Author Topic: The Marrocidenian war  (Read 547542 times)

Kwanstein

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1605: March 18, 2013, 01:26:36 AM »
We couldn't have  done much of anything to stop Aurvandil no matter what. We field 12,000 CS max. No way we could stop Aurvandil's full force even if we wanted.

We could have reinforced the two most likely landing spots (Larur and Gretchew) inflicting heavy casualties on Aurvandil when they disembarked. It's also possible that we could have prevented their advance Northwards by fortifying Chesland. Remember, transporting siege engines over seas is expensive, so it's unlikely that Aurvandil's army has many of them; even low level fortifications like those in Chesland could make a difference. A combination of those two tactics could also work. Deploy 6,000 CS in both Larur and Gretchew to inflict casualties upon the event of Aurvandil's landfall, then, in that contingency, have them retreat after low casualties and fall back to Chesland with a bunch of militia waiting to support them. Had things gone well, Terran could have mounted a competent defence. At the least it could have caused some attrition to Aurvandil and prevented their strike from being a fatal blow.

As for Asylon engaging Terran's army. That is simply not a good idea for them. They don't need to engage Terran's army in order to hurt Terran. They merely need to loot the Northern lands, causing economic damage and drawing Terran's armies Northwards to allow Aurvandil to land unopposed. As it is, both Asylon and Aurvandil will suffer minimal casualties while Terran will suffer tremendous economic damage and be placed in a horrible strategic position, what with her entire army shadowing Asylon's in a futile chase in the far North, in the winter no less. Basically Terran has been placed in disarray and her enemies are now able to pick her apart at their leisure. It was a very good move on their part and well orchestrated too, as Noblesse said they've pulled off every step of their plan without a hitch.

NoblesseChevaleresque

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1606: March 18, 2013, 01:46:47 AM »
Had Larur or Chesland been defended, we simply would have landed on a beachhead secured by Asylon.

Perth

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1607: March 18, 2013, 01:56:19 AM »
We could have reinforced the two most likely landing spots (Larur and Gretchew) inflicting heavy casualties on Aurvandil when they disembarked. It's also possible that we could have prevented their advance Northwards by fortifying Chesland. Remember, transporting siege engines over seas is expensive, so it's unlikely that Aurvandil's army has many of them; even low level fortifications like those in Chesland could make a difference. A combination of those two tactics could also work. Deploy 6,000 CS in both Larur and Gretchew to inflict casualties upon the event of Aurvandil's landfall, then, in that contingency, have them retreat after low casualties and fall back to Chesland with a bunch of militia waiting to support them. Had things gone well, Terran could have mounted a competent defence. At the least it could have caused some attrition to Aurvandil and prevented their strike from being a fatal blow.

As for Asylon engaging Terran's army. That is simply not a good idea for them. They don't need to engage Terran's army in order to hurt Terran. They merely need to loot the Northern lands, causing economic damage and drawing Terran's armies Northwards to allow Aurvandil to land unopposed. As it is, both Asylon and Aurvandil will suffer minimal casualties while Terran will suffer tremendous economic damage and be placed in a horrible strategic position, what with her entire army shadowing Asylon's in a futile chase in the far North, in the winter no less. Basically Terran has been placed in disarray and her enemies are now able to pick her apart at their leisure. It was a very good move on their part and well orchestrated too, as Noblesse said they've pulled off every step of their plan without a hitch.


Again, it would matter little in the end. No, Aurvandil and Asylon are not strategic masterminds to realize that having 4 times the Nobles count and being on opposite ends of Terran will result in an easy victory. It simply is not a winnable or sustainable war for Terran. Or anyone. Regardless of it we had the greatest General on the face of the planet. You can't win a BM war when your enemy has over 100 nobles between two realms, one in your North and one in your South. BM wars just don't work like that.

Sure, like I said, we could have prepped and engaged Aurvandil and caused some causulties, but it would have only been an inconvenience to Aurvandil. They are far to strong, to numerous, and to well organized for it to ultimately make a difference.

Also, I never said it was smart for Asylon to engage us, I said it was ultimately irrelevant to Terran's fate. The result would be the same: we would be unable to properly engage Aurvandil (even if we wanted to) whether they engaged us or not.

Having Asylon raid Terran, withdraw and deny battle forcing Terran to advance on them was the plan from the start, alongside provoking Terran to attack Aurvandil in our own regions so we could defeat their army (As we hoped they would when we camped in Twainwood for four days waiting for them) force them to slowly refit with heavy casualties and captured nobles just before the turning of winter to give Asylon the maximum possible chance of success in a campaign against Terran. Almost worryingly Terran did everything Mendicant wanted them to do every step of the way since the start of the attack on Barca up until this point.

It's always nice when everything goes as intended.


Just for the record, the offensive into Aurvandil had been in planning for over a month. It may have been what you had hoped we would do, sure. But we had already made the decision to do it before you invaded Barca.

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Indirik

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1608: March 18, 2013, 02:13:27 AM »
Out of curiosity, did Terran even try contacting Farronite or Astrum and ask for help? I, for one, had no idea things were going so bad for Terran. We never heard any details about Asylon's invasion.
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NoblesseChevaleresque

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1609: March 18, 2013, 02:19:04 AM »
Just for the record, the offensive into Aurvandil had been in planning for over a month. It may have been what you had hoped we would do, sure. But we had already made the decision to do it before you invaded Barca.

This was planned before our invasion of the Grand Duchy of Fissoa, which in part was done to get D'Hara to attack Falkirk (Making them our wasp cake) and as an analogue to see how much damage we could do with a third of total forces looting overseas for a week.

All Mendicant and Allomere do is spend hours discussing plans based on everything we think our opponents might do and then deciding on what we think is the best long term course of action to ensure our complete victory under any circumstance. Aurvandil never does anything that isn't intended to have multiple consequences so that if the main reason behind it fails, the secondary or tertiary reasons don't, that we we always advance our war aims regardless of the outcome. The invasion of Barca, for example had about five distinct and separate reasons for doing it, and all them were successful. The invasion of the Grand Duchy had about four, and they were all mostly achieved.

« Last Edit: March 18, 2013, 02:23:46 AM by NoblesseChevaleresque »

Kwanstein

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1610: March 18, 2013, 02:25:22 AM »

Again, it would matter little in the end. No, Aurvandil and Asylon are not strategic masterminds to realize that having 4 times the Nobles count and being on opposite ends of Terran will result in an easy victory. It simply is not a winnable or sustainable war for Terran. Or anyone. Regardless of it we had the greatest General on the face of the planet. You can't win a BM war when your enemy has over 100 nobles between two realms, one in your North and one in your South. BM wars just don't work like that.

Sure, like I said, we could have prepped and engaged Aurvandil and caused some causulties, but it would have only been an inconvenience to Aurvandil. They are far to strong, to numerous, and to well organized for it to ultimately make a difference.

Also, I never said it was smart for Asylon to engage us, I said it was ultimately irrelevant to Terran's fate. The result would be the same: we would be unable to properly engage Aurvandil (even if we wanted to) whether they engaged us or not.

Sure, Terran's loss was inevitable, assuming the war would go on long enough. I am not doubting that. What Asylon's maneuver changed, however, is the totality and abruptness of Terran's defeat. Only a week ago the horrible position that Terran is in now was unthinkable. A week ago, Terran's rurals were intact and it's cities were defensible. Now, it's rurals are in ruins and it's cities are at the complete mercy of Aurvandil. This cataclysmic turn of events was well orchestrated and is responsible for forcing Terran to sue for peace. Before, peace was a luxury that most people were willing to support. Now, it's an absolute necessity, as even the capital is poised to fall. Before, Terran was in steady decline. Heck, perhaps it was even treading water; there was some optimism of defeating Falkirk and, eventually, Aurvandil. Now, Terran is in complete free-fall and nothing can be done to save it from defeat.

Scarlett

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1611: March 18, 2013, 02:50:22 AM »
Terran has been a circus for months. There is a reason nobody runs for Chief Magistrate.

Quintus hasn't rebelled because he would feel kinda sorta bad screwing over Hireshmont and Kale, but it's just as much that I don't have time to take a bigger role in Terran (assuming Quintus would even win, which is doubful given that Terran consists of a half-dozen blocs of four nobles each).

At any rate, long past due for somebody to steamroll their way in there.

Perth

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1612: March 18, 2013, 03:33:17 AM »
Terran has been a circus for months. There is a reason nobody runs for Chief Magistrate.

Quintus hasn't rebelled because he would feel kinda sorta bad screwing over Hireshmont and Kale, but it's just as much that I don't have time to take a bigger role in Terran (assuming Quintus would even win, which is doubful given that Terran consists of a half-dozen blocs of four nobles each).

At any rate, long past due for somebody to steamroll their way in there.

Agreed.
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Penchant

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1613: March 18, 2013, 03:48:17 AM »
Agreed.
Me thinks Terran should spread the word they need a real ruler. Marco would be interested. (Can't do worse than those before him.)
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Gustav Kuriga

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1614: March 18, 2013, 04:09:32 AM »
If I thought Falkirk was in any danger, I'd have sent everything Aurvandil has to defend them. Besides which, Aurvandil still has armies nearby if they're needed, we're not so clumsy as to throw everything against Terran, especially when we don't need to.

I'll believe all the nonsense about Falkirk falling when I see it. But Lex and his Averothoi don't fall easily and not to the level of foe presented to them currently.

Who said I was talking about Falkirk?

Perth

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1615: March 18, 2013, 04:12:47 AM »
Me thinks Terran should spread the word they need a real ruler. Marco would be interested. (Can't do worse than those before him.)

The problem, as Scarlett's character in Terran has alluded to many times, is that the position is pretty redundant and powerless. I suppose unless someone with a very big personality got in there. Even then, it would be frustrating for them.

The realm is run by the Senate, and specifically those Senators who care to contribute, which means the Chief Magistrate's job is primarily foreign relations/diplomacy.... however, that is mostly de facto dominated by Hireshmont and the Elder representation in the 'Moot.

It's a thankless position with little point and not much fun. Plus you lose your landed title.
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Kwanstein

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1616: March 18, 2013, 04:57:28 AM »
Also, random people start flaming each other for no reason. Kas accidently travelled to Overroot and everyone started insulting him and accusing him of things, then they banned him. Shino kept on getting shouted down every time he said some minor thing. Erasmus was insulted and banned because he was executing peasants or something. Everyone who does anything is basically painting a target on themselves in that realm.

Then there's the lethargic army, where only five people follow orders willingly. The rest have to be threatened with fines. There are random starvations, too. I get that Terran is volatile in the food department, but in the past regions (Mistight, Chesland) have been completely depopulated through starvation. And for some reason there's always monsters attacking Odona :(

Yeah Terran's been doomed for a long time. If it weren't for it's alliances it would probably have fallen sooner.

Vellos

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1617: March 18, 2013, 04:59:48 AM »
And now Mendicant quotes my forum posts at Hireshmont in letters explaining why he doesn't believe Hireshmont is serious about the surrender...

Whoop-dee-doo.
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Penchant

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1618: March 18, 2013, 05:04:26 AM »
The problem, as Scarlett's character in Terran has alluded to many times, is that the position is pretty redundant and powerless. I suppose unless someone with a very big personality got in there. Even then, it would be frustrating for them.

The realm is run by the Senate, and specifically those Senators who care to contribute, which means the Chief Magistrate's job is primarily foreign relations/diplomacy.... however, that is mostly de facto dominated by Hireshmont and the Elder representation in the 'Moot.

It's a thankless position with little point and not much fun. Plus you lose your landed title.
I'd be making more gold as ruler of Terran. I am used to the rather thankless positions. Foreign relations/diplomacy, I see many failures in Hireshmont's foreign relation activities, thus he can keep doing his thing, and I would do everything I think he should be doing, but isn't. Obviously we can't be talking to the same person about the same thing, though same person with topics different enough they warrant separate people doing the talking, could be fine sometimes. I love the diplomacy aspect, but I have been playing Marco in such a way, that Ambassador he will never aspire to be, but ruler, even if it is primarily powerless except for diplomacy, he could aspire to be.
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Vellos

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Re: The Marrocidenian war
« Reply #1619: March 18, 2013, 05:06:02 AM »
I think Terran has some good candidates in our current election. One real dud, one steady hand, and one unknown: here's hoping for the steady hand!

Vote Maloudi!
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