PM »
Your the SA man, you tell me :D

We put the faith and the awesomeness, you put the nobles.

Vellos

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #43: September 16, 2011, 09:48:48 PM »
Question:

Why is Morek's CS graph so steadily downward sloping? TMP? Ya'll have had TMP for that long, with rogues in your south, and you've done nothing about it?
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Gustav Kuriga

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Re: North East Thread
« Reply #44: September 16, 2011, 10:21:55 PM »
They have tried going down south to get rid of TMP. The travel times are horrible though and there aren't many monsters spawning south of them for some reason. Possibly because Corsanctum is hunting them to get rid of TMP as well.