Noble density per realm - Dwilight

[Buffalkill]

Well that killed the discussion. Why was this thread split up?

[GundamMerc]

Because it had little practical value. Whether or not having knights in a region affected the amount of gold is not the purpose of this thread, and what effect it does have is inconsequential compared to the difference in noble numbers when it comes to activity.

[Buffalkill]

You're a little late to the discussion to be telling everyone else what it's supposed to be about. The thread is about the issue of the low nobles to regions ratio and it's perfectly relevant to talk about how that may be affected by various elements including how gold is distributed.

[GundamMerc]

You're a little late to the discussion to be telling everyone else what it's supposed to be about. The thread is about the issue of the low nobles to regions ratio and it's perfectly relevant to talk about how that may be affected by various elements including how gold is distributed.

You realize I'm Gustav Kuriga, yes? I created this thread. I'll be the one to determine what the topic of it is. Not once in my original post did I mention anything about gold distribution.

[Chenier]

You're a little late to the discussion to be telling everyone else what it's supposed to be about. The thread is about the issue of the low nobles to regions ratio and it's perfectly relevant to talk about how that may be affected by various elements including how gold is distributed.

The conversation was moved, not removed. If you care so much for it, why not just continue on the new thread?

[Constantine]

You realize I'm Gustav Kuriga, yes? I created this thread. I'll be the one to determine what the topic of it is.

I don't believe that's how it works in the adult world.
Discussion deviated slightly, then it got back on track. Was no real need to overregulate post factum.

[GundamMerc]

I don't believe that's how it works in the adult world.
Discussion deviated slightly, then it got back on track. Was no real need to overregulate post factum.

Discussion went into gold distribution, which was not the reason I wanted to discuss noble density in the first place. I wanted a discussion on noble density based on its effect on activity in Dwilight, not some min/max way of gaming the gold system. The discussion can deviate slightly, yes. But then it needs to get back on track. That discussion showed no signs of slowing, so I asked that it get its own thread. If you're so eager to discuss it, go to the thread that was split off instead of whining about how you can't discuss it in this thread. It isn't like I had them delete the posts, they're still in the Dwilight subforum, but now it is its own topic, and so free to go on for as long as it wants.

[Indirik]

Since this thread is about noble density, and not character count overall, how about some current density numbers for Dwilight?

Realm	Regions	Characters	Density
Fissoa	20	34	1.70
Astrum	18	18	1.00
D'Hara	8	26	3.25
Morek	35	22	0.63
Asylon	3	16	5.33
Barca	4	15	3.75
Luria Nova	18	50	2.78
Swordfell	15	24	1.60

With the exception of two notable realms, density looks pretty good.

And hey, how's that war going? Anyone still complaining about things being too peaceful?

[Chenier]

Since this thread is about noble density, and not character count overall, how about some current density numbers for Dwilight?

Realm	Regions	Characters	Density
Fissoa	20	34	1.70
Astrum	18	18	1.00
D'Hara	8	26	3.25
Morek	35	22	0.63
Asylon	3	16	5.33
Barca	4	15	3.75
Luria Nova	18	50	2.78
Swordfell	15	24	1.60

With the exception of two notable realms, density looks pretty good.

And hey, how's that war going? Anyone still complaining about things being too peaceful?

Wow, D'Hara has more nobles than Morek!? It neither feels big nor dense.

[GundamMerc]

Since this thread is about noble density, and not character count overall, how about some current density numbers for Dwilight?

Realm	Regions	Characters	Density
Fissoa	20	34	1.70
Astrum	18	18	1.00
D'Hara	8	26	3.25
Morek	35	22	0.63
Asylon	3	16	5.33
Barca	4	15	3.75
Luria Nova	18	50	2.78
Swordfell	15	24	1.60

With the exception of two notable realms, density looks pretty good.

And hey, how's that war going? Anyone still complaining about things being too peaceful?

Take out Barca, D'Hara and Asylon, and you don't have a healthy continent anymore. They're outliers, and their ultra-high densities now are artificial because they've lost all or some of their lands from the monster invasion, not because of an increase in nobles. Astrum has actually lost density, Morek has lost density, Swordfell has lost density. The only one where the density goes up because nobles came over from the west is Luria Nova, so all in all I'd say they're the ones who win out in the end. I think Fissoa has stayed about the same density-wise.

[Glaumring the Fox]

They turned Dwilight into the far-east continent...

[Indirik]

Take out Barca, D'Hara and Asylon, and you don't have a healthy continent anymore.

Well, yeah, if you specifically exclude all the high density realms, then of course the density is low, because you tossed out all the high ones. You can make any data set say whatever you want, if you simply exclude all the inconvenient data points you don't like.

Seriously speaking, though, what you mostly end up with is a continent with character density pretty much equivalent to any other island. The overall density on AT is 1.7. On Dwilight right now, it's 1.69. That's characters per controlled region, too, and has nothing to do with realms or realm density. (FWIW - FEI's overall density is 1.97.) Swordfell is 1.7. Fissoa is 1.6. D'Hara and Luria are way higher. Only Astrum and Morek are low.

In any case, the shrinking was NOT done in the hopes that character count would immediately spike. It was done to increase *density*. Increasing density increases conflict, which drives up player satisfaction, and thus retention, and that should cause the character count to go back up. That's a long term goal.

The island-wide density of characters-per-controlled-region when the shrinking started was 1.57.  (According to the post at the beginning of this thread.) It is now 1.69. So it's higher. Not a lot. But apparently enough, since we now have a near-island-wide war. (Or so I understand. I really do need to start a new character there. Should I join Morek for the free lordship? Or maybe Asylon. Any free estates there? :p )

The only realms that have dropped in density are Astrum, Morek, and Swordfell.

Astrum has one more character now than they did then. Their drop in density is because they have 7 more regions than before.

Swordfell has 6 more characters now than they did before. Their drop in density is because they gained 5 regions. That's a 50% increase in region count, and a 33% increase in character count. That's not really a loss.

Morek... well, they are just ... weird.

Fissoa has done exceptionally well, character-wise. They lost 8 regions, but gained 7 nobles. Their density nearly doubled.

D'Hara has two more characters than they did before, with half the regions.

Luria Nova is obviously the big winner here. They gained 15 nobles, a nearly 50% increase. Yes, they did lose 9 regions. But they gained a huge amount of fun when the entire island decided to invade them.

If we look back at the realms that exist now, and compare their density then vs. their density now, it has increased from 1.39 up to 1.69. (Total Characters / Total Controlled Regions) A 22% increase?

Yes, there are two realms that are artificially high in density: Asylon and Barca. Personally, I think it's a miracle that they are even still alive. That's a great tribute to the dedication and perseverance of those players/characters. I hope they can manage to survive, and make a go of it.

So, yes, we do have less characters on the island than we did. Did anyone really think we wouldn't? But what you have now is a more concentrated environment, with a lot of political upheaval. It's denser not just from a characters-per-region standpoint, but from the standpoint of a lot more political agendas and ideologies crammed into a much smaller space. That will get the action flowing. No one gets a free pass of being geographically isolated in their own corner.

The key now is to try and nurture that. If the island stays dynamic and active, then the character count will drift back up.

They turned Dwilight into the far-east continent...

I have no idea what you mean by this. FEI is the second highest density island, behind only EC. As far as the political situation, Dwilight and FEI have absolutely no resemblance.

[GundamMerc]

Well, yeah, if you specifically exclude all the high density realms, then of course the density is low, because you tossed out all the high ones. You can make any data set say whatever you want, if you simply exclude all the inconvenient data points you don't like.

Seriously speaking, though, what you mostly end up with is a continent with character density pretty much equivalent to any other island. The overall density on AT is 1.7. On Dwilight right now, it's 1.69. That's characters per controlled region, too, and has nothing to do with realms or realm density. (FWIW - FEI's overall density is 1.97.) Swordfell is 1.7. Fissoa is 1.6. D'Hara and Luria are way higher. Only Astrum and Morek are low.

In any case, the shrinking was NOT done in the hopes that character count would immediately spike. It was done to increase *density*. Increasing density increases conflict, which drives up player satisfaction, and thus retention, and that should cause the character count to go back up. That's a long term goal.

The island-wide density of characters-per-controlled-region when the shrinking started was 1.57.  (According to the post at the beginning of this thread.) It is now 1.69. So it's higher. Not a lot. But apparently enough, since we now have a near-island-wide war. (Or so I understand. I really do need to start a new character there. Should I join Morek for the free lordship? Or maybe Asylon. Any free estates there? :p )

The only realms that have dropped in density are Astrum, Morek, and Swordfell.

Astrum has one more character now than they did then. Their drop in density is because they have 7 more regions than before.

Swordfell has 6 more characters now than they did before. Their drop in density is because they gained 5 regions. That's a 50% increase in region count, and a 33% increase in character count. That's not really a loss.

Morek... well, they are just ... weird.

Fissoa has done exceptionally well, character-wise. They lost 8 regions, but gained 7 nobles. Their density nearly doubled.

D'Hara has two more characters than they did before, with half the regions.

Luria Nova is obviously the big winner here. They gained 15 nobles, a nearly 50% increase. Yes, they did lose 9 regions. But they gained a huge amount of fun when the entire island decided to invade them.

If we look back at the realms that exist now, and compare their density then vs. their density now, it has increased from 1.39 up to 1.69. (Total Characters / Total Controlled Regions) A 22% increase?

Yes, there are two realms that are artificially high in density: Asylon and Barca. Personally, I think it's a miracle that they are even still alive. That's a great tribute to the dedication and perseverance of those players/characters. I hope they can manage to survive, and make a go of it.

So, yes, we do have less characters on the island than we did. Did anyone really think we wouldn't? But what you have now is a more concentrated environment, with a lot of political upheaval. It's denser not just from a characters-per-region standpoint, but from the standpoint of a lot more political agendas and ideologies crammed into a much smaller space. That will get the action flowing. No one gets a free pass of being geographically isolated in their own corner.

The key now is to try and nurture that. If the island stays dynamic and active, then the character count will drift back up.
I have no idea what you mean by this. FEI is the second highest density island, behind only EC. As far as the political situation, Dwilight and FEI have absolutely no resemblance.

Honestly you're in denial. The goal of the whole monster invasion was to increase the density on the rest o the continent. But what you actually had happen was the nobles who stayed squeezed onto the nearest half of the usable parts of Dwilight, while the other half remained the same and continued to grow ever more depopulated. So basically the end result of all this is going to be that 1/4 of the total size of dwilight is going to be populated in any number, while the rest is just left to die off. Honestly the best way of doing this in the beginning would have been the monsters invading the area of Morek, but it's too late for that.

[Zakilevo]

Density wise, I think Dwilight hit the nail. The continent was way too big for the number of nobles and now the entire continent is involved in one area. Even Morek is coming down to join the party.

[Anaris]

Honestly you're in denial.

The numbers show that he's not. All you've got is negativity piled on top of negativity. Which, as I recall, I have specifically asked you to stop posting constantly on boards for a game you don't even care enough about to play anymore.

All you've done since long before the monster invasion is preach about how magnificent Asylon is, how everyone else should just bow down and worship them, especially Morek and Astrum, and how no other realm on Dwilight is worth a damn next to them. We got the picture months ago. But you apparently didn't get the picture about what I said to you.

You need to stop making uselessly negative posts, Gustav. If you insist on posting, then I insist that in a significant percentage of your posts, you either a) say sincere, positive things about the game, or b) at least propose reasonable solutions to the problems you see—ones that haven't already been rejected.

If we want BattleMaster to improve, we need to improve the atmosphere of the game and the forums, and we'll never do that while we have people like you constantly spouting worthless doom-and-gloom dreck that doesn't actually introduce any new or helpful information.