I'm going to be lazy and just copy paste the whole array of IC and OOC messages, since they get confused in the middle.
As far as I'm concerned Stabbity is correct in the sense that Orders were not being followed and fines were correctly required. However, his way of phrasing it may be the issue here. We've been in the region for more than 5 days - more than enough time to determine if people are following Orders or not.
Orders from Magnus Himoura (1 day, 4 hours ago)
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Ladies and Gentlemen,
Everyone in Paplarmi is to be spendjng all of their hours every turn supporting the takeover. I can count on one hand the number of nobles that helped support the takeover last turn. I do not wish to ask fines but if that is what it will take I will. We need to finish this takeover and it requires EVERYONE'S support.
Sir Magnus Himoura
Commander of Kindara
Count of Edairn
Out-of-Character from Daven Aerinia (1 day, 4 hours ago)
Message sent to all allies in the region Paplarmi (23 recipients)
Not every action results in a public message. I know only about a 1/3 of my support actions get reported. Not sure what determines it.
Lane Malone
Letter from Julias Talboh (1 day, 4 hours ago)
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I feel as if threatening to demand fines against anybody who does not support this takeover on an hourly basis may be a poor way to motivate us. We are nobles, and we have inalienable rights, Commander. Do not threaten to ignore them again.
Julias Talboh
Knight of Osaliel
Letter from Magnus Himoura (1 day, 3 hours ago)
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Not following orders is not a right you possess Sir Julius. I would advise you to refrain from threatening myself. If we are to win this war, orders must be followed, and it is quite clear not everyone is supporting the takeover, or it would have been finished, or nearing completion.
Sir Magnus Himoura
Commander of Kindara
Count of Edairn
Letter from Julias Talboh (1 day, 3 hours ago)
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While refusing to follow orders is, perhaps, an action which might warrant punishment, failure to follow a passive order 100% of the time would not. This is inarguable. Furthermore, please point out the precise moment when I threatened you, for I seem to have misunderstood my own words if that is what I have done. All I did was make a demand that was well within my rights. I am not advocating the ignoring of your orders -- on the contrary, you will find that I have been supporting both of the recent takeovers with almost all of my time. My complaint now revolves around your chosen method of attempting to threaten the nobles under your command into respecting you. You must agree that to do so is not the proper way to earn respect. If we are to win this war, Commander, you must make wise and strong decisions. Deciding to word your orders in such a way that they included a threat that you could not possibly follow up on was neither wise nor strong.
Really, I am not trying to undermine your authority or to insult your honor. I only mean to see you thrive as a commander.
Best wishes,
Julias Talboh
Knight of Osaliel
Letter from Magnus Himoura (1 day, 3 hours ago)
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Sir Julius,
A demand and a threat are often one and the same. Particularly in my vocabulary, since I have little time or patience for the verbose grammatical gymnastics of a politician. I suggest you spend some time contemplating why making demands of your Commander is inappropriate behavior. I would also suggest taking some time to consider that if I did not feel it warranted, I would have not made my statement. It has been suggested that about 1/3rd of takeover actions get reported at large, well if that is the case, then six nobles participated in the takeover of Paplarmi during the last 12 hour period. We are at war, and orders to takeover a region are not passive orders, nor are they complicated. They are essential. Time is important, and every hour we stand around waiting for Paplarmi to fall is another hour where Arcaea finally might get its act together and come to help support Zonasa. I have no doubt with Cathay in close proximity, we would defeat them in battle, but it would slow the efforts to end Zonasa's capability to wage war. That is why I make demands, that is why I issue orders. That is why I expect them followed, and why I would start to consider fines. Every person not actively participating in the takeover is risking the lives of every Kindaran in Paplarmi by lengthening our stay. We have Zonasa right where I want them, the time to press the advantage is now.
Sir Magnus Himoura
Commander of Kindara
Count of Edairn
Letter from Julias Talboh (1 day, 3 hours ago)
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Commander,
You have managed to explain why it is important to follow orders. I applaud your explanation, for it is quite clear: if we do not follow orders, then things do not get done. Again, though, you are telling this to a man who has been following orders thoroughly and expeditiously ever since he has taken an estate in Kindara. What you have not done is explain how fining nobles for doing nothing is something that is within yours or anyone's power. Other than that, I have no interest in extending this argument any longer, and I would rather not get reprimanded for causing unnecessary conflict within the realm, so let us call this a one-time complaint. I shall speak no more on the subject, so if you feel the need to continue to defend your words instead of admitting that you may have chosen them very poorly, then I welcome you to do so without any further opposition, though you may find it to be a quite pointless action.
Perhaps it would have been wiser to contain this argument to a private discussion after my first letter. I do so hate to make such a thing a public affair, but I felt the need to defend the rights of my peers. Many apologies.
Regards,
Julias Talboh
Knight of Osaliel
Letter from Alma Aeterdust (1 day, 3 hours ago)
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Sir Julias, you should not apologize for raising these points. I must say I do share some of your doubts. I wonder at the method one might employ to determine which one of us hasn't been following the order to support the takeover. I also wonder at the time, effort and manpower accomplishing such a feat might entail... wouldn't these resources be better employed to support the takeover?
Commander Magnus, you said you have no patience for grammatical gymnastics. You also said you do not wish to ask for fines, but you will. Is that not just a politician's way of saying that one way or another, you will make us do whatever it is you want us to do? Granted, what you want us to do at present is a worthy task, but please, either speak plainly or stop claiming you always do so.
And when you say you do not wish to ask fines, you truly should mean it, instead of trying to craft a less threatening turn of phrase. Would you rather we support the takeover so that Kindara might prevail in this war and flourish or so that we won't get fined? Such a choice should not be...
My regards,
Alma Aeterdust
Dame of Hatdhes
Letter from Julias Talboh (1 day, 3 hours ago)
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Worry not, Dame Alma, for my apologies were entirely sarcastic. I am glad to learn that I am not the only one here who understands what it means to have his rights threatened.
Julias Talboh
Knight of Osaliel
Orders from Magnus Himoura (1 day, 3 hours ago)
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Sir Julias,
I will not tolerate insubordination, which is what your words are. Speak in a similar tone again, and you shall face punishment.
Since it is not abundantly clear to you, a very basic concept which is taught to young children of noble houses, fines are a means of discipline. Discipline is in place to ensure that undesirable behavior is not repeated. If undesirable behavior is present in a military situation, people die. If it repeats, those guilty need to be adjusted so that the behavior does not continue, costing more lives, and possibly, the war. This is war, you do what you're told, and live with the consequences if you don't. If you would prefer to moan and complain, I'm sure I can find a knitting circle in Masahakon to assign you to instead of the army. My predecessor died on these fields, died hoping for nothing but a Kindaran victory in this war, and I'll be damned if I don't see to that happening, and the whining of a couple nobles who don't like hearing that they have to follow orders.
I sincerely do not want to fine anyone. I want everyone to do their jobs without me having to bang my head against the wall and deal with your constant bemoaning of good military order. But, if I do not see another way to ensure that good military order is enforced, I will have fines levied. That gold could be put to better use in the pockets of a noble who contributes to the war effort. I also assure you that it is an easy matter to see who supports the takeover or not.
Lords,
Put your vassals in line.
Sir Magnus Himoura
Commander of Kindara
Count of Edairn
Orders from Magnus Himoura (1 day, 2 hours ago)
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Henceforth,
All nobles of Kindara are required to send me a copy of their report after taking action to support the takeover.
Good day,
Sir Magnus Himoura
Commander of Kindara
Count of Edairn
Roleplay from Alma Aeterdust (1 day, 2 hours ago)
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Alma rolled her eyes upon reading the latest issued orders.
"Why of course, Commander, would you also like a report of my daily visits to the outhouse with that? It would be no bother, not at all a waste of my time, to record the hours of my visits in a ledger, to have my scribe transcribe them every evening and have a runner deliver them to you..."
Roleplay from Magnus Himoura (1 day, 2 hours ago)
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Magnus had been on rounds, checking on the troops, and so happned to overhear Alma. He set his warhammer on the ground, and cleared his throat.
"No I would not Dame Alma, but it is increasingly apparent you need babysitting. You and one of your men are to report to my tent in 15 minutes. Tell my captain you are present to guard my chamber pot." Magnus growled, and stormed off.
Roleplay from Alma Aeterdust (1 day, 2 hours ago)
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Alma smirked as the Commander stormed off. "Why of course, it would be my honor..."
She turned to one of the men standing guard at her tent. "Send captain Rein to me, will you? Only the best for the Commander's chamber pot..."
15 minutes later and the Commander's captain didn't even raise an eyebrow when she explained the reason for her presence in the tent. Outstanding discipline, Alma mused to herself. Of course, he wasn't quite so disciplined when Rein carried the Commander's chamber pot out of the tent, Alma following in his wake.
"What are you doing?" the man demanded, trying to block their path.
Alma pointed at the chamber pot then shot a meaningful look at the captain blocking her way. "The Commander did not specify where I should be guarding his chamber pot." The man didn't move, so Alma continued. "He also didn't specify if the pot should be left full or empty. The former appears to be true at present, but that can quickly change."
He did move then.
"Why, thank you. Do tell the Commander his chamber pot will be most comfortable and safe in my tent. I will even write him a report of how the pot spent the night, should he so desire. Oh, and don't forget to give him this," she said, handing a letter to the man. "Let's go, Rein. A sleepless night guarding a treasured chamber pot awaits. Don't you think the Commander knows how to use his resources most wisely?"
Letter from Alma Aeterdust (1 day, 2 hours ago)
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Commander Magnus,
Where exactly are these nobles who don't like hearing that they have to follow orders? Sir Julias obviously can't be one, I do believe we all got the report not long ago that he did in fact follow your orders and support the takeover. So is it me? It might surprise you to find I sent my men out for a cultural exchange this evening. Of course, you have only my word for it and I guess my word doesn't mean much to you so feel free to fine me, I'm sure my finances can withstand it.
And that is my biggest concern on your proposed method of getting us to heel. You're putting a price, a monetary value, on insubordination. So I guess we can stop asking ourselves what the repercussion of our failing to follow orders will be on the realm and just stick to what those repercussion will mean to our finances... Is that truly how you want us to view orders: something we can do or not do and lose some money? I fail to see how that is effective in getting us to follow orders...
I should point out that not all children are brought up in the same way and different noble house might have different views on methods of discipline. Shocking, I know. I do feel bad for you, you show signs of having had a rather unfortunate childhood.
Still, if you wanted to lead a crowd of senseless creatures that do whatever you want them to do with little to no complains regardless of how you treat them, you should've been a shepherd.
My regards,
Alma Aeterdust
Dame of Hatdhes
