What prevents game to be competitive... i.e. to be a game.

[vonGenf]

The red paper was taken away from the general, to the point where the general had very little to do and had to rely on the marshals, who may or may not have been active players. Since generals were not allowed (IIRC) to tell dukes who to appoint as marshals, the whole military command system broke down.

I don't know if that was true at one point, but at this time in history it is false in three different ways:

• Everyone can send red paper Orders, it's an IC event and if you are powerful enough to get people to follow, then you do it.
• Any region Lord can sponsor an army, it's not limited to Dukes, and in fact the General can do so himself
• Marshals can be replaced at will, and you can combine being General and Marshal if it suits you

[MarshalN]

There are clearly written rules. They are called the Inalienable Rights, and it is the responsibility of everyone in any position of power in BattleMaster to know and follow them.

In fact, the inalienable right to be inactive has been a part of BattleMaster since before the Inalienable Rights were codified, as you can see on the older Government Rules page, which is presented as required reading to every single government member upon their election or appointment.

If you have a problem with following any of these rules, or the other ones on the Rules and Policies page, then I'm afraid BattleMaster is not for you, if it ever was.

Yes I'm very familiar with that - I'm not saying people with positions of power should have the ability to tell players to log in and punish them for not doing so. What I'm saying is there was always that nagging worry that a general (or ruler, or whatever) telling people to follow orders is somehow borderline violating these rights - these were voiced to me personally, although as I've mentioned they never even got to the point where people filed complaints and Titans dished out punishments. I would also like to point out that I was making the point of how as an in-game general, for IC purposes he was very much (and should very much) care about whether people were following orders. It would be crazy if he didn't.

The thread is about "What prevents game to be competitive" and I'm just pointing out some of the things that I believe is lowering the game appeal for players - especially new players, which BM seems to desperately need. Basically, the game is not "gamey" enough.

[MarshalN]

I don't know if that was true at one point, but at this time in history it is false in three different ways:

• Everyone can send red paper Orders, it's an IC event and if you are powerful enough to get people to follow, then you do it.
• Any region Lord can sponsor an army, it's not limited to Dukes, and in fact the General can do so himself
• Marshals can be replaced at will, and you can combine being General and Marshal if it suits you

Ah, as I mentioned I'm working off old memories and information, some of which is probably outdated since I haven't played a position of power for a long time. The general idea is the same though - the army command structure is very convoluted, and is not conducive to new players figuring out what's going on. Instead of spending a few weeks, people just give up.

[vonGenf]

The general idea is the same though - the army command structure is very convoluted, and is not conducive to new players figuring out what's going on.

The army structure can be convoluted, but it does not need to be. There is nothing preventing an extremely straightforward setup of working.

[Zakilevo]

Armies... Usually not many people want to be involved in it. Too much 'work' and not enough reward in return.

[Chenier]

I don't know if that was true at one point, but at this time in history it is false in three different ways:

• Everyone can send red paper Orders, it's an IC event and if you are powerful enough to get people to follow, then you do it.
• Any region Lord can sponsor an army, it's not limited to Dukes, and in fact the General can do so himself
• Marshals can be replaced at will, and you can combine being General and Marshal if it suits you

There was a time where your first point was not true, and people trying to give orders, without actually being marshals, were given harsh treatment.

[De-Legro]

There was a time where your first point was not true, and people trying to give orders, without actually being marshals, were given harsh treatment.

Indeed there was, there was also a time when there were no marshals. Things evolve. If we are discussing the current state of the system, then it is important to state the actual workings of the current system.

[Chenier]

Indeed there was, there was also a time when there were no marshals. Things evolve. If we are discussing the current state of the system, then it is important to state the actual workings of the current system.

Just seeking to enlighten the player in question about something he did not appear to know, so that perhaps he may better understand the point of view of the person he is interacting with. I'm not taking sides, I didn't even read most of this thread.