Luria

[Lorgan]

You guys are having a holiday? Damn it!

[Nosferatus]

I think that should be easily furnished before the week is out.

(Unless American Thanksgiving wrecks our movement too badly, I suppose.)

Darn yankees!

swipe them off the map, please!

[Solari]

I think that should be easily furnished before the week is out.

SHUT UP, ANARIS. It's under-promise and over-deliver. You've got it backwards. 

[Penchant]

It's much simpler than that.

D'Hara wants to keep a balance of powers. Without LV, D'Hara is all alone in that part of the world.

Exactly, since LN already offered LV peace once we see it as them wanting to get one realm out of the war so they beat whoever stays then afterwards they kill the remaining realm. Maybe that wouldn't happen but do you really think we are going to trust the aggressive plotting lurians of LN, especially when we have evidence against them?

[egamma]

Which is more important to you: keeping LV alive—a realm that's only been your ally for a short time, that you can't actually keep alive anyway—or seeing Aurvandil destroyed?

The last time we trusted LN to attack Aurvandil, they ended up attacking D'Hara instead. That, given the distance involved, gives D'Hara exactly zero confidence that LN surviving would be of any help whatsoever to the war with Aurvandil.

[Penchant]

The last time we trusted LN to attack Aurvandil, they ended up attacking D'Hara instead. That, given the distance involved, gives D'Hara exactly zero confidence that LN surviving would be of any help whatsoever to the war with Aurvandil.

Well surviving and being allowed to take out LV are two separate things, but otherwise that is true.

[Anaris]

The last time we trusted LN to attack Aurvandil, they ended up attacking D'Hara instead. That, given the distance involved, gives D'Hara exactly zero confidence that LN surviving would be of any help whatsoever to the war with Aurvandil.

Erm...

By what convolution of logic do you think that LV can take out LN?

For that matter, what makes you think that even D'Hara and LV combined are any serious threat to LN's survival?

If you had Morek on your side, then yeah, there might be a chance. But they've already said that if you keep insisting on tying yourselves to LV, they're washing their hands of you.

[Solari]

The last time we trusted LN to attack Aurvandil, they ended up attacking D'Hara instead. That, given the distance involved, gives D'Hara exactly zero confidence that LN surviving would be of any help whatsoever to the war with Aurvandil.

We all know the details of this by now, and everyone has their IC reasons for perpetuating the war, but let's be clear about WHY Luria suddenly went from war with Aurvandil to war with D'Hara. D'Hara seriously entertained the notion of either coming to the aid of Fissoa in its war with LN or allowing Aurvandil to pass through so THEY could come to the aid of Fissoa, solely in a pragmatic attempt to deal with a potential threat before it had emerged. That is why Luria went to war with D'Hara. They were the proximate threat.

[Penchant]

We all know the details of this by now, and everyone has their IC reasons for perpetuating the war, but let's be clear about WHY Luria suddenly went from war with Aurvandil to war with D'Hara. D'Hara seriously entertained the notion of either coming to the aid of Fissoa in its war with LN or allowing Aurvandil to pass through so THEY could come to the aid of Fissoa, solely in a pragmatic attempt to deal with a potential threat before it had emerged. That is why Luria went to war with D'Hara. They were the proximate threat.

Honestly, I have never heard any of these suggestions before as a member of D'hara but I had little political power at the time to be informed of plans though too. The thing that gets me is you are buddy buddy with Fissoa but since we considered helping an ally, we are the bad guys, not the ally.

[Solari]

Honestly, I have never heard any of these suggestions before as a member of D'hara but I had little political power at the time to be informed of plans though too. The thing that gets me is you are buddy buddy with Fissoa but since we considered helping an ally, we are the bad guys, not the ally.

The alliance with Fissoa came after Skyndarbau was ousted. Luria mostly goes to war over individuals, not realms. The problem with Aurvandil is Mendicant, and with LV it's Bipel (and a few others), for example.

[Stabbity]

D'hara damn near allied with Aurvandil. They brought the war on themselves. I know, I was there and trying to pish Rynn to forsake the moot and ally with Aurvandil :p Which I would have then publically denounced and laughed maniacly.

[Solari]

Takeover Initiated   (just in)
message to all nobles of Luria Nova
Sha'shanti el Gato has initiated a takeover in Shinnen Purlieus. The region currently belongs to Luria Vesperi.

Welp.

[Chenier]

LN has no desire to help Aurvandil. We'd be perfectly happy to help you destroy them.

There is just one thing standing in our way, and that's you, D'Hara. If you would give us peace, we'd clean up LV quite quickly, then join in the war against Aurvandil.

So, no, LN is not the de-facto ally of Aurvandil right now. It's D'Hara, who is doing everything they can to prevent LN from joining the war on the side of the north.

Right. Because D'Hara was totally the one to declare war on you, and because this war totally happened before Aurvandil attacked.

For sure, it's totally D'Hara's fault.

[Chenier]

Personally, I still don't know what the allegations against Sevastian are about. (The original ones. The ones that led to his banishment are much more obvious.)

The point is, though, Luria has been willing to make peace with D'Hara for some time now. It's D'Hara that's refusing, because apparently their people have "romanticized" Luria Vesperi as some kind of knights in shining armour...and therefore, they're worth blocking war with Aurvandil over.

LV is a lever against LN. We expect LN to backstab us again in the future, LV is a buffer against this. Rynn may romanticize them, but for most D'Harans, it can be pretty much summed up to this imo.

Because if LN gets peace with D'Hara and strikes at LV, it's still not fighting Aurvandil anyways.

[Anaris]

Right. Because D'Hara was totally the one to declare war on you, and because this war totally happened before Aurvandil attacked.

Never tried to claim this. All I'm claiming is that right now, D'Hara is the one holding things up.

LV is a lever against LN. We expect LN to backstab us again in the future, LV is a buffer against this. Rynn may romanticize them, but for most D'Harans, it can be pretty much summed up to this imo.

Because if LN gets peace with D'Hara and strikes at LV, it's still not fighting Aurvandil anyways.

Erm...I really, really don't know what you expect LV to do against LN. Even if LV and LN were the same size, great muppety Odin those guys are incompetent!

And, as I'm sure you've already seen, the takeovers have started. LV will not last that much longer.

I'm curious—do you know whether D'Hara will fold, once LV has been totally destroyed, and accept peace in order to destroy Aurvandil? Or will you insist upon revenge, despite the facts that it will be completely impossible for you to destroy Luria Nova, and that it will prevent the destruction of Aurvandil, the single greatest threat on Dwilight to...well, to everyone who's not Aurvandil. (Or, possibly, Glaumring. Not sure about that one.)