Author Topic: Open Mic Thread: How do you manage refugees?  (Read 5651 times)

Solari

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Open Mic Thread: How do you manage refugees?
« Topic Start: June 05, 2011, 04:49:40 PM »
This came up as a topic on IRC and I thought it merited a good discussion.  We've always had refugee populations in the game.  Sometimes they come from defunct realms, occasionally religions, etc.  What happens when those populations move as a whole into other realms?

What I'd like is for people who are either members of host realms or refugee populations to share their experiences, observations, and suggestions for how to manage this interesting phenomenon.

Sacha

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Well, as Thalmarkin can tell you, getting refugees isn't always a good thing. Especially not when they arrive en bloc and start trouble for no apparent reason.

Chenier

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This came up as a topic on IRC and I thought it merited a good discussion.  We've always had refugee populations in the game.  Sometimes they come from defunct realms, occasionally religions, etc.  What happens when those populations move as a whole into other realms?

What I'd like is for people who are either members of host realms or refugee populations to share their experiences, observations, and suggestions for how to manage this interesting phenomenon.

Depends on the context. Enweil receiving Avalonian refugees had nothing to do with Riombara receiving Fwuvoghorian refugees, for example.

Different refugees must be handled differently.

Lorgan

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Well, when I came to Thalmarkin as a refugee of Old Grehk with 8 of my knights, I immediately asked to be added to the extended council as representative. I was added and was part of all essential discussions from that moment on. Our arrival saw Thalmarkin's military might bumped from 7k to 13k deployable CS after a recruitment campaign.
I stayed in Thalmarkin as did most of my knights, I became Duke of a stronghold, then the capital and one of my knights was elected ruler for a short while during the invasion.

Now again I'm in Thalmarkin on the receiving end of refugees and the situation is a little more complicated as their "leader" (member of a respected family by all refugees) is the general who lead us through half of the invasion.

But my opinion remains the same: involve them in realm matters, give them opportunities to rise in the realm's ranks and above all: find a common enemy.
That's what we're lacking right now and which we did have when I was the refugee. In fact during the first week in Thalmarkin we raided Ossmat, the capital of Old Grehk which my character "rebelled" against.

Shizzle

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Well, as Thalmarkin can tell you, getting refugees isn't always a good thing. Especially not when they arrive en bloc and start trouble for no apparent reason.

Yeah. Damn foreigners :P The judge got protested out of office, the Grand Marshal shunned, and the rightful King called a Tyrant!

In Fissoa on the other hand, immigrants have always been accepted with open arms. First myself, when I came from Myern, and later the Giaskians. :)

Chenier

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Anaris

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In Fissoa on the other hand, immigrants have always been accepted with open arms. First myself, when I came from Myern, and later the Giaskians. :)

Eh, Myern was founded by Fissoa in the first place, so that's only partly "refugees."
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Vellos

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In Oligarch, many refugees (such as from Rancagua) were rapidly integrated. However, refugees from a certain conspicuously annoying riverside city coughAvamarcough were systematically discriminated against. Use of the word "Avamar" outside of strategic discussion was prohibited, official policy restricted electoral participation and civic participation, a separate army (message group at the time) was created for them, sent on "special missions" involving significant chance of injury, and systematically underfunded.

It was one of the most fun memories I have of BM: engaging in racial segregation against Avamarians. What does that say about me? Bad things.

On the other hand, Terran welcomed in many Giaskan refugees. We made an official agreement beforehand that they would agree to restrict their political influence and serve in our army (mostly as forward scouts with no units to save gold), in exchange we would fully support their colony under certain conditions. We established statutory delineations of support, including limits to how long we would offer support, and provisions for full integration into Terran if the colony failed. I tried to convert the Giaskans to Triunism, but by and large did not succeed.
"A neutral humanism is either a pedantic artifice or a prologue to the inhuman." - George Steiner

Solari

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Lorgan and Vellos have the idea down.  Don't just tell us it's situational.  Share a situation!

dustole

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A lot depends on who the group of nobles are.  There is an inherent risk letting in a large group of nobles so a little bit of trust is nice.  However, on Dwilight the gains usually outweigh the risks.   
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Shizzle

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Eh, Myern was founded by Fissoa in the first place, so that's only partly "refugees."

Well, I joined Fissoa after Myern's demise, but I had never been in Fissoa before. So I - and others - were actual refugees.

Fleugs

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I believe that dealing with refugees should be done "naturally". Unless there is a clear and obvious OOC-link that smells fishy, there should be no reason to frown upon refugees OOCly. Yes, they might threaten the vested authority in your realm. That's a side effect of refugees. If you don't want to take the risk, you can kick them out... fabricate some reason to kick them out or just make it clear you're the boss. But there are many ways to deal with them. If you can successfully assimilate such a group, it is a great addition to your realm.
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loren

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I'm surprised nobody has mentioned former ASI people.  They've risen quite a bit in the various realms they've gone to, many many Lords.  A lot of them still talk about the old days and the like, the religion is still alive (despite an entire Island's worth of efforts to kill it, kind of proud of that).

Generally speaking I keep them out of lordships.  Without any golds they're fairly harmless.  If you're a small realm though, watch out hah.

And why no mention of Old Rancagua?  Sirion is fighting a war for their old allies,  Fontan turned their back on them.  Both realms got an equal influx, yet only one is upholding their bargain.  Could it be the glacial pace of leadership change in Sirion?

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Were it not for the rebellion in the original Avalon, Retravic would have been a very different person. Several of her most trusted advisors - and later, enemies - first came to the Republic as refugees.
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Stabbity

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When dealing with refugees, there are really only two options the budding tyrant should ever consider.

1.) Ban them all, execute whom you catch. That will show them, and reduce the size of the problem.

2.) Ban and execute the leaders, make it abundantly clear insubordination will not be tolerated and throw them to the front lines.
Life is a dance, it is only fitting that death sing the tune.