Hand out food

[pcw27]

Title: Hand out Food

Summary: TLs can distribute their unit's rations to starving peasants as a takeover/diplomacy tactic.

Details: If a region is in a state of starvation, a troop leader can order his unit to hand out food. In the case of a unit in foreign lands this creates a boost in sympathy for the unit's realm if a unit is in its own lands this increases loyalty and realm control. If enough units give out enough food it can even stave off starvation for a short time.

Benefits: Diversifies tactics for propaganda, diplomacy and conquest.

Possible exploits: The system would need to be balanced so players can't simply loot food till a region is starving then hand out food to make the peasants like their realm again. This could be accomplished by simply making the sympathy loss for looting food higher then the gain for handing it out. Alternatively the system could be made to not work if anyone from the same realm has been stealing food. If you attempt it you get the message "you hand out food, but the peasants are not pleased because they know your realm mates have been stealing food". And if a player does that they should still lose their food.

[Indirik]

I don't think the amount of food that a unit carries is anywhere near enough be significant in terms of feeding an entire region. Even the largest units only need a bushel a day.

[pcw27]

Right, which would make it more of a propaganda tactic then a practical way to feed a region. I was thinking at best it could push the region from "Starving" to "Going Hungry" for a day or two.

[Indirik]

Actually giving a few hundreds bushels of food doesn't do anything to raise morale and sympathy. Why would giving them two bushels?

[Stabbity]

This could be an interesting option for a Banker in a takeover, or maybe even lords.

[pcw27]

Actually giving a few hundreds bushels of food doesn't do anything to raise morale and sympathy. Why would giving them two bushels?

It doesn't directly do so but it does end starvation which will then allow those stats to recover.

A conquering force moving into starving lands and handing out food is a very powerful psychological tactic which armies have used in real life.

[Indirik]

It's not the basic idea that I have a problem with. It's the magnitude. Telling 5,000 people to split 5 tons of food is a great thing. Telling those same 5,000 people to split a Twinkie isn't going to get you very far.

While the concept of handing food out to starving regions could be a good one, with enough controls to make it non-exploitable, which will be very difficult to do, the idea of doing it from your unit's personal stores is a non-starter. You will need to come up with some other source of food before this can be considered.

[Eirikr]

While the concept of handing food out to starving regions could be a good one, with enough controls to make it non-exploitable, which will be very difficult to do, the idea of doing it from your unit's personal stores is a non-starter. You will need to come up with some other source of food before this can be considered.

Can Traders still manually transport food or are they only good for hookups these days? I was thinking this might be a good way to get them more involved with the army rather than continuing to do their own thing.

[Wolfsong]

I made the mistake of swapping to subclass Trader recently... can't use black markets, can't use most of their abilities, and their only perk is they can access marketplaces to buy/sell food without needing to be a region lord... Which is about useless these days, where almost everyone is a region lord. No ability to transport food manually.

[egamma]

I made the mistake of swapping to subclass Trader recently... can't use black markets, can't use most of their abilities, and their only perk is they can access marketplaces to buy/sell food without needing to be a region lord... Which is about useless these days, where almost everyone is a region lord. No ability to transport food manually.

Traders get double, if not more, the trading distance. Instead of 200/400 miles, my trader can trade over 650 miles.

[Indirik]

The trader bonus is not double range. Traders get a 100 mile bonus, plus a skill-based bonus. That can only add up to double range in very specific circumstances.

http://wiki.battlemaster.org/wiki/Help:Trade

[pcw27]

It's not the basic idea that I have a problem with. It's the magnitude. Telling 5,000 people to split 5 tons of food is a great thing. Telling those same 5,000 people to split a Twinkie isn't going to get you very far.

Again the point isn't to make a real impact on the starvation but to convince the starving peasants your realm will feed them. You don't divide up the twinkie, you give it to one peasant and say "tell your friends there's more where that came from if you submit to our rule". In fact that's probably the best way to do it. If you actually deliver the region from starvation there's a chance their current rulers will now have enough time to get them a sustainable food supply. If you leave them starving but believing you're their best chance for a meal they'll probably join you.

While the concept of handing food out to starving regions could be a good one, with enough controls to make it non-exploitable, which will be very difficult to do, the idea of doing it from your unit's personal stores is a non-starter. You will need to come up with some other source of food before this can be considered.

Maybe there can be paraphernalia that expands how many rations your unit carries. That quality could just be added to carts. They can now carry  wounded or food. Then if you have them you can carry enough to give people food.

[Indirik]

Again the point isn't to make a real impact on the starvation but to convince the starving peasants your realm will feed them. You don't divide up the twinkie, you give it to one peasant and say "tell your friends there's more where that came from if you submit to our rule".

So you've made one person happy. Up until the point where the starving guy next to him knifes him to steal the Twinkie.

Personally, I don't think this is a viable mechanic. And I really don't think there's any way you can convince me otherwise.

Maybe there can be paraphernalia that expands how many rations your unit carries. That quality could just be added to carts. They can now carry  wounded or food. Then if you have them you can carry enough to give people food.

And with this you've made the proposal way too complicated to implement for the minimal possible benefit this could be to the game.

[Stabbity]

Its viable up until the moment the thought of food drives the starving peasants into a frenzy. Twinkie man gets stabbed, Knife man eats and the rest wonder how much food you and your men have with you. They then descend upon your group, overwhelm it and the lucky ones get their heads bashed in and die quickly. The rest find themselves literally hacked and pulled into pieces before their bags are looted for food and then are eaten themselves.

[Dishman]

I have always enjoyed the irony of holding a freedom celebration and giving out free beer to starving peasants. Where did all that beer come from?

Which, I suppose you have to assume the size of it is related to your unit size (more troops=more peasants=more impact), so I suppose it isn't a granary's worth of beer. The same idea would apply to this idea. How ever many peasants your unit can safely deal with is how many get goodies.

It's not the basic idea that I have a problem with. It's the magnitude. Telling 5,000 people to split 5 tons of food is a great thing. Telling those same 5,000 people to split a Twinkie isn't going to get you very far.

A bushel of food seems to feed 500 people for a day (at least from what I see on one of my Colonies character, the other two I can't check). That seems like a feasible sized handout. If that were used at half-rations, that's a thousand peasants. If 5 or 6 units dump food on a small depopulated region, it could feasibly be brought out of starvation temporarily.

The more I think about it, the more I like it. Giving more tools to stave off regions being nuked by starvation helps the players. It isn't a handout to players, but a way to use in-game mechanics on other in-game mechanics that makes sense.