Better Rally Militia System

[Lorgan]

Right now, it is so that militia rallies totally unstructured after having been defeated, more affected by randomness than anything else as it seems.

Not only that, but they seem to rally only /after/ battles take place in the region.

I'd like to suggest a few things to change that and make militia somewhat useful again even after they have been defeated in the first battle.

1. Give the Lord a "rally militia" option, militia does not rally before he issues the call.
2. Change the order of sequence, make militia rally before battles take place.

Of course it should still be possible that some militia units don't rally when called upon, or that some get lost or whatever, they don't need to be 100% reliable, but it would actually be nice if you could count on a multi-thousand gold investment for more than one battle.

[Tom]

Have you thought about this being absolutely intentional?

Militia is supposed to be not as good as troops commanded by a noble. That especially includes the rallying mechanics. These are men scattered after battle without a commanding officer in sight. Frankly, most of them would probably just put away their weapons and go home.

[Lorgan]

That doesn't make much sense to me to be honest.
Which sane man would send a bunch of armed men into his city, assign the very important task of defense to them, pay them regularly but then neglect to keep any sort of supervision over them?

The militia separately don't have a commander, but as a whole, it would make a lot of sense if they did.

Even if most would put away their weapons and go home, some brave souls should have the brains to report to said commander and await his orders. In stead of randomly rallying and charging all alone at a horde of daimons. No man is that brave.

Also, part of the problem is that while some them rallied, they only rallied after the nobles had already fought the battle. If they're going to rally and fight, they should do it before battle takes place. Again, any man would rather do that then fight alone.

[Tom]

Sorry, but the system makes a ton of sense.

If militia rallies, then it does it at the BEGINNING of the turn, i.e. after combat. It's been like that for what? 10 years? The purpose is to make it predictable. DURING the turn, when you are giving your orders, you know which militia units have rallied and which ones haven't, so you can plan accordingly.

It does make sense that they rally individually. After all, this is what being scattered means: They've lost contact to central command. Sure there is some kind of local commander, but he's not with the individual unit. He's probably hiding somewhere else in the woods. After rallying, those units that did rally will again fight together as an army on the battlefield, but there's simply no way for the various scattered troops to know WHEN to rally. Because they are - doh - scattered.

[Solari]

The policy treats militia and nobles differently, when it shouldn't.  They're fighting in close quarters.  In your scenario, where forces are isolated or cut off from command, everyone would be affected.  If militia are to be considered reliable at all, they should all rally in the following round.  So, I must disagree respectfully.

[Eithad]

Sorry, but the system makes a ton of sense.

If militia rallies, then it does it at the BEGINNING of the turn, i.e. after combat. It's been like that for what? 10 years? The purpose is to make it predictable. DURING the turn, when you are giving your orders, you know which militia units have rallied and which ones haven't, so you can plan accordingly.

If I understand it this is the issue, (I was wounded so I can't confirm myself). If a militia unit is rallying it does not fight in combat that turn. It is rallying for that turn, misses combat and rallies after combat has completed and is ready to fight the turn after.

If a noble unit is rallying, it rallies before combat and will fight in combat of the turn that it was rallying.

[Tom]

The policy treats militia and nobles differently, when it shouldn't.  They're fighting in close quarters.

They are different. And they are not fighting in close quarters. The fighting is over, they lost and fled to wherever they could hide.

Look, this is how the system works and has been working pretty much forever. Its workings are easy to understand. Work with it.

[Tom]

If I understand it this is the issue, (I was wounded so I can't confirm myself). If a militia unit is rallying it does not fight in combat that turn. It is rallying for that turn, misses combat and rallies after combat has completed and is ready to fight the turn after.

If a noble unit is rallying, it rallies before combat and will fight in combat of the turn that it was rallying.

I don't understand why people overcomplicate things when they have an agenda.

It really is trivial. It is so simple that I'm embarassed that I have to explain it.

   
• Units that rally enter a state called "rallying". They remain in that state until the next turn. At the following turn, they become fully active again.
• Militia units have a random chance to rally at the turn. When they rally, they enter the rallying state. At the following turn, they become fully active again.
• Noble-led units rally on command of their noble. When they rally, they enter the rallying state. At the following turn, they become fully active again.

The difference between militia and noble-led units is that militia doesn't have a player to click the "rally" button, so during turn calculations, like EVERYTHING ELSE THAT HAPPENS, there is a random chance that the computer presses the virtual "rally" button. But the results are identical.

The main difference gameplay-wise is that since they are not led by a capable noble, but by some commoner captain who may or may not be worth his salary, militia rallies randomly while players can decide if and when to rally.

[Zakilevo]

Cmon. Captains are just salary men. Militia units aren't trained as hard as noble led troops. Even if they were once under nobles, once they become militia I am sure they become lazy just like their fellow friends guarding the city.

[Foundation]

Thank you for your input, everyone.  I believe Tom's posts were sufficiently clear.

[Foundation]

Perhaps it was not as clear as I thought it was.

Please note that Tom said militia rallies at the turn.  Effectively every turn after the battle they have a chance of clicking the figurative rally button right after the turn change.

Thus, militia units take at least 2 turns (including the battle) to rally whereas nobles can rally in 1 turn if they want.

[egamma]

Perhaps it was not as clear as I thought it was.

Please note that Tom said militia rallies at the turn.  Effectively every turn after the battle they have a chance of clicking the figurative rally button right after the turn change.

Thus, militia units take at least 2 turns (including the battle) to rally whereas nobles can rally in 1 turn if they want.

So...
If militia are in a rallying state 1  hour before the turn, they will participate in combat at the turn change?
If militia are scattered 1 hour before the turn, they will not participate in combat at the turn change?

[Lorgan]

So...
If militia are in a rallying state 1  hour before the turn, they will participate in combat at the turn change?
If militia are scattered 1 hour before the turn, they will not participate in combat at the turn change?

As I understand it: yes.

[Eithad]

As I understand it: yes.

Thats not what you said on IRC...

This is what you said was happening

Turn change (virtual rallying button pressed) ---->militia rallying---->Next turn change (still rallying, no battle)----> militia stationary

Either way it doesnt really matter as long as we know what the status means. If their status says rallying militia will not be in the next battle.

[Lorgan]

Turn change (virtual rallying button pressed) ---->militia rallying---->Next turn change (still rallying, no battle)----> militia stationary

Huh? No. I in fact specifically complained about the militia rallying and doing battle only at sunset, which destroyed my walls without being of much use...