Cities and Duchies

[Tom]

So hypothetically we could have a situation where Keplerstan and Evilstan are at war, and the duchy of Keplerville ends up with Evilcity as its sole city, and the duchy of Evilcity has Keplerville as only city?

Maximum lulz!

Theoretically, yes.

I do hope that over time, the duchy names will differ from the region names, though.

[Indirik]

Give all pre-existing duchies, i.e. one where the duchy name matches the city name, a one-shot name change? I'm sure you'd get a lot of takers, given the opportunity. Should be possible to filter it via code, so that ineligible requests aren't even accepted. Drop the "duchy of" string, and compare the results with the list of regions in the duchy. If you get a match, show the "Change Duchy Name" option. Leave it active for a week, then yank it out.

[De-Legro]

Give all pre-existing duchies, i.e. one where the duchy name matches the city name, a one-shot name change? I'm sure you'd get a lot of takers, given the opportunity. Should be possible to filter it via code, so that ineligible requests aren't even accepted. Drop the "duchy of" string, and compare the results with the list of regions in the duchy. If you get a match, show the "Change Duchy Name" option. Leave it active for a week, then yank it out.

Or we could use something similar to name requests, and have the Duchy Name changes recorded pending approval.

[Tom]

As duchies are purely abstract constructs anyways, I'm even thinking about allowing them to be changed rather freely. Maybe with a timer and a gold cost so it's not abused, but aside from that?

[fodder]

um... forbid change if duchy name matches realm name? (especially if not your realm)

[vonGenf]

um... forbid change if duchy name matches realm name? (especially if not your realm)

That looks like an excellent casus belli to me. It's also historically accurate: see the numerous British Kings who claimed the title of "King of France", or the title of "Duke of Normandy" that the british crowns hold onto to this day.

[Solari]

I do hope that over time, the duchy names will differ from the region names, though.

Much more likely to happen if we could rename duchies, even once.  Right now, you'd have to go through so many hoops to accomplish this that it's unlikely to happen at all, unless you do a lot of planning in the beginning.

[Telrunya]

Hmm, so what kind of Duchy names would you get? I'm always terrible at any kind of naming, so I'm left wondering how our current Duchies could be renamed.

[vonGenf]

Hmm, so what kind of Duchy names would you get? I'm always terrible at any kind of naming, so I'm left wondering how our current Duchies could be renamed.

My own duchy has been named "Duchy of the First Temple" for historical reasons.

I could easily imagine duchies such as "Duchy of West [realm]", "Duchy of the Isles" or "Ducal March", depending on geography.

I am certain people will come up with even better names. However, most probably city names will always remain popular.

[Indirik]

As duchies are purely abstract constructs anyways, I'm even thinking about allowing them to be changed rather freely. Maybe with a timer and a gold cost so it's not abused, but aside from that?

I don't think I'd allow free-form renaming, even at a gold expense. Let's face it, a gold cost, or a short civil-unrest cost is essentially no cost at all. There's enough gold floating around that it's a non-issue. What you'll end up is someone changing the name as soon as they get the duchy, or save up the gold.

[vonGenf]

What you'll end up is someone changing the name as soon as they get the duchy

Why is that a problem?

[Indirik]

You lose continuity. Getting named as a duke is a prestigious and honorable. That prestige and honor is based on the accumulated history of the duchy. Changing the name is tantamount to discarding all that history, effectively pissing on it as if it didn't matter.

[vonGenf]

You lose continuity. Getting named as a duke is a prestigious and honorable. That prestige and honor is based on the accumulated history of the duchy. Changing the name is tantamount to discarding all that history, effectively pissing on it as if it didn't matter.

I would argue that since the prestige is tied to the name of the Duchy, someone who renames a duchy is, as you, effectively a large part of the prestige that should have come with it. It's their loss however.

However, the game now makes it quite easy to create a new duchy and discards the old one. Even if you don't allow name changes, it's not too hard to think those who want a new name will get one.

But in the end, it does not matter very much. From a RP point of view they shouldn't change too often, so I can see your point.

[fodder]

That looks like an excellent casus belli to me. It's also historically accurate: see the numerous British Kings who claimed the title of "King of France", or the title of "Duke of Normandy" that the british crowns hold onto to this day.

yes.. but the thing is. those were existent titles. and they do have a blood link to it.

it's utterly stupid to have a kingdom of france.. and then someone from the other side of the world create a duchy of france.

i would even suggest ban all future ducal titles that matches existent region names. (ie.. existent ones keep... but no to new ones)

[Indirik]

i would even suggest ban all future ducal titles that matches existent region names. (ie.. existent ones keep... but no to new ones)

Wut? So when Astrum takes the city of Chrysantalys, and I create a duchy and bestow it on the Marquis of Chrysantalys, I can't all it the Duchy of Chrysantalys? I'd love to hear the rationale for that...