New Trade System Feedback

[loren]

The marketplace code doesn't allow you to broker a deal.  It doesn't recognize the hours in your pool.  Posted to the bugtracker over the weekend.  Buy order is all gone, could probably test if I'm told it's fixed by asking around for a volunteer to buy.

Original deal was cross realm boarders, haven't been able to test within realm boarders to broker a deal.

[Tom]

typo. fixed now.

[Naidraug]

Duchy Report for Reeds   (5 days, 12 hours ago)
message to the duke and nobles of Reeds

Reeds

        Due to the ongoing starvation, all commercial activities have ceased. Production is effectively at zero. Morale drops through the floor and loyalty to your realm is non-existent. If there hasn't been a rebellion yet, it is only because the people are too hungry. 1399 peasants have starved to death today.



Realm Report for Nothoi   (4 days, 12 hours ago)
message to all nobles of Nothoi

Reeds

        Due to the ongoing starvation, all commercial activities have ceased. Production is effectively at zero. Morale drops through the floor and loyalty to your realm is non-existent. If there hasn't been a rebellion yet, it is only because the people are too hungry. 1126 peasants have starved to death today.

Duchy Report for Reeds   (3 days, 12 hours ago)
message to the duke and nobles of Reeds

Reeds

        The people are starving to death! Many people are sick or don't come to work anymore. Unrest and looting are getting out of control. 431 peasants have starved to death today.

Realm Report for Nothoi   (2 days, 12 hours ago)
message to all nobles of Nothoi

Reeds

        Due to the ongoing starvation, all commercial activities have ceased. Production is effectively at zero. Morale drops through the floor and loyalty to your realm is non-existent. If there hasn't been a rebellion yet, it is only because the people are too hungry. 2714 peasants have starved to death today.

Duchy Report for Reeds   (1 day, 12 hours ago)
message to the duke and nobles of Reeds

Reeds

        The people are starving to death! Many people are sick or don't come to work anymore. Unrest and looting are getting out of control. 87 peasants have starved to death today.

Realm Report for Nothoi   (12 hours, 30 minutes ago)
message to all nobles of Nothoi

Reeds

        Due to the ongoing starvation, all commercial activities have ceased. Production is effectively at zero. Morale drops through the floor and loyalty to your realm is non-existent. If there hasn't been a rebellion yet, it is only because the people are too hungry. 299 peasants have starved to death today.


Here is the starvation messages.

Also the banker table:

Region   Production   Demand   Deficit/Surplus   Stored   will last for   Starvation
Gaxano   6   6   0   595      
Haffemet   49   13   36   356      
Iknopata   3   8   -5   789   158 days   
Naraka   57   17   40   824      
Pel Mark   2   5   -3   567   189 days   some
Reeds   7   53   -46   1357   30 days   horrible
Ren Madragas   6   6   0   531      
Zisswii   8   9   -1   548   548 days   

[Tom]

excellent, that helped.

There was a bug in the starvation calculation affecting only regions such as Reeds that never run a surplus and always need granary food. It should be much better now, though you will still see some starvation for a day or two.

[D`Este]

Would it be possible that the last posted buy order is remembered, so adding several the same buy orders is getting more easy? Or add an option to say how often you want to add the buy offer.

[loren]

Will test marketplace when I get a buy order listed.

As for the Bonds, the reason is simple.  It's a brokerage, the money is all handled by the clerks in the capital.  For gameplay reasons, if you broker a deal you shouldn't get the difference in golds but in bonds.

Obviously this makes finance in BM much more modern.  Where are my merchant prince families to establish banking when I need them.

[loren]

Yup, brokering now works.  Got my bonds all 4 of them for my deal ;-)

[fodder]

As for the Bonds, the reason is simple.  It's a brokerage, the money is all handled by the clerks in the capital.  For gameplay reasons, if you broker a deal you shouldn't get the difference in golds but in bonds.

obviously you should never be able to change bonds->gold outside of bank... as i mentioned above.. i don't think the other way is a big deal.

---
1 funny thing... i've been sitting on my arse for days in fissoa wondering why the hell there ain't no buying deals from d'hara - my trader's realm .. trader not that high skilled i don't think, with a radius of somewhere between 500-600 miles...

it's too bloody far away (around 700-800 miles away from character).. XD

so in a way it's bad, because it would rule out what i did before, travelling from d'hara to summerdale (which is even further away) as a new trader and bring back a load of food.

perhaps traders could broker deals with other traders (sort of boosting the signal to reach even further) as opposed to just deals between lords?

[Tom]

1 funny thing... i've been sitting on my arse for days in fissoa wondering why the hell there ain't no buying deals from d'hara - my trader's realm .. trader not that high skilled i don't think, with a radius of somewhere between 500-600 miles...

it's too bloody far away (around 700-800 miles away from character).. XD

Is this specifically about long sea routes? Where two regions can "border" each other (i.e. reachable via a sea route), but too far away for trading?

[De-Legro]

Is this specifically about long sea routes? Where two regions can "border" each other (i.e. reachable via a sea route), but too far away for trading?

Probably more a Dwilight thing, since  Summerdale, the other realm he mentioned doesn't border D'Hara. The long distances on Dwilight, and D'Hara's reliance on imported food results in some very long distance trading.

[fodder]

just comparing what was possible (though not necessarily desirable or frequently done thing) before and what isn't possible after. 

as a trader, technically there was no range limit before.. the limit is enough gold to pay the men (so you don't get robbed) and repair the equipment and of course, time. well, i suppose there's a limit to the distance your men is willing to go before lynching you.


"before" it was a case of knowing there's such a deal on offer before trundling off somewhere far off with lots of gold.

whereas now, don't need the gold or men since it's done in bonds.

perhaps another way of doing it would be a trader can access X miles from where he is atm + market offers of own realm?

[Eithad]

The solution is to find a local lord and another trader to set up a supply chain. Trade guilds should work nicely for this.

As Tom said, he wanted trade to be more local. If you want to set up long trade routes, they are going to have to go through some markets along the way.

[De-Legro]

just comparing what was possible (though not necessarily desirable or frequently done thing) before and what isn't possible after. 

as a trader, technically there was no range limit before.. the limit is enough gold to pay the men (so you don't get robbed) and repair the equipment and of course, time. well, i suppose there's a limit to the distance your men is willing to go before lynching you.


"before" it was a case of knowing there's such a deal on offer before trundling off somewhere far off with lots of gold.

whereas now, don't need the gold or men since it's done in bonds.

perhaps another way of doing it would be a trader can access X miles from where he is atm + market offers of own realm?

Just my opinion, but the new system wants to simulate local markets more. This change would disrupt that. To achieve truly long distance trading now looks like it will need intermediaries, or more skilled traders. But then this might only be a problem on Dwilight due to the longer distances involved.

[Tom]

The main change is not local vs. long-distance, the main change is that noble(!) traders should not be travelling salesman, but bankers, dealers, brokers, heads of merchant empires - that kind of people. The actual dirty work gets done by others.

The trading distance mainly serves two purposes: One, it gives traders an advantage over non-trader characters. Two, it forces traders to travel around a bit for the most profitable deals, as they can't do everything from the safety of their own realms capital.

I am not opposed to making sure that, for example, you can always trade with regions that have connections to your current region, even if the distance is outside your trade range. And maybe limit sea routes to something that only traders can use. Stuff like that. And thanks to the new code base that this new system builts on, adding that is fairly simple, essentially adding a few lines to the function that determines which regions are viable trade targets.

But I don't want to change things back and forth, so I'd rather have a bit of discussion and then make a decision.

[Eithad]

I need to clarify something

If a regional lord travels to the other side of the continent, he is able to access the market from a local market place there and buy food for his region that is thousands of miles away?

However if the lord sends a trader to the other side of the continent, because the trader has a limited reach and no 'home' region like the lord does, the trader is not able to broker such a trade?