Author Topic: The Way Forward  (Read 53801 times)

Foxglove

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #105: August 26, 2013, 04:47:53 PM »
And that is precisely why I won't allow hotmail. It's full of retards like that. There's a reason it was blocked once, you know? It's not like it has always been blocked, right from the go.

Up until a few years ago, the vast majority of people I know had a Hotmail address as their primary (or only) email account. Teachers, publishers, university lecturers, research scientists.... not an idiot among 'em. At the time, I used an @activemail address (now defunct), and they gave me strange looks and asked why I didn't use Hotmail. I imagine very few people would bother to create a new email account just to play a game (mind you, I did!). I've always presumed Hotmail being the subject of internet jokes and ridicule is mainly because it's linked to Microsoft, and internet afficionardos hate all spawn of Bill Gates.

Blocking Hotmail (and also Outlook, I presume? Because it's essentially the same thing) probably does cost BM a substantial amount of casual players - total conjecture, of course, unless the system measures how many people try to sign up using Hotmail. I went into the bank a few weeks ago and the cashiers behind the counter asked for an email address and I said, "Just let me think which email I want linked to it." And their response was, "You have more than one email?" Which, in a completely subjective way, shows that there are people who won't even consider using more than one email address if technology doesn't play a major role in their day-to-day life.

However, I think it was once said somewhere on here that Hotmail addresses were blocked because they are (were?) the email of choice for hackers. If that's still true and allowing Hotmail addresses would increase attacks against the game, and cause Devs to spend more time sorting out the problems, I can see why the block is in place. I've seen a small handful of other indie web games that disallow Hotmail accounts, so I suppose they must also have had trouble at some point in their existence and don't have the time or resources to deal with the problem.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2013, 04:51:04 PM by Foxglove »

Tom

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #106: August 26, 2013, 05:51:13 PM »
I've always presumed Hotmail being the subject of internet jokes and ridicule is mainly because it's linked to Microsoft, and internet afficionardos hate all spawn of Bill Gates.
[...]
I've seen a small handful of other indie web games that disallow Hotmail accounts, so I suppose they must also have had trouble at some point in their existence and don't have the time or resources to deal with the problem.

Back when I decided to block it, hotmail was a MAJOR pain in the ass. They didn't respect the mail protocols fully, leading to backscatter and random errors, which resulted in clogging my outgoing pipes with bounces and failed delivery messages AND they didn't even have a technical contact one could reach AND they ignored everyone else on the Internet.

Yes, MS is a major factor, but not because of the name, but because of the attitude. This "!@#$ everyone else, we don't give a !@#$" approach of pissing into the swimming pool.

That, and the fact that at that time, a large fraction of the trolls and cheaters we banned were hotmail users. Maybe just because it was popular, but even accounting for that, it was unreasonably large. Blocking hotmail dramatically improved the quality of the new players we got.


As I said: That was then and now is now. Things may have changed, but I don't do stuff like that just because I don't like MS. Heck, if I did, don't you think I would've blocked @microsoft.com e-mails first?

SaDiablo

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #107: August 26, 2013, 05:56:21 PM »
Heh, I remember the multi's from those day.  The things Tom did was to protect his game so the points your making about hotmail are good points but you need to see it from his pov more.   

Besides, I thought hotmail merge into another mail and ceased to exist from the days long ago?

Anaris

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #108: August 26, 2013, 05:58:25 PM »
I should note that, though I haven't asked Tom about it yet (which is part of why it's not live yet...), I have been reworking the new account signup process, and as part of that, I have removed the restriction on Hotmail addresses.

Tom, I think it would be worthwhile to remove this restriction at least on a trial basis. You know I'm right there with you on what Hotmail was like, but I've seen some circumstantial evidence that it's improved in the decade since then, and if it's not being an active pain in the ass now, I don't see any reason to cut ourselves off from a relatively significant chunk of Internet users, even if their choice in email provider is a little questionable ;D
Timothy Collett

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trying

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #109: August 26, 2013, 06:43:36 PM »
Hotmail is now Outlook.com. Microsoft keeps rebranding their stuff.

egamma

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #110: August 26, 2013, 07:15:33 PM »
Hotmail is now Outlook.com. Microsoft keeps rebranding their stuff.

True, but if you have a hotmail address, you will still sign in with that. Or with @msn.com, or @live.com, or @outlook.com. Tom's not blocking the website, he's blocking the email address.

Tom

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #111: August 26, 2013, 11:57:55 PM »
Tom, I think it would be worthwhile to remove this restriction at least on a trial basis.

Ok.


Jaden

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #112: August 28, 2013, 01:19:32 PM »
So have we decided on the Locals forum?
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Tom

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #113: August 28, 2013, 01:55:23 PM »
So have we decided on the Locals forum?

No, because every constructive discussion always gets hijacked by some pet issue. If you didn't share my opinion on forums before, maybe you do now. ;-)

Geronus

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #114: August 28, 2013, 02:05:19 PM »
No, because every constructive discussion always gets hijacked by some pet issue. If you didn't share my opinion on forums before, maybe you do now. ;-)

I think we're now waiting for the Mods to develop and publish their new set of rules, which are purportedly similar to the ones I wrote up. Once those are established, I was thinking that the Locals could make a come back on a trial basis to see how the new rules and improved moderation work out.

Azerax

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #115: August 28, 2013, 02:53:09 PM »
No, because every constructive discussion always gets hijacked by some pet issue. If you didn't share my opinion on forums before, maybe you do now. ;-)

My not really so humble opinion on locals:
open them up, smash the a$$holes and ban their characters.  3 strikes and you're mush.

Forbes Family

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #116: August 29, 2013, 01:48:33 AM »
My not really so humble opinion on locals:
open them up, smash the a$$holes and ban their characters.  3 strikes and you're mush.

And we loose more players. Even "a$$holes" on the forum may be playing good constructive characters.
Forbes Family

Penchant

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #117: August 29, 2013, 01:52:31 AM »
My not really so humble opinion on locals:
open them up, smash the a$$holes and ban their characters.  3 strikes and you're mush.
There is no good reason to do anything to their characters. If Tom thinks its so clear certain players are just complete !@#$%^&s on the forums, he can ban them from the forum, but there is no reason to ban them from the game because of the forums.
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Valast

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #118: August 29, 2013, 02:18:26 AM »
No, because every constructive discussion always gets hijacked by some pet issue. If you didn't share my opinion on forums before, maybe you do now. ;-)

I am ready to wad the forum up and trash it... It always seems as if a couple of people with way too much time force opinions on others in a forum war... not commenting/ignoring on some to kill discussion or picking apart posts because it gives them a feeling of power and involvement. 

The less time people spend in here the more they can spend in the game.  Get board in game, then figure out wish list/bug fix/invite friends to play...

Damn but the old days were better...even with in game messaging flame wars.

Only reason I can think to keep it open is for communication of newbs for help...  but then again we have the wiki which is a much more pleasant place.

This place is a heap of hubris and tripe.










Geronus

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Re: The Way Forward
« Reply #119: August 29, 2013, 03:08:59 AM »
Why do you read it at all if that's how you feel about it?

That's one part of this that always got me; if people can't stand the forums, why don't they just stay away? No one has to come here, any more than they have to play the game. If I stopped enjoying Battlemaster, I wouldn't play anymore. Likewise, if I couldn't stand the forum, I wouldn't bother with it.