Magic On EC

[JeVondair]

Sirion does fit into a magical realm. Elves and now endless array of spells coming out from them to hit Garas...

umm

[Ketchum]

http://wiki.battlemaster.org/wiki/JeVondair_Family/Selenia/Resurrection

I like your Roleplays. However Brock is already disliking magic, Selenia event only serves to push him to another level altogether, see below reply to Gabanus family.

I told JeVondair this in private also. My objection to this has nothing to do with the JeVondair family, the player, the consequences it has in game, or the roleplay opportunities. My problem is with the impact magic currently has on BM especially on islands other than BT (and maybe Dwilight).

BM is called battlemaster for a reason and not spellmaster, I believe that's another game. For me at least this game resolves around medieval based warfare and roleplaying which I both enjoy and participate in. But these last few months I've seen the impact of magic be so large that it really is slowly pushing me to quit BM. I have done all I could to turn it into a positive thing which is why Garas is currently blind and we turned it into huge roleplay turn.

Yes, I agree with your points. Brock even had his own duchy and Caligus duchy starving because of that dark portal roleplaying events. Which is really proved nuisance as the lords just diverted food supply from other duchies or regions to the starving ones. If dark portal roleplays plan to achieve something, they need to have a roll of dices but not that too impactful. Something that would encourage the rest of characters to Roleplay the events and add in the Roleplays at the very least. Ugh, I beginning to think of the many characters Roleplays in Beluaterra island. That already make Brock very suspecting of anyone who have Scrolls, portal stones and magic, he already on high Dislike level after that starvation issues. Sometimes I wonder if I should choose Roleplay my character as being cynical of anything to do with magic. As a start, Nivemus is allied with Sirion who is casting magic scrolls on Oligarch.

Haha thanks, appreciate the offer :p

But if I ever leave Oligarch because of the magic I'll be gone entirely I'm afraid

Fortunately we're not at that point yet

There are always something for Garas, it has been his destiny, I unsure if he even predicts this when he seceded Oligarch city

Sirion does fit into a magical realm. Elves and now endless array of spells coming out from them to hit Garas...

Elves and their spells cannot stop me! Muahaha...
That said, I need plan something for or against Greater Xavax.
Ugh, why Xavax is called Greater?

[Gabanus family]

Well Garas is not just cynical of magic, he is an eternal enemy of it. I've shared some of his experiences with most Generals and within the Order of the White Tree so I'm sure it will spread at least somewhere, which should IG also at least explain his point of view good enough.

And yeah once Coimbra and Karbala did not join I knew already we were in trouble. I in fact did not expect to survive this long as a realm or char. And of course I then quickly figured out they'd come for him and I'm fine with that. Actually, I think it adds a very cool strife within the game so I made little attempt to make him look sympathatic to Sirion Nobles. I simply didn't expect this constant rain of magic however in BM.

[Zakilevo]

Eh without peasant militias, Oligarch would have died like three times over. Damn peasants...

[Gabanus family]

Kill all peasants!

[Gordy77]

Garas outlaws magic then gets cross when he is constantly attacked by magicians.  It writes itself..He's Gargamel in the land of the smurfs.

[Gabanus family]

Garas outlaws magic then gets cross when he is constantly attacked by magicians.  It writes itself..He's Gargamel in the land of the smurfs.

The discussion here is how I as player am fed up with this large actual impact of magic in a low fantasy game like BM. When I first started playing magic didn't even exist at all. BM shouldn't have magicians in the first place, so your comparrison is far off.

How Garas will react is a different thing. I just explained why because of ooc reasons I'm hesitant to perform certain IC actions like hunting/executing advies at random.

[Gordy77]

Alright, point taken. I suppose we don't hardly see any magic, scrolls etc cast in Caligus because we have zero conflict.  We don't have any particular stance. I can see how it would be frustrating to be constantly stymied by magic deus ex. Perhaps it's since the adventurer code update there's more loot overall so more likely to pull off the random scroll requirements.

[Ui Briuin]

Wouldn't that be Medeis ex Machina?

[Zakilevo]

I definitely hope magic should be limited to certain islands unless we are trying to merge Spellmaster and Battlemaster.

Scrolls are starting to impact the game too much. It is acceptable for BT's case since the whole island revolves around creatures from another dimension but EC? I'd be okay with Dwilight even but EC is a continent directly out of Spellmaster. I think that is why all the sages and wizards are constantly on the move and when you hear about them, they are being chased by witch hunters occasionally. Also, other races are not even allowed because they are against BM's low fantasy aspect. All of sudden, this year, the devs decided to make magic more abundant by bringing in portal events that summon daimons and monsters on even Dwilight or cause permanent damages to RCs etc. Wouldn't mind knowing where the direct of this game is heading. I think we are at a crossroad between remaining low fantasy or going high fantasy.

Like I said, I don't mind BT being BM's version of high fantasy. I am completely okay with having one island dedicated to it but if we are heading toward the high fantasy direction, I am afraid it won't be the same game I've signed up a decade ago.

Regarding scrolls, I sure hope either they become very very rare by reducing the available number of wizard per any given time to 1 or hope it becomes increasingly hard to make them when there are too many scrolls in the hands of the player. Also, I'd very much like to see some sort of an expiry date on all the scrolls so they don't stick around when you pause your character so when you unpause after years to use it.

[GundamMerc]

Again, magic =/= high fantasy. Please stop spreading that misconception with your arguments. And if East Island is really the continent from Spellmaster, wouldn't that make it more likely to have magic, not less? Besides, witches and wizards being put to death by witch hunters is something that occurs on all islands. Also you are incorrect regarding other races not being allowed, they are not allowed outside Sirion and arguably Outer Tilog. Inside Sirion you can claim to be an elf (though most won't take you seriously) and in Outer Tilog I wouldn't be surprised at all if a character claiming to be a mechanical monstrosity showed up and was banned for being literate.

Regarding portals on BT summoning Daimons and monsters, where have you been? That's always been a part of BT, it isn't new in the slightest and the devs didn't suddenly bring it in on a whim. That continent had players sacrificing themselves in temples to basically power religious weapons that destroyed swaths of the invading Daimons in one of the previous Invasions.

[Zakilevo]

Again, magic =/= high fantasy. Please stop spreading that misconception with your arguments. And if East Island is really the continent from Spellmaster, wouldn't that make it more likely to have magic, not less? Besides, witches and wizards being put to death by witch hunters is something that occurs on all islands. Also you are incorrect regarding other races not being allowed, they are not allowed outside Sirion and arguably Outer Tilog. Inside Sirion you can claim to be an elf (though most won't take you seriously) and in Outer Tilog I wouldn't be surprised at all if a character claiming to be a mechanical monstrosity showed up and was banned for being literate.

Regarding portals on BT summoning Daimons and monsters, where have you been? That's always been a part of BT, it isn't new in the slightest and the devs didn't suddenly bring it in on a whim. That continent had players sacrificing themselves in temples to basically power religious weapons that destroyed swaths of the invading Daimons in one of the previous Invasions.

No. Even within Sirion, you are not supposed to RP like you are an elf. Just that it is not worth pressing the matter to displease players of Sirion. It is more of a silent agreement that as long as you are in Sirion, nobody will laugh at you for RPing as an elf. However, the only people who can RP by Tom's rule as an elf is pretty much Ecthelion only at this point as his character existed long before the rule ever came to be.

I can't say much about OT. Never paid much attention to colonies.

As you can see, wizards and sages are hunted. What does that mean? It means practitioners of magic are aggressively hunted.

I had to look up how people defined 'low fantasy'. It sounds like magic is okay but it should be very rare as low fantasy should resemble our own world more closely. I also found this on our wiki. It is one of the rules regarding how we should roleplay, written by Tom and other couple devs:

Try to stay in the era BattleMaster is set in
Even though it isn't punished, or enforced strictly, your character is a noble in a Middle Ages-type setting. As such, he can't fly through the air, use electricity, and gunpowder has yet to be invented. Your character lives in a world dominated by codes of honour, chivalry, and a limited application of science. Thus, he isn't going to be flying in spaceships, wielding magic, or destroying armies with a single wave of an arm.

By that rule, we should be done with scrolls unless we are planning on changing that.

[GundamMerc]

No. Even within Sirion, you are not supposed to RP like you are an elf. Just that it is not worth pressing the matter to displease players of Sirion. It is more of a silent agreement that as long as you are in Sirion, nobody will laugh at you for RPing as an elf. However, the only people who can RP by Tom's rule as an elf is pretty much Ecthelion only at this point as his character existed long before the rule ever came to be.

I can't say much about OT. Never paid much attention to colonies.

As you can see, wizards and sages are hunted. What does that mean? It means practitioners of magic are aggressively hunted.

I had to look up how people defined 'low fantasy'. It sounds like magic is okay but it should be very rare as low fantasy should resemble our own world more closely. I also found this on our wiki. It is one of the rules regarding how we should roleplay, written by Tom and other couple devs:

Try to stay in the era BattleMaster is set in
Even though it isn't punished, or enforced strictly, your character is a noble in a Middle Ages-type setting. As such, he can't fly through the air, use electricity, and gunpowder has yet to be invented. Your character lives in a world dominated by codes of honour, chivalry, and a limited application of science. Thus, he isn't going to be flying in spaceships, wielding magic, or destroying armies with a single wave of an arm.

By that rule, we should be done with scrolls unless we are planning on changing that.

Considering scrolls have been around forever, since before Tom left active development, and gunpowder HAS been invented (it's the mass-produced musket you're thinking of), nothing has changed except maybe some adventurer code for finding items. That can be adjusted, but I'm pretty sure that there hasn't been any new ways to procure scrolls added to the game, and no new scrolls either. I do know that the scrolls have a very high failure rate if you don't have any spellcasting skill (and it is a skill in the game, has been for an even longer time), something I experienced myself using teleportation scrolls, only one in three actually working. So even if scrolls are more common now, unless you have the skill to use them it's basically a huge gamble whether it will work.

Gunpowder, by the way, is what the demolition charges use (I believe that's their name, someone correct me if I'm wrong). Since it's been a long time since actually destroying the walls without taking over the city has been done in a war, they haven't seen much use as that is the only time you'd be able to use them reasonably. They do exist, however, and so gunpowder is part of the game.

As for practitioners of magic being hunted, YES! Of course! Why do you think characters point and cry out in alarm, claiming some other character has used "black magic" after using a scroll? This occurs on Dwilight on occasion, even if there is no magic involved. It's a matter of mindset, not whether magic itself is common. You can see how the realms around Greater Xavax reacted to Selenia being resurrected, so it isn't as if there isn't this kind of mindset already.

So to finish, no, we should not be done with scrolls, because there was nothing to change in the first place besides some adventurer item gathering mechanics. Scrolls have been a part of this game for a long time, and saying that things have changed because there are scrolls is ignoring the fact that they have always been there.

[Zakilevo]

Except they were never meant to play such a huge role. Why do you think there is a warning under 'Hero' class warning you about your character's death?

Scrolls were okay until recently because nobody was carrying a cartload of scrolls to burn. They were 'really' rare compare to unique items.

There were so many scrolls on BT, some new features were added to make them fire off randomly when you had too many monsters or undead scrolls. Good that it was BT but when somebody carries a lot of scrolls on other continents, then what do you do?

When I found a wizard last time, I made 3 scrolls. 2 scrolls of accidents which were supposed to be super rare, and 1 scroll of acid. Wizards need to ask for more common items to make a scroll and once they make one, they should get the hell out instead of staying around to make 2 more.

[Vita`]

I would also note that the point of scrolls is that the characters themselves are too weak to cast their own magic, but must use a 'ritual recipe', if you will. The spellcasting skill is just how successful they are at completing the complex, confusing ritual written on the scroll.

Adjusting how long wizards stay in a region after completing a scroll sounds like a good adjustment.