I have never encountered the Veinsormoot in-game in a meaningful way. Hireshmont has mentioned the name once or twice. But so what? I've never had to sign a treaty with the Veinsormoot. I've never had to negotiate a trade agreement with the Veinsormoot. I've never negotiated borders with the Veinsormoot. Yet I do all these things with the various realms that comprise the Veinsormoot. Never once has one of them said "I can't sign that treaty/agreement, you'll have to negotiate with the Veinsormoot."
So what you're saying is, "No, I don't actually read my messages."
I didn't mention it once or twice. We had about a 3-4 page back and forth about the Moot. You don't seem to recall that, which is strange to me.
Also, you haven't signed a treaty with the Moot, true. To my knowledge you haven't signed a treaty with any realm in the Moot. Nor have you negotiated borders with any realm in the Moot. My memory of it seems to be that Hireshmont and Brance both left rather in a huff.
However, Hireshmont
did say at the beginning, before things really got heated, that Hireshmont wouldn't sign an agreement until he had run it by the Moot. Apparently you forgot that as well. Admittedly, I did send quite a few rather long messages.
So, what incentive do I have to deal with the Veinsormoot, or learn anything about it?
The incentive of, if Brance does, he maybe won't continue collectively pissing off all of humanity south of Golden Farrow?
The members don't promote (except for the occasional mention of the name from Hireshmont).
See "sarcastic remark about Astrum." Astrum doesn't promote except for Brance. I can't remember the last time an Astrumite ambassador wandered down here to do or say anything. I know that a Moot representative was in Astrum and Iashalur less than two weeks ago. How 'bout dem applies?
I've never been told to go deal with them.
Yes you have, you just don't remember. And, even then, it'd be a moot point (no pun intended) since most of your interactions were with Hireshmont, who is Mootgram anyways, and compulsive about keeping the Elders informed about everything. Working with Hireshmont
is working with the Moot, because he checks everything through the Moot anyways. Though I suppose that isn't necessary something Brance would know; though maybe it should have clued you in that many of our messages included the rulers of D'Hara and Barca, and Hireshmont referenced very close coordination with D'Hara quite a few times.
And my dealings with the individual member states have not in any way been impacted, so far as I can tell, by the fact that they are members of this guild.
Which goes to show that you can't tell very far, because your relations with Terran, at least, have been very greatly affected by Terran's membership in a supranational government, and by Brance (and Allison's) decision to reject participation in it.
So, considering that I can get everything done that I need to get done without ever having to deal with this Veinsormoot in any way, what incentive do I have to invest the time and effort in learning about it and how to deal with it?
Again, because not doing so has already led to the title "Vasilif" being a derogatory term in Terran. I believe I've seen it punned as "Vassalif" a few times. Maybe Brance doesn't care about diplomacy in other realms; in which case he has nothing to gain.
As Lorgan even said, the Veinsormoot is actually detrimental to my purposes, as it forces me to deal with the realms as a whole. Which I don't really have to, because the members will deal with me individually.
The first sentence is reasonable enough; Brance can just make the decision not to work with the Moot. Fine. But, to reiterate, that is not what we were originally talking about. We were talking about the issue of
knowing about the Moot, and you claimed that Brance had never really had any encounters with the Moot and so couldn't be expected to know about it. The second sentence is false; to my knowledge, no Moot realm has engaged in
any truly substantive independent diplomacy with Astrum. I know D'Hara chats with Astrum occasionally, but I don't think they have any treaties or formal agreements with Astrum. If they do, they must be pretty secret.
IMO, if you want people to deal with the Veinsormoot, and make it into something more than just a simple guild, you need to make it easy for them to deal with the guild, and make it to their advantage.
We're not really struggling to get people to recognize the Moot. Madina, Aurvandil, and the Caerwynian contingent all have formal delegates sent to the Moot (not a specific realm); same is the case for Asylon. The Lurias could have such a thing if they wanted it; I suspect they'll get around to it eventually. Morek has a delegate in the Moot, and has had direct diplomacy with the Moot. Astrum is kind of the odd-man-out. The only significant foreigner, to my knowledge, that has "purely" bilateral relations with a Moot realm is probably Corsanctum with D'Hara.
Because right now, there is absolutely no incentive to or advantage in dealing with them. I don't know how you're going to do this. Game mechanics don't support it for guilds.
Yes there is.
Don't deal with it and you'll find it hard to make any diplomatic progress in the south. That simple. Maybe that doesn't bother you; fine. But if you want to get anything done anywhere in the Maroccidens, or related to it, without issues coming to violence or threats of violence, you go through the Moot. That's not a prescriptive thing, btw, it's descriptive. Historically, in the Maroccidens, you are either in the Moot, or relate directly through formal delegations with the Moot, or you are at war with/actively sabotaged by the Moot. "Peacefully but pointedly ignore" has not yet happened.
