Fontan's Surprising Strength

[DamnTaffer]

Anti-Saxon clan anyone?

Who's definition of Saxon? The actual players from Thulsoma or Averoth, Thulsoma, Arcachon, Caerwyn, Aurvandil and Fontan?

[feyeleanor]

All that winking you did made me suspicious, but it's amazing how you managed to get 15 nobles in less than a week or two. Explain that, did all of sudden people want to say. "Hey, let's all go to this one duchy realm instead of going to the almighty Sirion or Perdan!" Nobody cares about your "Fontan secret" I just want to know how 55 nobles don't cash starve lords...

I'd guess many of them are refugees from the south. When a realm the size of Ibladesh self-destructs many players lose interest in the rebuilding, something we experienced in Fontan when the war with Sirion ended. There's also been some immigration from Sirion which now lacks any obvious enemy.

If Fontan's last rise to prominence taught us anything it's that the scent of a good war encourages immigration, whilst the boisterous nature of a democracy leads to a high rate of retention. That's how at one time we had 160+ nobles.

As to the finances of those nobles, I assume some of them are relying on family gold but there's hardly any crime in that. I have characters in the Colonies who have to do much the same at times.

[DamnTaffer]

Reading is not your forte, apparently.

Nor english yours, just because you put that perhaps it isn't cheating, doesn't mean your not accusing of it... What your actually doing is pretending to have an open mind while openly and rather stalwardly accusing a group of players a group which constantly expands depending on whom has done ANYTHING of merit that day on battlemaster of cheating.

-----------Rewriten------

You are accusing players of cheating, just because you said that perhaps they might not be cheating, doesn't mean you are not accusing them of cheating.

Your defination of "Saxon" is getting absurd, Averoth and Thulsoma are not the same realm, they are however both dead, as such there nobles moved to other realms. That does not mean that within any realm where there is a saxon that there is cheating. Nor does it mean that any realm a Saxon is titled that within that realm is a powergaming clan

[Velax]

Not sure I'm the one with the English problem, because I have little idea of what you just said.

You and your fellow Saxons need to get over this victim mentality of "Oh, they just complain when we win" and actually address and take on board people's concerns. You're certainly not doing yourself any favours here.

[Ketchum]

Not sure I'm the one with the English problem, because I have little idea of what you just said.

You and your fellow Saxons need to get over this victim mentality of "Oh, they just complain when we win" and actually address and take on board people's concerns. You're certainly not doing yourself any favours here.

Velax, do I do myself a favor explaining in my earlier posts? I feel I have been giving too much away already  8)

[DamnTaffer]

Not sure I'm the one with the English problem, because I have little idea of what you just said.

You and your fellow Saxons need to get over this victim mentality of "Oh, they just complain when we win" and actually address and take on board people's concerns. You're certainly not doing yourself any favours here.

Velax, if you don't understand, i'll rewrite that post for you.

But, I'm not a Saxon, and your assumation that: Finds your constant persecution of saxons ridiculous > is a Saxon, is wrong.

[feyeleanor]

Let me explain something from the Westmoor side.

Former King Flaylen refused to return Krimml to Fotan, causing the issue.

After Flaylen was removed via protests, former King Maedros ascended to the throne and attempted to mend the fence between Westmoor and Fontan. He formally apologised over the incident and formally ceased all claims and rights to Krimml and acknowledged it belonged to Fontan. We attempted to make peace and heal the wounds, Fontan was never interested in this.

I also will remind you that Fontan and Sirion heavily damaged the city when you forcibly retook it. Dont blame this on Westmoor when it was your own fault for causing the damage to it.

Prior to the ceasefire, Westmoor sued quite vigorously for peace. We agreed to halt our forces within Westmoorian lands while we held diplomatic discussions with your Ambassadors. Yet, during this time, Fontan kept sending forces into our lands, striking at our nobles and plundering regions for tax gold.

After we agreed to the ceasefire we put together a fair and just peace agreement which Fontan refused to accept. Even Sirion's leader agreed it was a reasonable peace proposal that we had put forth.

Instead you make unreasonable demands for insane amounts of gold for damage to property your own forces made, try to make claims on Westmoorian lands, attempt to impose unreasonable military restrictions on our bordering regions.

No, Fotan never wanted peace. Just breathing room so they could rebuild.

I accept the issue over Krimml and what happened, former King Flaylen made a mistake on that part which caused hostilities between the two realms. But after he was removed, Westmoor made attempts more than once, to rectify the situation.

What attempts or efforts did Fontan make at all, if any??

None.

Speaking as a player, I personally wish Basilius had let the matter lie until Fontan had an army with which to fight a war, but he didn't and as my character Rhidhana was Minister of Defence she fought the most effective campaign she could under the circumstances. Westmoor by contrast fought a very poor campaign, punctuated if I remember rightly by one of their semi-regular civil wars.

All military activity stopped when the ceasefire was agreed. That's the point of a ceasefire.

Since then Fontan has allowed Westmoor more than enough opportunities to sign the peace treaty agreed subsequent to the ceasefire but King Jor seemed determined to keep removing equitable terms and replacing them with terms wholly advantageous to Westmoor, which was not a fair reflection of the military situation at the time of the ceasefire.

King Jor must think that starting a war now and displaying Westmoor's usual military competence will drag Perdan and Caligus in, allowing him to gain Fontan's lands as a gift from them. There's no other reasonable justification for picking a war which his realm is very likely to lose.

[feyeleanor]

I think we are all overexaggerating, let's see how the war turns out, if Westmoor wins where will the talk of Saxons go? Also, Sonya, I'm pretty sure you can't get 100 gold from looting rural regions....

Pick the right day and the right region... during the last war with Westmoor I looted 800 gold in two weeks from her southern provinces. That not only paid for my substantial company of archers, it also put some much needed gold in the pockets of my knights :)

[Tom]

Regarding the view of the dev team - we are fairly certain there is no actual cheating going on.

However, we have noticed certain groups of players repeatedly showing the same approach to whatever realm they happen to be in at that time, and that has us worried because they are powergaming. Not speaking specifically about Fontan, we don't like it when an entire realm works like clockwork with almost no internal messages, no conflict, no nothing. Playing a piece in a machine is not what BattleMaster is about and more importantly, organizing the whole thing OOC whether amongst friends on the school yard or on IRC is borderline abusive because it excludes the other players who aren't members of your gang, clan or whatever you want to call it.

This is why we keep our eyes on certain realms.

[Velax]

Your defination of "Saxon" is getting absurd, Averoth and Thulsoma are not the same realm, they are however both dead, as such there nobles moved to other realms. That does not mean that within any realm where there is a saxon that there is cheating. Nor does it mean that any realm a Saxon is titled that within that realm is a powergaming clan

I've already stated, repeatedly, why I have said what I said. The leader of these clanners joined Fontan. Within a relatively short space of time Fontan now has the the second strongest, possibly strongest, military on the continent, outpacing established powerhouses like Perdan and even Sirion, despite having just 7 regions and a piss-poor economy. This clan leader had just left another realm on another island where the exact same thing happened - a one duchy realm with mainly quite poor regions managed to put some 25,000 CS together - not just once or twice, but consistently, for months - as well as having near-perfect movement rates. And this is the same clan - lead by the same person - who was responsible for the Thulsoma family gold exploit. While they got away with it scott-free because the devs never considered that anyone would so brazenly abuse the system and so never made a rule against it, it certainly proves that this clan is more than willing to employ any measure it can, dodgy or otherwise, to win. Maybe that's the type of game you want to play, but it's certainly not the type I want to.

[T Strike]

Speaking as a player, I personally wish Basilius had let the matter lie until Fontan had an army with which to fight a war, but he didn't and as my character Rhidhana was Minister of Defence she fought the most effective campaign she could under the circumstances. Westmoor by contrast fought a very poor campaign, punctuated if I remember rightly by one of their semi-regular civil wars.

All military activity stopped when the ceasefire was agreed. That's the point of a ceasefire.

Since then Fontan has allowed Westmoor more than enough opportunities to sign the peace treaty agreed subsequent to the ceasefire but King Jor seemed determined to keep removing equitable terms and replacing them with terms wholly advantageous to Westmoor, which was not a fair reflection of the military situation at the time of the ceasefire.

King Jor must think that starting a war now and displaying Westmoor's usual military competence will drag Perdan and Caligus in, allowing him to gain Fontan's lands as a gift from them. There's no other reasonable justification for picking a war which his realm is very likely to lose.

Ok, so before the Sirion interception, who do you think would have won the war? Westmoor was in control of both Commonyr and Oberndorf. Until Sirion stepped in and wanted peace for a future Nivemus to be created... So I'm sure King Jor had a reason on why to not except Fontan's rediculous "peace offers", when so clearly Fontan would be down to Krimml by now.

[Chaotrance13]

(Whining, insults and bitching here)

I don't mind fighting a war and losing even if it's something like two realms versus one. But what I do mind is when clans get involved and I have players who I consider my friends tell me "I'm leaving after this, this isn't why I play this game" when they find out that the Saxons are involved. But I suppose as long as you win, you'll take your sick, twisted and perverse pleasure in it OOC.

I hope your conscience sits well with this, because it is you and your friends who allowed the Saxons to take hold and put Fontan into overdrive. And it is because of you and your friends that means my friends will leave this game.

That is why I asked Tom via email to take a look. And while it's not classified as cheating, it leaves a foul taste in my mouth that isn't easily washed away. I left other games to get away from this hive-mind mentality. And now I find it's cropped up again, I'm also not sure whether I want to continue playing either.

[T Strike]

I don't mind fighting a war and losing even if it's something like two realms versus one. But what I do mind is when clans get involved and I have players who I consider my friends tell me "I'm leaving after this, this isn't why I play this game" when they find out that the Saxons are involved. But I suppose as long as you win, you'll take your sick, twisted and perverse pleasure in it OOC.

I hope your conscience sits well with this, because it is you and your friends who allowed the Saxons to take hold and put Fontan into overdrive. And it is because of you and your friends that means my friends will leave this game.

That is why I asked Tom via email to take a look. And while it's not classified as cheating, it leaves a foul taste in my mouth that isn't easily washed away. I left other games to get away from this hive-mind mentality. And now I find it's cropped up again, I'm also not sure whether I want to continue playing either.

Aww, c'mon man don't do that. :( I'm sure we'll get through this ordeal...

[DamnTaffer]

I've already stated, repeatedly, why I have said what I said. The leader of these clanners joined Fontan. Within a relatively short space of time Fontan now has the the second strongest, possibly strongest, military on the continent, outpacing established powerhouses like Perdan and even Sirion, despite having just 7 regions and a piss-poor economy. This clan leader had just left another realm on another island where the exact same thing happened - a one duchy realm with mainly quite poor regions managed to put some 25,000 CS together - not just once or twice, but consistently, for months - as well as having near-perfect movement rates. And this is the same clan - lead by the same person - who was responsible for the Thulsoma family gold exploit. While they got away with it scott-free because the devs never considered that anyone would so brazenly abuse the system and so never made a rule against it, it certainly proves that this clan is more than willing to employ any measure it can, dodgy or otherwise, to win. Maybe that's the type of game you want to play, but it's certainly not the type I want to.

Perhaps you should clarify, Whom is the leader of this clan? Whom are the clanners? Which realms were they in that did this? What positions of power do they hold in fontan currently to be able to influence a realm this way?

You've completely dropped your veil of non accusations of cheating now, which is definately a breach of the social contract.

A Vanimedle got punished for doing this IN PRIVATE, your doing it in public and constantly, but since you've already shown blatent disregard for the rules of this game you should definately state exactly what you say in detail, with evidence, naming names, dates and events

[Chaotrance13]

Perhaps you should clarify, Whom is the leader of this clan? Whom are the clanners? Which realms were they in that did this? What positions of power do they hold in fontan currently to be able to influence a realm this way?

You've completely dropped your veil of non accusations of cheating now, which is definately a breach of the social contract.

A Vanimedle got punished for doing this IN PRIVATE, your doing it in public and constantly, but since you've already shown blatent disregard for the rules of this game you should definately state exactly what you say in detail, with evidence, naming names, dates and events

Take it to the Magistrates/Titans. Accusing someone of a violation of the contract in public is also breaking it. Whether you have evidence or not.