Author Topic: The So Called Prophet Severina  (Read 3380 times)

pcw27

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The So Called Prophet Severina
« Topic Start: November 23, 2018, 08:51:58 AM »
Mathurin's been gone a long time and Sanguis Astroism has definitely suffered. The great thing about having him around was he generally treated the church with a light touch, but now and then would step in and make an unequivocal ruling.

Well I've introduced an as of yet roleplayed-only character claiming to be the second prophet. At this point she wont technically be a playable character for about three more years. So that gives us plenty of time to discuss the idea of a new prophet of Sanguis Astrosim. Will she be accepted by the old church or by ESA? Or will she be forced to found a new sect. I'd love to hear thoughts and suggestions.

I'm especially interested in thoughts on her "first prophecy". It got a little overlooked seeing as there was a lot of strife over other events in SA. I actually have a very specific interpretation in mind for it but would love to hear people take a stab at what it means before I spill the beans.

For anyone who needs to be brought up to speed:

https://forum.battlemaster.org/index.php/topic,8198.0.html

Zakky

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #1: November 23, 2018, 06:19:52 PM »
Knowing SA for a long time, I'd say she will be treated like a false prophet.

pcw27

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #2: November 24, 2018, 02:31:25 AM »
Knowing SA for a long time, I'd say she will be treated like a false prophet.

Well I hope enough players will really consider how having an ultimate authority benefits SA. It used to be you could politic and back stab but in the end you had to stay within certain limits or get smacked down by the Prophet. Plus at times he could unilaterally demand full scale mobilization of the religion.

Stabbity

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #3: November 24, 2018, 03:13:53 AM »
Will she be accepted by the old church or by ESA?

Nope.
Life is a dance, it is only fitting that death sing the tune.

pcw27

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #4: November 24, 2018, 04:13:45 AM »
Nope.

One of the three lights already accepted her.

Chenier

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #5: November 24, 2018, 03:43:19 PM »
Well I hope enough players will really consider how having an ultimate authority benefits SA. It used to be you could politic and back stab but in the end you had to stay within certain limits or get smacked down by the Prophet. Plus at times he could unilaterally demand full scale mobilization of the religion.

People typically aren't interested in promoting a stranger to having ultimate authority over them. ;)

Stabbity

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #6: November 24, 2018, 04:40:33 PM »
Honestly, I doubt we'll ever have a second Prophet. A recognized Prophet would wield waaaaaaay more power than anyone is comfortable giving to one person.
Life is a dance, it is only fitting that death sing the tune.

Chenier

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #7: November 24, 2018, 04:41:35 PM »
Honestly, I doubt we'll ever have a second Prophet. A recognized Prophet would wield waaaaaaay more power than anyone is comfortable giving to one person.

Yea I mean we all saw what happened the last time a regent was given all power.  ::)

Stabbity

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #8: November 24, 2018, 05:04:38 PM »
Yea I mean we all saw what happened the last time a regent was given all power.  ::)

Good times?
Life is a dance, it is only fitting that death sing the tune.

pcw27

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #9: November 24, 2018, 08:13:18 PM »
Yea I mean we all saw what happened the last time a regent was given all power.  ::)

But that's different. Jonsu had in-game power but no one recognized her as a legitimate spiritual leader. When Mathurin was around with few exceptions everyone looked at him as the unquestionable authority in the church and those few who challenged him were viewed as heretics and usurpers.

Chenier

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #10: November 25, 2018, 12:28:20 AM »
Sure but Mathurin was there first, and then everyone joined under him. Your process requires taking someone new, and placing that person above everyone else. That's typically not a very popular move.

Zakky

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #11: November 25, 2018, 12:32:34 AM »
It is really hard to put someone on an equal term with Mathurin. This Severina has no history. Unless you can convince what is left of the church to try something new (and we all know how SA is like XD) maybe you can revitalize the church. But to be honest, the religion part of BM has somewhat died. They just aren't very interesting.

pcw27

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #12: November 25, 2018, 02:08:25 AM »
Sure but Mathurin was there first, and then everyone joined under him. Your process requires taking someone new, and placing that person above everyone else. That's typically not a very popular move.

True it's not easy to get people to accept submission to a higher authority, however I honestly think if that doesn't happen SA is done for. Right now it's almost exclusively devoted to in-fighting. It's impossible to mobilize anyone for anything. We run SA like a representative republic which is not a way any religion I can think of has ever been run.

If the church wont adopt Severina I'm more than happy to try and start a new religion with her. I had decent success turning the Church of Aaron into a respectably sized religion and that was while contending with the active hostility first of Path of the Paragons and then of Trinitism. I predict the old church will not put up any meaningful resistance to her because like I said it's almost impossible to mobilize them for any purpose. Under those circumstances I think no small number of SA nobles will end up joining "Severan Astroism".

Chenier

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #13: November 25, 2018, 02:16:30 AM »
True it's not easy to get people to accept submission to a higher authority, however I honestly think if that doesn't happen SA is done for. Right now it's almost exclusively devoted to in-fighting. It's impossible to mobilize anyone for anything. We run SA like a representative republic which is not a way any religion I can think of has ever been run.

If the church wont adopt Severina I'm more than happy to try and start a new religion with her. I had decent success turning the Church of Aaron into a respectably sized religion and that was while contending with the active hostility first of Path of the Paragons and then of Trinitism. I predict the old church will not put up any meaningful resistance to her because like I said it's almost impossible to mobilize them for any purpose. Under those circumstances I think no small number of SA nobles will end up joining "Severan Astroism".

With all due Respect, Church of Aaron is a small hollow religion that has a few followers in a few realms, but I don't see anyone there making any sacrifice for the religion. Almost no one there ever replies to any "to faith" messages.

Also, the old church has a few rabble rousers, like Turin. He's not very good at stamping out heresy or picking the right sides (you'll notice he's in Tol Goldora now), but he can still get the official view status changed to evil. ;)

That said, I have no stake in any of this. Good luck, and great if you pull it off. I just wouldn't evaluate your odds as being very high.

pcw27

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Re: The So Called Prophet Severina
« Reply #14: November 25, 2018, 02:45:20 AM »
With all due Respect, Church of Aaron is a small hollow religion that has a few followers in a few realms, but I don't see anyone there making any sacrifice for the religion. Almost no one there ever replies to any "to faith" messages.

Also, the old church has a few rabble rousers, like Turin. He's not very good at stamping out heresy or picking the right sides (you'll notice he's in Tol Goldora now), but he can still get the official view status changed to evil. ;)

That said, I have no stake in any of this. Good luck, and great if you pull it off. I just wouldn't evaluate your odds as being very high.

Ten members seems to be pretty average size for a religion and CoA is still rather new. Sigurd's execution was pretty widely reported on. I think that's a decent start when Trinitism was trying to box me in at every corner. Plus CoA is supposed to work in tandem with four other religions which I'm still trying to find people to found.

That's just the thing, Turin is a thorn in a lot of people's side and yet no one's actively tried to just brand him a heretic supporting a false prophet and get him kicked out. In fact he's even said he'll willingly leave if the Elders vote not to acknowledge Severina. I think people's present ambivalence to the idea of Severina is predictive to the ambivalence they'll show once she becomes an actual character.

Also please note I play Turin as being very principled. If he thinks Tol Goldora and it's faithful tyrant is being unfairly persecuted he'll support them regardless of which side looks like it's gonna win.