Author Topic: change elder priest abilities  (Read 7668 times)

Bronnen

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change elder priest abilities
« Topic Start: August 12, 2016, 01:05:40 AM »
I've had a few thought for abilities that elder priests specifically might get.

First one was an improved version of the drive out heretic one.  Punish heretic. Instead of just driving them out of the region, loyal religious peasants and militia would try to kill or imprison the heretic. This could also allow for religious prisons where enemies of the faith can be held.

Second, minor magical abilities much like the scrolls the sages make.

Third,  declare a religious state in cities and stronghold with a very high percentage of faithful. The realm in control would need very low morale or it could act like a rebellion where they try to take control of the palace.

I think these changes could be very easily balanced and might make people consider becoming a priest if they can actively affect things instead of just rp.

What do you think?

« Last Edit: August 12, 2016, 01:19:58 AM by Bronnen »

Anaris

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #1: August 12, 2016, 01:13:17 AM »
Second, minor magical abilities much like the scrolls the sages make.

No. Never.

Player characters do not do magic.
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

Bronnen

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #2: August 12, 2016, 01:19:23 AM »
Well apart from that one then?

JDodger

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #3: August 12, 2016, 08:26:52 AM »
troll priests? like in wow?
By the way, would love to see you coordinate three realms without having an OOC teamspeak with everyone on it.

Bronnen

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #4: August 12, 2016, 02:08:34 PM »
What?

Anaris

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #5: August 12, 2016, 02:18:11 PM »
Third,  declare a religious state in cities and stronghold with a very high percentage of faithful. The realm in control would need very low morale or it could act like a rebellion where they try to take control of the palace.

I'm not sure what you want for this that the current Declare Religious State/Claim Region option doesn't permit.
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

Bronnen

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #6: August 12, 2016, 02:55:40 PM »
I've never been able to use that option. Does it create a colony that is automatically a theocracy?

Anaris

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #7: August 12, 2016, 03:31:48 PM »
I've never been able to use that option. Does it create a colony that is automatically a theocracy?

No, and no such option will be added.

Claim Region is colloquially known as the "religious takeover." It makes the priest using it the Lord of the region, and adds it to his realm.
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

Bronnen

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #8: August 12, 2016, 03:41:18 PM »
Ah see that's what I thought.

I was more thinking this way it would allow an elder priest to create a realm of his faith by using the strength of the peasants. May I ask why it would not be added?

Anaris

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #9: August 12, 2016, 03:50:00 PM »
Ah see that's what I thought.

I was more thinking this way it would allow an elder priest to create a realm of his faith by using the strength of the peasants. May I ask why it would not be added?

Partly because creating new realms is, by design, possible only by a very strictly limited number of actions, that we don't particularly want to expand.

Partly because you need a lot more than peasants to create a new realm.

But primarily because it would be hugely, massively abusable. Rather than just taking an adjacent region away from a realm, and thus forcing them to take it back along the frontier, you'd be able to cut a core region out of the realm and make it an instant capital, with no support, and, given the state of the religious game, not necessarily any real investment of effort, if you've got a few temples in the general vicinity and there are no competing religions.

Furthermore, because of how abusable it would be, it would also be that much more incentive for people to lock down religion within their realm, and lock out any religion that wasn't directly supporting their realm.
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

Bronnen

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #10: August 12, 2016, 03:52:50 PM »
Fair enough, what about religious prisons and capturing non-believers and holding them in there?

Anaris

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #11: August 12, 2016, 04:12:45 PM »
Fair enough, what about religious prisons and capturing non-believers and holding them in there?

If we were to implement the possibility of capturing nobles by a religious option, they would still go to the realm prison. We're not going to start implementing all kinds of different prisons willy-nilly.
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

Bronnen

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #12: August 12, 2016, 04:29:03 PM »
What about riling up the peasants and militia to try and kill the lord?

Lorgan

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #13: August 12, 2016, 04:40:47 PM »
What about riling up the peasants and militia to try and kill the lord?

You can already drive out the lord and/or knight(s?) by using the auto da fe option. If you've got enough of a following in the region and the lord/knight isn't a follower of your religion.

Since you can only kill heroes anyway and those only the battlefield, this option is exactly what you're suggesting and as far as it will go.

The point of battlemaster is not to give individuals a lot of buttons to click and gain ultimate power, it is to work together with others and achieve your goals by cooperation.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2016, 04:43:03 PM by Lorgan »

Vita`

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Re: change elder priest abilities
« Reply #14: August 12, 2016, 04:56:28 PM »
I wouldn't be entirely opposed to a religious prison (dont take that as approval though, just my personal sentiment). But, there are a lot of buts...

Prison code is some of the oldest legacy spaghetti code. Before any new prisons, we *really* need to improve the existing code.
Religious changes require some carefully laid out thought for some of the reasons Anaris and Lorgan already mentioned.
Religions are still essentially guilds, not realms, there are plans to change that, but they are just that, plans. So because religions are guilds, it means there are limitations on what can be done compared to a realm.
There are effectively three development volunteers, so even if anything *was* accepted, its unpredictable how soon approved changes would be completed. And there are quite a few pre-existing projects. I mean, statues and monuments only spent four years as an approved feature request before completion...
Religion code is also dated in many areas, like auto da fes and religious takeovers, including various bugs. Before adding new features, it would be nice to make sure the existing ones are properly functioning.
Most of these suggested changes, if approved, will take some time, not a few simple lines to change.

In terms of character death - character death has long been something that must be largely chosen by the player. They choose to become hero. They play an advy. They play on an island with universal mortality (War Island). They get banished from a realm and then go do activities that are likely to get them captured. We will definitely not be changing character death to something that is forced upon them against their will after they've been told that that they get a choice over their character's demise.

And I would stress Lorgan's last line on interaction. Mechanics are just tools to facilitate further roleplay. Religion especially involves a lot of cooperation.

For what its worth, I did start messing with having new characters and immigrating characters have to choose a religion, just like choosing a realm. But last week, I spent more time on getting War Island reset. This week, I have some real life things I'm dealing with. Eventually though, I hope to have that added step available.