CE-Tara Federation

[GoldPanda]

Well, CE and its colony realms are mostly "Medival-Roman" flavored. Some realms put more effort into the "Roman" part than others. I always imagined that Cagilan Senators wore togas over their armor, at least when they are in Cagil.

... Hey that's it! We have to conquer other realms and form buffer states. We are Roman. You don't tell a Viking to stop looting, do you?

Stop oppressing our culture, man. 

[Dante Silverfire]

Well, CE and its colony realms are mostly "Medival-Roman" flavored. Some realms put more effort into the "Roman" part than others. I always imagined that Cagilan Senators wore togas over their armor, at least when they are in Cagil.

... Hey that's it! We have to conquer other realms and form buffer states. We are Roman. You don't tell a Viking to stop looting, do you?

Stop oppressing our culture, man. 

You're right I don't tell a viking to stop looting. I just kill him. He usually stops at that point.

I guess the rest of Atamara could do the same thing to CE. Just kill the romans, they'll eventually stop colonizing you after a few millennium pass. But not until every single realm has a Senate and worships Caesar (Enri) as a god.

So, I guess we just wait for CE to fall apart through internal bad governance like Rome did?

[Gustav Kuriga]

Funny how most of the support for the status quo comes from CE-Tara...

[GoldPanda]

But not until every single realm has a Senate and worships Caesar (Enri) as a god.

Sadly, we both know that the northern barbarians are too uncivilized to ever be able to adopt glorious RomanCagilan culture.

Funny how most of the support for the status quo comes from CE-Tara...

Err, no. Unless you define "Funny" as "It makes sense that". Most people don't. 

[Eirikr]

And that breeds complacency. The last time CE marched on BoM, Sordnaz threw a hissy fit in the rulers' channel. He couldn't imagine that anyone would dare to invade his realm. And it's true. You have to be a special breed of crazy to invade BoM. BoM is like Russia except it's winter all the time.

Wait, when was that? I don't even remember.

Sadly, we both know that the northern barbarians are too uncivilized to ever be able to adopt glorious RomanCagilan culture.

This is slowly turning into a realistic history session... Set up a colosseum and throw them in as gladiators! They might enjoy that, though.

[LilWolf]

How long has it been since a region bearing a Darkan and Makarian banner has been attacked? Years?

Three years or so for Darka. Back when we took Massillion from Eston. We've had to make some tough decisions to keep things that way so don't say we've had it easy.

And that breeds complacency. The last time CE marched on BoM, Sordnaz threw a hissy fit in the rulers' channel. He couldn't imagine that anyone would dare to invade his realm.

Like the ruler of Tara who has complained endlessly about Darka looting his lands and called us dishonorable etc. because of it? Funny he had no problems with it when our army was on his side

All you need is a silly person as a ruler to get silly tantrums.

So excuse me if I tune off every time someone starts going off again about how easy CE and Tara have it on AT.

They've had tough times. Tara could easily have been killed had some choices been made in another way years ago. Sadly, can't change the past.

[jaune]

I cant say that i enjoy the current situation at Atamara, but then again, i really must raise my hat how CE has managed to keep things together.

It will be intresting to see how it will evolve from now. Will CE slap northeners more and continue its war efforts... Now things might get real intresting. How strong is "alliance" between Coria & Eston and Coria & CE... will Estons "gamble" that they protected Coria pay off now and Coria will come to help them. If not, that should open up Estons eyes for true color of Corians.

Will Darka continue help Eston? I think so, we dont want CE/Coria as our neighbour. Mainly i would wish war to end and let things to get stabilized a bit so we could see a bit where everybody stands. I think there are some uneasy relations and relations which need much work to get them back to proper state. Coria / Tara, Darka / Talerium... dont know much of situation at Abbylandia at south.

Back to the topic... yeah, annoying situation but i think and trust that this game balances itself at some point.

[Sonya]

I honestly never thought that would be possible, the islands are pretty damn huge.

At first when realms had grow without penalty, all they have to do was move the capital city to the new conquered Duchy, but then it was forbidden, but still, we  had the issue of realm having the ability to nearly take over a continent.

Then it was implemented the Distance-From-Capital penalty. After that, huge realms were at disadvantages, then they find a way to increase expansion with satellite realms, Conquer+Create, it happens in every continent, and until it becomes impossible to create a new realm for Expansion Purpose, it will always happens.

From an outside point of view everyone can see that Game Mechanics have been used well, but separating the Federation, will solve nothing, because the players of all these realm were at the beginning in the same realm, so it will happen again, and again with just a different banner.

I will repeat myself:

"Until it becomes impossible to create a new realm for Expansion Purpose, it will always happens"

[vonGenf]

There is one gameplay/mechanic issue I see in this whole question and that is that the BM worlds are isolated, so once you effectively control an island, there is nowhere challengers could come from except from within.

I honestly never thought that would be possible, the islands are pretty damn huge.

If CE effectively controlled the whole island, I think challenge would come from within. Nobody would like playing without any challenge at all.

If a block is truly united, then it is because they see outside forces as effectively threatening. Unity is not a natural direction to go towards without a threat.

[Anaris]

If CE effectively controlled the whole island, I think challenge would come from within. Nobody would like playing without any challenge at all.

If a block is truly united, then it is because they see outside forces as effectively threatening. Unity is not a natural direction to go towards without a threat.

So how do you explain the Long Peace?

[Geronus]

All that takes great political skills and a good base of Loyalty, i respect that. i would not like to see them apart. Now the northern alliance have to rebuild and come back with a better plan in hand to start another Great Continent Wide War.

Keep it going!


ps:
*: East Continent

Because the last one was so much fun... ? Ahem. !@#$ that. I have absolutely no interest in providing bread and circuses for the players in the federation. I think it's been well established that their federation is untouchable so long as it remains united, so really all we would be doing is continuing to entertain those players, thereby robbing them of any incentive to shake things up or pursue the kind of internal conflicts that might actually have a chance of changing the status quo.

Can we add an option to the poll for "Horrific daimon invasion"?

[vonGenf]

So how do you explain the Long Peace?

There is a difference between gridlock and control! Long peace can come about when two secure groups are both strong enough to defend themselves, but not strong enough to attack the other.

If one group truly controlled the whole continent, there wouldn't be anything to defend from.

[Geronus]

If one group truly controlled the whole continent, there wouldn't be anything to defend from.

There are realms not in the federation, if that's what you mean. As long as the federation stays together though, they are hardly a threat. Control is not the word to use, but you cannot deny that the federation has hegemonic status on Atamara. They are fully capable of enforcing long periods of peace on the island, should it suit them.

[Anaris]

There is a difference between gridlock and control! Long peace can come about when two secure groups are both strong enough to defend themselves, but not strong enough to attack the other.

If one group truly controlled the whole continent, there wouldn't be anything to defend from.

I think you're still missing two important elements, though.

The first is the tendency for people in positions of power—particularly relatively unimaginative people in positions of power—to do everything they can to maintain that power. This often means maintaining the status quo, even when it might be against the players' best interests—or even the realm's best interests.

The second if the tendency for ordinary players to accept the status quo, and even help to preserve it through minor actions.  In most places in the game, internal strife and a desire to break apart are very hard to instill in any but a very small proportion of the population. This is why even though a lot of people in Old Grehk were frustrated, bored, and angry about it, King Vagabond was able to keep them out of wars for over a year, and still maintain his throne. This is why the Long Peace had to be broken with lightning bolts—not with rebellions or other internal conflicts.

[vonGenf]

There are realms not in the federation, if that's what you mean. As long as the federation stays together though, they are hardly a threat. Control is not the word to use, but you cannot deny that the federation has hegemonic status on Atamara. They are fully capable of enforcing long periods of peace on the island, should it suit them.

But, how are they able to enforce periods of peace? By threatening war to those who refuse to remain peaceful.

But if they carry on their threat, then you have a war, so problem solved! You have wars until such a point where they factually control the whole continent (i.e. all rulers are "they", whichever side they ends up being). At this point, the worst thing you could do would be to present them with an external threat. If they fear, then they will remain united and huddle together.

Note that I'm not trying to argue that gridlock is good (I don't think it is), I'm arguing that presenting an external threat in the form of cross-island links would not help the situation.