Militia increase in Mt. Black Nastrond

[Darksun]

Conveniently, their capital got moved to Nifelhold prior to the war declaration  , so it's one region away really.

The capital has been in Nifelhold for several months now. Travel times in winter are 12+ hours from Mt. Black to Nifelhold (I have a cavalry unit with vanguard and it takes me as long). Orris is currently in Nifelhold. I don't know what he's doing, but given he hasn't been able to collect a tax yet, nor do I think he holds an estate anyway, he's probably cashing bonds or otherwise getting gold.

Even now that it is spring, it is a 8 hour trip. I haven't seen a court held or a message from Orris in at least three turns. I'm sure that the Devs can check to see what kind of activity he is doing though.

[Arrakis]

Ah, I apologize. I didn't know it has been that long since the capital was moved. As far as I remember Springdale was Libero's birthplace and years long capital, which is why it is weird to see that changed. What were your reasoning for this? Easier management of the realm?

[Brant]

I doubt he has bonds to cash, after paying the militia!     We'll just have to murder death kill before they can reenforce it further

[Darksun]

Sort of off topic but:
Nifelhold was the last capital of Springdale the realm and the original Morek. There's a lot of roleplay associated with it. We were having control problems after the last rebellion and the exodus of half a dozen or so nobles under the old estate system. Once the threat of Saxon invasion was over, we moved the capital (if I recall correctly) to stabilize this problem. This was long enough ago that Hawk was still the King meaning previous to 2011-08-22.

[Anaris]

According to some further information, the Lord of Mt Black Nastrond is in the capital with a bunch of bonds and very little gold, and has not yet logged in today.

[Indirik]

I'm not sure whether its possible to rename militia, but either Orriss has renamed several units of militia,

For the record: It is not possible to rename militia units. They can be reinforced, disbanded, or assigned to a unitless noble by the general. But not renamed.

So, please correct me if I am getting this wrong. They are allowed to add as much militia as they want, regardless of whether the Summerdale militia has been disbanded? If so, then they are technically able to just dump their own 4k right now, and then remove the old militia.

That is correct.

Which means their punishment doesn't really have a meaning, for the great advantage they got by abusing a bug is still here - the militia. Allowing this would only cost them some gold in the long run (the gold needed to re-recruit once they dump their own militia).

It does indeed have a meaning. It forces them to pay gold and hours to disband the militia. It forces them to pay to hire hire new militia, and all the time it takes to hire it, move it, and drop it. And it forces them to use up the recruits from their own centers to do it.

As Anaris said, there was never any intention for the region to remain clear of militia for some unspecified tome period.

[Velax]

I guess the issue is that the Summerdale people assumed the Magistrate decree was for Libero to immediately disband all militia in the region, so it would be militia-free for at least a short while. Instead it seems Libero have chosen to slowly disband it while replacing it with their own, so the region will still be as well defended as it was at the start. I can see how the Summerdale people might be annoyed with that, given Libero shouldn't have had the region at all, and because of Libero exploiting a bug, Summerdale have now lost a region and the cost of all the militia they put into it.

[^ban^]

and because of Libero exploiting a bug

At no point did Libero exploit a bug.

[Velax]

From the Magistrate's verdict:

"The Social Contract explicitly forbids exploiting bug or loopholes. In this case it has been determined that the player of the Morton Family did exploit a bug by changing the allegiance of Mt. Black Nastrond after becoming the lord as a result of an obvious bug."

[Anaris]

Instead it seems Libero have chosen to slowly disband it while replacing it with their own, so the region will still be as well defended as it was at the start.

They have not chosen to do so. They are limited by the game mechanics, just as you are. Based on the information available to the devs, we are reasonably confident that they disbanded as many units as they could with the hours and gold the Lord had on hand, at which point he had to return to Nifelhold to cash his bonds.

[Velax]

And others in Libero have chosen to drop more militia in the meantime.

[Vellos]

From the Magistrate's verdict:

"The Social Contract explicitly forbids exploiting bug or loopholes. In this case it has been determined that the player of the Morton Family did exploit a bug by changing the allegiance of Mt. Black Nastrond after becoming the lord as a result of an obvious bug."

Is the player of the Morton Family synonymous with the Libero Empire?

No.

Then the Libero Empire did not exploit a bug.

Now, if LE is intentionally dragging its feet on this and avoiding enforcing the verdict, we'll handle it. But if it's just that they're taking a reasonable or natural interval of time, not much we can do. We certainly can't and shouldn't and won't prohibit them from dropping militia in the region.

We do not correct bugs. We are not in the business of returning things to status quo ante-buggum.

[Velax]

Is the player of the Morton Family synonymous with the Libero Empire?

No.

Then the Libero Empire did not exploit a bug.

Now, if LE is intentionally dragging its feet on this and avoiding enforcing the verdict, we'll handle it. But if it's just that they're taking a reasonable or natural interval of time, not much we can do. We certainly can't and shouldn't and won't prohibit them from dropping militia in the region.

We do not correct bugs. We are not in the business of returning things to status quo ante-buggum.

Did I say you should be correcting bugs? I was simply explaining why Summerdale feels aggrieved and saying I could understand it. It's not rocket science.

[Anaris]

And others in Libero have chosen to drop more militia in the meantime.

Which is perfectly reasonable. They want the region to be defended with militia, so they are using their own units, paid for with their own money, which they will need to replace with, again, their own money, to ensure it will be well-defended even after the required actions have been taken.

It is regrettable that the incident happened in the first place, but from everything the dev team can tell, Libero Empire is doing all in their power to fulfill the conditions of the verdict as fast as they can.

Nothing else is within the Magistrates' purview at this time.

If the situation changes, and it seems as though the Lord is dragging his feet in disbanding the militia, then there may be other steps which can be taken.

[Brant]

Maybe the magistratum should avoid resolutions that are not intended to be immediately implemented?  Or state time restrictions for verdicts that fall under that category?  The verdict certainly left me with the impression that it should have be done immediately;  not after replacement militia has been placed, when the lord manages to cash bonds, or when long enough has gone by that we would have been better off attacking our own militia in the first place.  I guess it falls to a disparity between the expectation from the verdict of the Summerdale players, the Magistratum and the Libero Empire players... too much grey area.