New map for Dwilight

[Antonine]

Now, now, hold your horses. This isn't about changing the map, just the welcome news that the project to recreate the base geographical map for Dwilight is nearing completion (massive thanks to Zakky, Gildre and Delvin on this as they did the lion's share of the work).

This will mean the current image file can be replaced with one that will actually work and load properly, as well as giving the flexibility for the potential evolution of the map in future. So if you want to look at the new Dwilight you can do so here:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BwCyrJNDAbKuRGVXcUxiOUZFLVk

However, because I got a bit carried away with myself, I also came up with a "just for fun" version of Dwilight where the region borders remain the same but new cities and strongholds have been added in certain locations to improve the potential for conflict between competing realms. You can look at that one here in case you're interested:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BwCyrJNDAbKuemdxYmVjU05wdlE

[Chenier]

Would be a fairly straightforward quickfix to address the most flagrant issues of heterogeneous city distributions leading to "natural realm borders" and "natural capitals". As long as food production is buffed (seriously, time to give a huge food buff to all coastal regions, let 'em fish already!), it should all work out.

[Ketchum]

If I have my own way, Muspel and Muspelheim won't be townsland and city. Too close to Aegir the city and Aegir Deep the townsland. That last war between Avernus(who control M and M) and Morek come to my mind. It is a close war between 2 capitals so nearby. Maybe a Townsland and a City should be a few squares away from another Townsland and a City?

Otherwise we going to play "you look at my army, I look at your army" war.

[Chenier]

That area is pretty unusual, indeed, for being a city next to a townsland next to another townsland next to another city. It's the same with Freke-Mimer, though. And the main problem there is microstate vs microstate, to be honest, regardless of the region types two micro nations next to each other are likely to see very little action, as they'd both lack what it'd take to overcome walls.

I think Antoine's premise was not changing any region borders. And while I dislike doughnuts, I do feel like they need to be townslands.

[Antonine]

I think Antoine's premise was not changing any region borders. And while I dislike doughnuts, I do feel like they need to be townslands.

This. There's lots of improvements which could be made to Dwilight if we were willing to split regions up, and so on, but at present the simplest fixes would be just to change region types and stats without altering the borders.

[Ketchum]

That area is pretty unusual, indeed, for being a city next to a townsland next to another townsland next to another city. It's the same with Freke-Mimer, though. And the main problem there is microstate vs microstate, to be honest, regardless of the region types two micro nations next to each other are likely to see very little action, as they'd both lack what it'd take to overcome walls.

I think Antoine's premise was not changing any region borders. And while I dislike doughnuts, I do feel like they need to be townslands.

I am fine with the way things are. In all possibilities, there is one possibility it will force Morek to expand since we have need of food and less rural regions. Collecting so much gold, can give rise to many things to happen. However if the new change involves turning rural lands into townsland, that will force the players to fight for the rural lands. More wars, more fun.

Now if only the new changes bring some new lands to be draw on a few squares. I wish so much

[Chenier]

Antonine's additional cities would greatly help alleviate many of the geography issues.

Ideally, until doughnuts are completely removed, they should all be made townslands. Alternatively, for the concept to have worked, I guess none of them should have been townslands... but I'm not really sure the concept would have worked out as intended.

The North-West mountain range should really have superior wealth, something a bit closer to the mid-east's.

And, barring any complicated geography changes... just cutting off the South and pushing D'Hara a bit North.

[Gabanus family]

Now, now, hold your horses. This isn't about changing the map, just the welcome news that the project to recreate the base geographical map for Dwilight is nearing completion (massive thanks to Zakky, Gildre and Delvin on this as they did the lion's share of the work).

This will mean the current image file can be replaced with one that will actually work and load properly, as well as giving the flexibility for the potential evolution of the map in future. So if you want to look at the new Dwilight you can do so here:

Great work! Chapeau

[Glaumring the Fox]

Antonine's additional cities would greatly help alleviate many of the geography issues.

Ideally, until doughnuts are completely removed, they should all be made townslands. Alternatively, for the concept to have worked, I guess none of them should have been townslands... but I'm not really sure the concept would have worked out as intended.

The North-West mountain range should really have superior wealth, something a bit closer to the mid-east's.

And, barring any complicated geography changes... just cutting off the South and pushing D'Hara a bit North.

I like Cheniers idea, Dwilight is just a horrible map and needs a massive rework to force interactions.

[JeVondair]

Dwilight was meant for a lot more players. I also agree with this proposed change.


I wonder, if this was implemented, would the Zuma resurface?

[Anderfhstim]

Doubt any of these changes people want to see will happen. But if it does happen, deleting everything south of South Divide would be good. Why leave Lurian regions at all? Reducing the number of regions by half should increase the density by a lot.

[Chenier]

Doubt any of these changes people want to see will happen. But if it does happen, deleting everything south of South Divide would be good. Why leave Lurian regions at all? Reducing the number of regions by half should increase the density by a lot.

Stronghanding realms to oblivion has, historically, not really led to density increases. Prudence is totally warranted. I kind of dismissively remove some myself in some drafts, but I do think that any realm to be removed this way would probably need to be manually reinstated elsewhere, kinda like what was done with Westgard, and not just thrown under the bus with a "adapt or die" situation. If Madina was removed, for example, a referendum could be held there as to what city they'd like to move to, and then they could all be teleported there, with regions given their max pop, and a bunch of gold to rebuild.

As for Luria, I don't really see a reason to remove the realm. I'm not in favor of crippling realms like what happened to D'Hara when it lost its western holdings (2 cities, townslands, and rurals at the time, + valuable allies). But this wouldn't be too much the case, as I'm using Antonine's bonified map as a base, which includes more cities in the region. Luria could therefore move its capital to another more central location, which would bring it closer to Swordfell and D'Hara.

A less drastic version that removes no realms



Here, you'd have D'Hara, Fissoa, Luria, and Swordfell all close to each other, potentially competing for land, with a much more real capacity to fight each other. D'Hara and Madina would also be closer to each other, while Madina and Fissoa would no longer be capital-locked against each other.

All in all, simple changes that could really bring unprecedented potential to that otherwise desolate corner.

Doesn't do a huge thing for density, but D'Hara loses a few eastern regions, Madina loses western holdings, Fissoa loses a few regions, Luria loses some, so does a bit. All of them would pretty much be able to compensate with new or better regions, but at least doing so would place them shoulder to shoulder.