Rejected: Remove adventurers from the game

[Anaris]

Ok, I asked several times and always got the same answer, but I want to have it on a record here and coming from a dev:

If the same thing was done using noble characters instead of adventurer characters - would it be ok?

Yes, for a variety of reasons.

Three of the top reasons are that nobles were always intended to be the ones using scrolls, and nobles either have to bring a unit (and face battle) or risk capture just from moving through the region, and, of course, that they can't pop into a region, read a scroll, and pop right back out with it being literally impossible for anyone in the region to do anything about it.

[Bronnen]

Yes

[Medron Pryde]

Priests can do that too.

Just saying.

Another thing I would say is that this wasn't just four adventurers.  This was an entire realm that has been preparing for something like this month's.  They had nobles and adventurers gathering scrolls, spreading them out, and keeping them from burning off accidently.  And then going off and using them exactly the way we have been told we need to.  Attacking other players.

And they did they same thing months ago in a previous war.

[Bronnen]

Priests would have been fine.

[Anaris]

Priests can do that too.

Priests are a very different story. For one thing, no character starts as a priest.

If we found that several characters had become priests for the express purpose of being able to pop in, use scrolls, and pop out without risk of retaliation, we'd come down on them pretty hard for abuse.

For another, as Bronnen's saying, there's a difference between what a noble should be able to accomplish and what a commoner should be able to accomplish in this world.

[Gordy77]

Likely, yes, because a noble can only move during turns, causes combats on the way and is largely visible.

As one of the adventurers involved, we managed to get in, cast multiple scrolls each, and retreat with a full bank of 16 hours. Honestly, it was a lot of fun, needed heaps of planning and coordination, and was backed with some rare RP elements. As far as I know we were all supporting the actions of our realm and a roleplaying guild. The sorts of things that aught to be promoted.

I kinda resent the implication that we were taking advantage of a bug to get away with something sneaky. We blew threw a substantial number of scrolls- way more than were successfully cast - so it's not like this atomic option is available in every campaign.

I feel like you aught to at least bring back spellcasting in the one most magic realm. Not villify people for saying within the abilities of the game.

[Chenier]

If adventurers are not to be removed from the game (which I would strongly like, but never really expected the dev team to agree to), I would like this alternate compromise:

• Make adventurers require a regular character slot

No more freebies. It was clear from this attack that these advies are the alts of players who all work together, mostly from the same realm, and that they use their adventurers (on BT as well as everywhere else) as extensions of their nobles.

Make people choose between advies or nobles for any given continent.

Furthermore, make it so that characters cannot use ANY scrolls without a certain level in spellcasting. Say, 15%. And make advies start with a lower level than nobles. Force people to train at academies before they can start using them. This would help make advy deaths more meaningful, because right now, you anyone can create an advy, within a few days make him travel to his desired realm, and then just benefit from the 16 real time hour pool to blast enemies away.

[MTYL]

If adventurers are not to be removed from the game (which I would strongly like, but never really expected the dev team to agree to), I would like this alternate compromise:

• Make adventurers require a regular character slot

No more freebies. It was clear from this attack that these advies are the alts of players who all work together, mostly from the same realm, and that they use their adventurers (on BT as well as everywhere else) as extensions of their nobles.to

Make people choose between advies or nobles for any given continent.

Furthermore, make it so that characters cannot use ANY scrolls without a certain level in spellcasting. Say, 15%. And make advies start with a lower level than nobles. Force people to train at academies before they can start using them. This would help make advy deaths more meaningful, because right now, you anyone can create an advy, within a few days make him travel to his desired realm, and then just benefit from the 16 real time hour pool to blast enemies away.

Beat the drums blow the horns, I agree with Chenier. I think it's a beautiful idea!

It is all around problem fixer.

Advies are not played the way they are supposed to be? When they are not free secondary chars they will be.

Advies game is not meaningful? With less of them it will be.

Magic is too commonplace? Less advies = less magic.

Yes I know the major argument against it - less density. But I don't think it is accurate. I propose this - let's introduce it on test islands and see if it affects density.

If it works then this relatively simple fix will fix more problems than I can count. It'll save dev time and improve the player experience and prevent most of abuses at the same time.

[Chenier]

I do have some concerns about the impacts of some players opting out from nobles in order to play their advies, and I'd rather everyone just play nobles instead, but I have a hard time seeing another way to prevent people from continuing to use their advies as extensions of their nobles.

[PolarRaven]

Though I don't have any specific quotes to cite on this, I quite distinctly recall Tom's intention for adventurers being that they could not use scrolls.

Funny that there is at least one type of scroll that is usable by only adventurers.

Fountain of Youth   This scroll is said to make old men feel young again. It will give new energy to its target and remove fatigue.

Unless I am mistaken and there is actually a Noble use for this scroll?

[Anaris]

Funny that there is at least one type of scroll that is usable by only adventurers.

Fountain of Youth   This scroll is said to make old men feel young again. It will give new energy to its target and remove fatigue.

Unless I am mistaken and there is actually a Noble use for this scroll?

It can be read by a noble targeting an adventurer.

[Vita`]

No, adventurers using scrolls is not a bug and never has been.

[PolarRaven]

It can be read by a noble targeting an adventurer.

It has been quite a while since I have tried to cast it, has it changed in recent times?
I don't recall that it offered an option to cast it on someone else the last time I tried.

On a separate note, WHY would any noble take the time to cast a scroll on "a lowly commoner"?
Seems to go against the general feeling of how commoners should be treated.

[PolarRaven]

It can be read by a noble targeting an adventurer.

Roleplay event...

"My oh my.  A sad little common person in my region.
He looks so tired, maybe I should waste a few of my hours to help the poor thing.
**casts - Fountain of Youth**
There you go you poor little bugger, please continue the good things that I suspect you have been doing in my region."

[Chenier]

It has been quite a while since I have tried to cast it, has it changed in recent times?
I don't recall that it offered an option to cast it on someone else the last time I tried.

On a separate note, WHY would any noble take the time to cast a scroll on "a lowly commoner"?
Seems to go against the general feeling of how commoners should be treated.

Think of how commoners should be treated, and then try to reconcile that with nobles giving a handful of them dozens of scrolls to go blast another realm from existence.

How commoners should be treated and played has little to do with how they actually are.