Surrender duels as a training method

[Foundation]

So... remind me again why someone would accept a duel with such lopsided risk/reward?

[pcw27]

I don't see the point in making a mechanic for putting a title on the line in a duel. If a realm wants to establish a tradition like this there's nothing stopping them from roleplaying it.

Plus there's more roleplay potential as someone could lose a duel and live then try to refuse to give up his title. This could spark rebellions, secessions and wars. Lots of fun.

[Penchant]

I have no idea why a king, duke, or even baron would risk his position with no gain from it. If someone wants to duel for the position they should have to have a risk too not just the one being challenged. Also I doubt your rebellions, secessions and wars theory will really happen, the only thing I can see is the judge fining the title holder until he gives it up and even then its unfair because the one who dueled still has no way to gurantee they get because appointing has to be agreed upon by the duke and elections use either the lords or all nobles. Again its lopsided as one would risk a lot by challenging someone to a duel for the title in the first place and then they don't get anything from it except a reputation of being aggresive?

[egamma]

So... remind me again why someone would accept a duel with such lopsided risk/reward?

Perhaps the marquis is the one offended, and is willing to put his title on the line for satisfaction?

[Lorgan]

No, and absolutely "never, ever, over my dead body" on the "private duel". The whole point about duels is that they have an audience. Might not be a crowd, but if you want to have a 1-on-1, become an infiltrator.

You can do 1-on-1's with an infiltrator? Then why are there always guards around when I try to stab someone... 

[Lorgan]

I don't see the point in making a mechanic for putting a title on the line in a duel. If a realm wants to establish a tradition like this there's nothing stopping them from roleplaying it.

Plus there's more roleplay potential as someone could lose a duel and live then try to refuse to give up his title. This could spark rebellions, secessions and wars. Lots of fun.

Maybe you'd also need the consent of your ruler or duke, or maybe you'd need to have a couple of people sign a petition or something?
Some sort of addition that would make it so that you get the power to usurp someone, but you'd need more than just your sword skill.

[JPierreD]

Though these probably falls into the realm of overcomplicating things, they also add both motivation for someone of upper station to duel someone of lower and create the notion of "champion":

a)Fight not only for occupying the title, but also for appointing the title holder. That way Duke Kepler duels Duel Weakling for his loyal Vassal Puppet to inherit the Weaklingstan Duchy, but risking losing Keplerstan Duchy to Duke Weakling.

b) Want it moar complicated instead? One noble writes a "contract" which other one or three noble(s) will have to accept for the duel to happen. Two nobles duel and the title goes to the winner or the winner's sponsor.

P.S.: Tom, please don't hate us for dreaming.

[vonGenf]

Though these probably falls into the realm of overcomplicating things, they also add both motivation for someone of upper station to duel someone of lower and create the notion of "champion":

a)Fight not only for occupying the title, but also for appointing the title holder. That way Duke Kepler duels Duel Weakling for his loyal Vassal Puppet to inherit the Weaklingstan Duchy, but risking losing Keplerstan Duchy to Duke Weakling.

b) Want it moar complicated instead? One noble writes a "contract" which other one or three noble(s) will have to accept for the duel to happen. Two nobles duel and the title goes to the winner or the winner's sponsor.

P.S.: Tom, please don't hate us for dreaming.

These are all fine roleplaying ideas. They can be enforced in game. I don't think new mechanic is needed.

[Tom]

So... remind me again why someone would accept a duel with such lopsided risk/reward?

Because honour demands it. It is exactly when it is not a gamey null-sum game that we can find roleplaying happening.

[Foundation]

Well, tell me that again when someone who doesn't have high swordfighting skills accepts such a challenge for his position from someone else who does.  I accept your explanation in theory, but I'd be surprised to see it in practice.

[fodder]

heh. a geriatric king fighting some young knight for the king title.. XD

[JPierreD]

These are all fine roleplaying ideas. They can be enforced in game. I don't think new mechanic is needed.

I'd like any of them happening without game mechanics to support them.

[Galle]

Barony of Makar has a tradition of allowing duels for positions when there is several, equally qualified applicants.

As this is neither a duel of honour nor a challenge to someone already holding a position, the new proposed system would actually be more awkward rp-wise for us than the old one...

[JPierreD]

Barony of Makar has a tradition of allowing duels for positions when there is several, equally qualified applicants.

As this is neither a duel of honour nor a challenge to someone already holding a position, the new proposed system would actually be more awkward rp-wise for us than the old one...

Hmm, fair enough.