Author Topic: The Current War  (Read 553310 times)

Carna

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #495: October 30, 2011, 07:57:55 AM »
Its not as if CE are unbeatable. Its just that the other realm's don't really want CE to be beaten. The south east is in tatters due to infighting and lack of motivation. The others either send token forces or refuse to make a united push to attack CE, rather than CE's buffers. Look at the distance Darka travels. CE are good and deserve recognition for that fact, but they're not the one's hamstringing the efforts against them. Their enemies ensure their continued dominance. I don't doubt that there are a lot of people who'd like to see things change, but there are actually more that don't. Everyone in the "Central Alliance" presumably doesn't want to see the situation change and while there are people outside who do, if it was everyone there wouldn't be all these complications or failure to follow orders.

I'm unsympathetic because CE's rulership of Atamara is only possible because others allow it, whether by assisting or by not devoting every resource to removing them from that position. I agree that the whole thing isn't ideal for overall gameplay, but I won't blame or hold it against them because they're only doing, very well, what they should do and have loyal allies.

Meh.


Geronus

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #496: October 30, 2011, 02:22:36 PM »
Its not as if CE are unbeatable. Its just that the other realm's don't really want CE to be beaten. The south east is in tatters due to infighting and lack of motivation. The others either send token forces or refuse to make a united push to attack CE, rather than CE's buffers. Look at the distance Darka travels. CE are good and deserve recognition for that fact, but they're not the one's hamstringing the efforts against them. Their enemies ensure their continued dominance. I don't doubt that there are a lot of people who'd like to see things change, but there are actually more that don't. Everyone in the "Central Alliance" presumably doesn't want to see the situation change and while there are people outside who do, if it was everyone there wouldn't be all these complications or failure to follow orders.

I'm unsympathetic because CE's rulership of Atamara is only possible because others allow it, whether by assisting or by not devoting every resource to removing them from that position. I agree that the whole thing isn't ideal for overall gameplay, but I won't blame or hold it against them because they're only doing, very well, what they should do and have loyal allies.

Meh.

You are certainly right in some respects, but the problem isn't all that no one will focus on CE. We tried that for a little bit and found out that it's almost impossible to take the fight to CE when CE's allies are devoting all their effort to keeping you off CE's back. We switched focus to Tara because of how disruptive they were to our efforts. Of poor coordination and certain realms' weird friendships with certain of our enemies you are absolutely correct. Eston and Darka do us very little good when they declare that they won't fight certain enemy realms that border them, and coordination in the north has been piss poor. That's less because we like it that way though than that we suck.

Bael

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #497: October 30, 2011, 03:14:41 PM »
I just want to congratulate Severus Scarlett's player on nearly choking me to death earlier today with the following hilarity:

"somewhere between your letters and the Queen's was lain and incubated the Egg of Disaster, which hath now hatched into the Chicken of Regret."

That's pretty amazing  ;D
I would definitely be giving a fun medal for that!!

Vaylon Kenadell

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #498: October 30, 2011, 09:05:50 PM »
That's pretty amazing  ;D
I would definitely be giving a fun medal for that!!

I don't think I can give out medals. At least, I don't know how, and (like nearly everything else) it isn't explained anywhere.

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #499: October 30, 2011, 09:52:12 PM »
I don't think I can give out medals. At least, I don't know how, and (like nearly everything else) it isn't explained anywhere.

http://wiki.battlemaster.org/wiki/Help:Medals

Vaylon Kenadell

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #500: October 30, 2011, 11:50:46 PM »
http://wiki.battlemaster.org/wiki/Help:Medals

Look at what comes up if you search for "Medals" on the BM Wiki. The first link that comes up is "Sandalak (SEI)/Recipients of Service medals." Please don't imply that I didn't even bother looking around, because I did.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2011, 11:53:21 PM by Vaylon Kenadell »

Dante Silverfire

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #501: October 31, 2011, 05:33:43 AM »
Look at what comes up if you search for "Medals" on the BM Wiki. The first link that comes up is "Sandalak (SEI)/Recipients of Service medals." Please don't imply that I didn't even bother looking around, because I did.

He's not implying that at all. It is well understood that some things are hard to find. Just provided the link.
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Carna

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #502: October 31, 2011, 08:11:06 AM »
Yeah, but as much as Eston and Darka not attacking Coria and Talerium respectively doesn't particularly help, the real issue as I see it is Darka failing to disregard Talerium's military and, along with Eston's armies, march right through northeast Talerium to decimate Eaglin and the surrounding regions. Or hit Cagil. Or Calis. All three of CE's biggest cities are on the west side of that river and Darka and Eston together could well capitalize on that. It won't make the fight substantially easier for the anti-CE alliance given that CE are mostly terrorizing the poor defenseless (seems that way, at least) Carelia but long-term if there's a want to weaken or disarm CE, it's to hit its big gold production. Burning food won't, obviously, do much good with so much food producing land on either side of the river. Which does bring up the interesting point of rather than Eston/Darka hitting CE's fortified cities, they coordinate a looting raid right down the depth of CE on the west bank of the river with the northern realms hitting the eastern bank down to Esgalons or Vornion. Course, the northern realms would have to break through.

Tara is CE. The banners should give that away. Ottar is very close with his brother, a senior member of the Imperial Senate. While he's in power, Tara will be unquestionably loyal to their Federated allies. If those badlands of Tara's were rural regions, there wouldn't be a point of even bothering looting CE unless you've emptied Tara's warehouses first and burned their fields. And let's face it, a Tyranny makes for good army discipline  >:( Inseperable as they are, Tara should be the primary concern of the north (Barony, MI, etc.) If you can't kill them, cripple them at the least. Send a properly loyal noble or two down who don't look too loyal to you. Join the underground. See if you can stir strife against Ottar. Or send traders down to Tara/CE to buy all their food to cause a little starvation. No one remembers CE doing that to Eston?

And speaking of Eston, I don't blame them for their diplomacy with Coria. I'm biased, but I'd see it as a nice little stepping stone. Hell, that's what I saw it as - much to my irritation at the time - when I was in CE. And not a good stepping stone. Coria likes its independence. It doesn't forget its masters, but it hates being viewed as CE's colony or buffer or domain. They like to feel more important than that - and not without just cause - and no doubt welcomes the thoughts of having their own diplomacy that isn't dominated by CE's foreign policy. But they know CE is better than you. Ask Mr. Dante there. But turning Coria's alliegence wouldn't be a bad thing. Think of their two big cities, their future mountain holdings, and consider the access that provides into Tara and/or CE? Hammersett has its problems with Coria, I acknowledge, but they're not a real realm and could even be gifted to Coria (read as bribery) at the start of their inclusion in the war against CE.

So yeah. I've had this building up in me for ages now but, y'know, loyalty to my first realm is hard to get over. This is, if you ask me, how you beat CE. The southeast is a mess. Ignore them. Heh, the problem is of course that this would require the level of unity CE and its allies rely on, not something the rest can really lay claim to. Still, people complain about Atamara being stagnant. I tend to disagree not because a lot happens or changes, but because its the status quo that most people readily accept. Stagnant? Maybe. But its not a necessary state for the continent, in my mind, because its something that could change if there really was all this devotion to taking down CE we see on the forums and the ruler channel. Course, now I'm starting to get why people say Atamara is stagnant. Who knows though? Maybe someone will work behind the scenes to do what I suggest or something else to shake things up. You can usually rely on ambition to provide such people. The usual problem is that the powers that be are quite happy with how things are, so one or two voices are drowned out in yawns. Stagnant, but because not enough people want more than what they already have. Sad. Nobles are meant to be ambitious and cunning not honourable and lazy.

Not that I feel strongly on this or anything... :-X

De-Legro

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #503: October 31, 2011, 10:56:55 AM »
Yeah, but as much as Eston and Darka not attacking Coria and Talerium respectively doesn't particularly help, the real issue as I see it is Darka failing to disregard Talerium's military and, along with Eston's armies, march right through northeast Talerium to decimate Eaglin and the surrounding regions. Or hit Cagil. Or Calis. All three of CE's biggest cities are on the west side of that river and Darka and Eston together could well capitalize on that. It won't make the fight substantially easier for the anti-CE alliance given that CE are mostly terrorizing the poor defenseless (seems that way, at least) Carelia but long-term if there's a want to weaken or disarm CE, it's to hit its big gold production. Burning food won't, obviously, do much good with so much food producing land on either side of the river. Which does bring up the interesting point of rather than Eston/Darka hitting CE's fortified cities, they coordinate a looting raid right down the depth of CE on the west bank of the river with the northern realms hitting the eastern bank down to Esgalons or Vornion. Course, the northern realms would have to break through.

Tara is CE. The banners should give that away. Ottar is very close with his brother, a senior member of the Imperial Senate. While he's in power, Tara will be unquestionably loyal to their Federated allies. If those badlands of Tara's were rural regions, there wouldn't be a point of even bothering looting CE unless you've emptied Tara's warehouses first and burned their fields. And let's face it, a Tyranny makes for good army discipline  >:( Inseperable as they are, Tara should be the primary concern of the north (Barony, MI, etc.) If you can't kill them, cripple them at the least. Send a properly loyal noble or two down who don't look too loyal to you. Join the underground. See if you can stir strife against Ottar. Or send traders down to Tara/CE to buy all their food to cause a little starvation. No one remembers CE doing that to Eston?

And speaking of Eston, I don't blame them for their diplomacy with Coria. I'm biased, but I'd see it as a nice little stepping stone. Hell, that's what I saw it as - much to my irritation at the time - when I was in CE. And not a good stepping stone. Coria likes its independence. It doesn't forget its masters, but it hates being viewed as CE's colony or buffer or domain. They like to feel more important than that - and not without just cause - and no doubt welcomes the thoughts of having their own diplomacy that isn't dominated by CE's foreign policy. But they know CE is better than you. Ask Mr. Dante there. But turning Coria's alliegence wouldn't be a bad thing. Think of their two big cities, their future mountain holdings, and consider the access that provides into Tara and/or CE? Hammersett has its problems with Coria, I acknowledge, but they're not a real realm and could even be gifted to Coria (read as bribery) at the start of their inclusion in the war against CE.

So yeah. I've had this building up in me for ages now but, y'know, loyalty to my first realm is hard to get over. This is, if you ask me, how you beat CE. The southeast is a mess. Ignore them. Heh, the problem is of course that this would require the level of unity CE and its allies rely on, not something the rest can really lay claim to. Still, people complain about Atamara being stagnant. I tend to disagree not because a lot happens or changes, but because its the status quo that most people readily accept. Stagnant? Maybe. But its not a necessary state for the continent, in my mind, because its something that could change if there really was all this devotion to taking down CE we see on the forums and the ruler channel. Course, now I'm starting to get why people say Atamara is stagnant. Who knows though? Maybe someone will work behind the scenes to do what I suggest or something else to shake things up. You can usually rely on ambition to provide such people. The usual problem is that the powers that be are quite happy with how things are, so one or two voices are drowned out in yawns. Stagnant, but because not enough people want more than what they already have. Sad. Nobles are meant to be ambitious and cunning not honourable and lazy.

Not that I feel strongly on this or anything... :-X

The bigger problem is that the ambition of one or even a few people does not readily convert into tight co-operation and activity of entire realms. There are ways to encourage active players to join realms sure, but there are not guarantee's that you can attract the necessary forces.
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Telrunya

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #504: October 31, 2011, 03:49:37 PM »
Look at what comes up if you search for "Medals" on the BM Wiki. The first link that comes up is "Sandalak (SEI)/Recipients of Service medals." Please don't imply that I didn't even bother looking around, because I did.

This is because the search does not include the Help Pages. On that page, right under the search box, 'Content pages' are selected. Select 'Help and Project pages' and you will search the help files, which will guide you to the right page. You can also reach it via the ingame help, but for any wiki searches, try to switch to the help files or everything when you look up information. I only just figured this out as well, but it helps a lot.

Geronus

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #505: October 31, 2011, 06:06:10 PM »
Yeah, but as much as Eston and Darka not attacking Coria and Talerium respectively doesn't particularly help, the real issue as I see it is Darka failing to disregard Talerium's military and, along with Eston's armies, march right through northeast Talerium to decimate Eaglin and the surrounding regions. Or hit Cagil. Or Calis. All three of CE's biggest cities are on the west side of that river and Darka and Eston together could well capitalize on that. It won't make the fight substantially easier for the anti-CE alliance given that CE are mostly terrorizing the poor defenseless (seems that way, at least) Carelia but long-term if there's a want to weaken or disarm CE, it's to hit its big gold production. Burning food won't, obviously, do much good with so much food producing land on either side of the river. Which does bring up the interesting point of rather than Eston/Darka hitting CE's fortified cities, they coordinate a looting raid right down the depth of CE on the west bank of the river with the northern realms hitting the eastern bank down to Esgalons or Vornion. Course, the northern realms would have to break through.

Tara is CE. The banners should give that away. Ottar is very close with his brother, a senior member of the Imperial Senate. While he's in power, Tara will be unquestionably loyal to their Federated allies. If those badlands of Tara's were rural regions, there wouldn't be a point of even bothering looting CE unless you've emptied Tara's warehouses first and burned their fields. And let's face it, a Tyranny makes for good army discipline  >:( Inseperable as they are, Tara should be the primary concern of the north (Barony, MI, etc.) If you can't kill them, cripple them at the least. Send a properly loyal noble or two down who don't look too loyal to you. Join the underground. See if you can stir strife against Ottar. Or send traders down to Tara/CE to buy all their food to cause a little starvation. No one remembers CE doing that to Eston?

And speaking of Eston, I don't blame them for their diplomacy with Coria. I'm biased, but I'd see it as a nice little stepping stone. Hell, that's what I saw it as - much to my irritation at the time - when I was in CE. And not a good stepping stone. Coria likes its independence. It doesn't forget its masters, but it hates being viewed as CE's colony or buffer or domain. They like to feel more important than that - and not without just cause - and no doubt welcomes the thoughts of having their own diplomacy that isn't dominated by CE's foreign policy. But they know CE is better than you. Ask Mr. Dante there. But turning Coria's alliegence wouldn't be a bad thing. Think of their two big cities, their future mountain holdings, and consider the access that provides into Tara and/or CE? Hammersett has its problems with Coria, I acknowledge, but they're not a real realm and could even be gifted to Coria (read as bribery) at the start of their inclusion in the war against CE.

So yeah. I've had this building up in me for ages now but, y'know, loyalty to my first realm is hard to get over. This is, if you ask me, how you beat CE. The southeast is a mess. Ignore them. Heh, the problem is of course that this would require the level of unity CE and its allies rely on, not something the rest can really lay claim to. Still, people complain about Atamara being stagnant. I tend to disagree not because a lot happens or changes, but because its the status quo that most people readily accept. Stagnant? Maybe. But its not a necessary state for the continent, in my mind, because its something that could change if there really was all this devotion to taking down CE we see on the forums and the ruler channel. Course, now I'm starting to get why people say Atamara is stagnant. Who knows though? Maybe someone will work behind the scenes to do what I suggest or something else to shake things up. You can usually rely on ambition to provide such people. The usual problem is that the powers that be are quite happy with how things are, so one or two voices are drowned out in yawns. Stagnant, but because not enough people want more than what they already have. Sad. Nobles are meant to be ambitious and cunning not honourable and lazy.

Not that I feel strongly on this or anything... :-X

We actually did attempt to attack CE from that direction for a while. Hammarsett, BoM and Eston made some raids through Talerium. The problem was that Tara's entire army would show up and kick our ass every time we did, hence the shift in strategy. We thought that as long as Tara was intent on propping up the Empire no questions asked, we should probably take the fight to them and try to damage their warmaking ability.

Tara and CE are more or less wedded at the hip, I know. It's disappointing actually. Talerium and Coria are almost window-dressing, those two alone are the real power bloc. As long as Tara and CE are so tightly knit I don't think there's much chance of a change to the status quo.

Dante Silverfire

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #506: November 01, 2011, 02:25:20 AM »
We actually did attempt to attack CE from that direction for a while. Hammarsett, BoM and Eston made some raids through Talerium. The problem was that Tara's entire army would show up and kick our ass every time we did, hence the shift in strategy. We thought that as long as Tara was intent on propping up the Empire no questions asked, we should probably take the fight to them and try to damage their warmaking ability.

Tara and CE are more or less wedded at the hip, I know. It's disappointing actually. Talerium and Coria are almost window-dressing, those two alone are the real power bloc. As long as Tara and CE are so tightly knit I don't think there's much chance of a change to the status quo.

The thing is, that you are half correct and half dead wrong.

The correct part is: Let's say Talerium and Coria just weren't here right now and that space was empty. You are correct in that with the way the war is currently being executed by CE/Tara's enemies they would still lose to Tara and CE.

The wrong part is: CE and Tara being unified in a federation is NOT what is stopping this war from going in your favor. CE/Tara are quite beatable, I just don't believe its being executed correctly. Or, that as Carna has stated that the enemies against them really want it to happen. Then again, I don't plan on saying how I think they could be beaten, because well I'm on their side right now. (or at least my char is).
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Re: The Current War
« Reply #507: November 01, 2011, 02:37:55 AM »
Yeah, see that's lame. Lame, lame, lame lame, lame. Who the hell wants to play on an island where one realm basically dictates the outcome of every conflict? Sure, it might be fun for CE, and maybe even their hangers-on. For everyone else it just sucks the fun out of the game. Everything they do must play to CE. They are not free to pursue their own agendas naturally. Instead they can only succeed in their endeavors if CE either helps them of turns a blind eye. So basically, conflict-wise, the only way to ever get anything you want is to convince CE to join the war you want to fight on your side, at which time it becomes a horribly one-sided gang bang. That or convince them to not get involved, but since they're basically always looking for an excuse to fight someone just for entertainment, it's pretty much impossible to keep them out of a war unless they're involved in one of their own already.

This right here is pretty much everything I hate about Atamara. It's like an Old Boys Club. There's so much back-patting going on at the highest levels that all conflict on the island always feels contrived and inevitably changes nothing in the grand scheme of things. People complain about our retention problem? This kind of atmosphere I feel is partly to blame. The current war is the best thing to have happened to Atamara in a long time, but it's emblematic of everything that's wrong with Atamara that most of the island united against CE and it still doesn't look like we can beat them.

A history of utterly annihilating one's enemies will do that  ;)

The whole business with Caerwyn has us united and in a very bellicose mood. Moderates and peaceniks of all stripes have more or less gone into hiding or been converted into hawks, at least temporarily. This is probably the worst possible time in the history of Dwilight to start trouble with SA, no joke.

The bear is not asleep, it is very awake and very angry, and freshly returned from a very satisfying mauling. So satisfying in fact that it's really considering abandoning rooting for grubs and honey and taking up mauling on a full-time basis, as a sort of professional killer bear. After all it reflects, nature seems to have given it a whole lot of pointy claws and teeth and a large amount of muscle with which to employ them, so perhaps this is what it intended for bears all along, and all those grubs and honey were really just distractions from its true purpose, which is apparently to maul innocent campers, especially ones seen in possession of pointy sticks the sort with which it was recently poked by a couple of particularly overconfident campers, much to their eventual dismay.

Campers beware: Avoid the bear. And avoid picking up pointy sticks. The bear will eventually realize that it can't make a living mauling things, and then it will go back to periodically hibernating and rooting for grubs and honey. But until that time, it would be most unwise for any camper to approach the bear, especially while in possession of a pointy stick.

The same person wrote these two posts? Really?
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Perth

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #508: November 01, 2011, 03:23:15 AM »
The same person wrote these two posts? Really?

LOL
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Geronus

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Re: The Current War
« Reply #509: November 01, 2011, 05:12:13 AM »
The same person wrote these two posts? Really?

Whether you find this surprising depends on whether you equate SA with the CE bloc. Personally I do not.

In any case, I don't blame the players on the other side for doing what they do. Like Carna said, it makes perfect sense. I just don't like the atmosphere that results.

EDIT: Which I suppose just goes to show that I should quit complaining and just pause my Atamara character already...
« Last Edit: November 01, 2011, 05:15:37 AM by Geronus »