Author Topic: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days  (Read 10316 times)

Lavigna

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #15: February 05, 2013, 08:27:40 PM »
Well with all the honesty i can't say they didn't answer to anyone for 194 days. But both their marshal and Generals reported that they never answered to any of the messages they were sent and the same goes for the orders they were sent.

I guess that if this is not true and the part who reported me can prove i am wrong and he contributed in a any way to the realm or even contacted the Council in any way then i am guilty as charged and i should get punished with the worst of the penalties as i would vote for others as well.

I am not trying to avoid punishment, if i deserve it i should get it.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2013, 08:57:32 PM by Misericordia »
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vonGenf

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #16: February 05, 2013, 08:27:47 PM »
Did you consider simply cutting their revenue source?
After all it's a roleplaying game.

Atanamir

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #17: February 05, 2013, 08:29:22 PM »
Ok again:

They were in the realm. The sat for X time in one City. Nothing else.

They cashed in gold every week. Over this time, the were many orders, by generals, marshals, lieges to do things, like recruit or move etc. - in red tag or even personal messages.

These charcaters never did *anything* to follow the realm hierarchy or say it this way, the players never did anything to play with us.

They gained no single honour pt, nothing. Just read our messages and chose to ignore them.

Therefore they clearely violated the laws, over a much longer time than the autopause period.

Lavigna

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #18: February 05, 2013, 08:32:17 PM »
Did you consider simply cutting their revenue source?

Now there is something i can't answer :/ to that you are absolutely right >.< i can't deny i sometimes think the old ways without considering the new possibilities. It was my fault i didn't ask their respective Lords to deal with it instead of taking action right away.
Suck my socks! I kill for Darka! -KK-

vonGenf

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #19: February 05, 2013, 08:33:25 PM »
These charcaters never did *anything* to follow the realm hierarchy or say it this way, the players never did anything to play with us.

So why were they troubling you?
After all it's a roleplaying game.

Anaris

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #20: February 05, 2013, 08:34:46 PM »
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

vonGenf

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #21: February 05, 2013, 08:41:07 PM »
what good reason is there not to ban them?

Because you should play as you would play a board game with friends. When I play cards and someone cannot follow the game because they're busy with their kids, then I just play without them. I don't kick them out of the room and shut the door.
After all it's a roleplaying game.

Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #22: February 05, 2013, 08:41:49 PM »
Because you should play as you would play a board game with friends. When I play cards and someone cannot follow the game because they're busy with their kids, then I just play without them. I don't kick them out of the room and shut the door.

This is not how a realm works.

Anaris

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #23: February 05, 2013, 08:44:51 PM »
Because you should play as you would play a board game with friends. When I play cards and someone cannot follow the game because they're busy with their kids, then I just play without them. I don't kick them out of the room and shut the door.

If you're playing a game with friends, and one of them insists on being there, but never says a word, never takes his turn, and just sits there, staring at everyone blankly...are you really saying you'd be just fine with him staying there?

This isn't people who are busy with their kids. That would be someone who autopauses after 2 weeks. This is someone who refuses to give up the IC benefits of being in Perdan, but also refuses to take on any of the IC responsibility.

And, again: you have no way to know how often they're actually logging in. They could be logging in once every 2 weeks to avoid autopause. Or they could be logging in 4 times a turn, checking various strategic bits of info, and feeding it to the realm's enemies.

Or they could be logging in 4 times a turn sending loads of private messages back and forth to their co-conspirators, planning a rebellion. They are, after all, hoarding gold in the capital while everyone else goes off to war.

The point is, they're not following orders, and that's why they were banned.
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

vonGenf

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #24: February 05, 2013, 08:47:28 PM »
This is not how a realm works.

I'm not really a Duke. I just play one on the internet.
After all it's a roleplaying game.

Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #25: February 05, 2013, 08:49:09 PM »
I'm not really a Duke. I just play one on the internet.

Anaris explained it much better than me.

vonGenf

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #26: February 05, 2013, 08:53:54 PM »
Or they could be logging in 4 times a turn sending loads of private messages back and forth to their co-conspirators, planning a rebellion. They are, after all, hoarding gold in the capital while everyone else goes off to war.

Indeed they could. If they were doing that, though, they would be much better off actually following orders.

If that was the suspicion, then it would be easy to prove. There would be a letter from the king to the judge saying "Ban those people because I suspect they are organising a rebellion."

But that's not what was said. They were banned for failing to answer letters.

I don't oppose banning in general. I don't even oppose banning for spurious reasons. I oppose witch-hunts to get rid of inactive characters.
After all it's a roleplaying game.

Geronus

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #27: February 05, 2013, 08:59:20 PM »
There are acceptable ways to deal with situations like this. I'm trying to ascertain whether this was one of them. Anaris has valid points, but so does Von Genf. I'd also love to see some evidence. Like copies of the private messages Atanamir mentioned. Or did that happen too long ago?

You can ban people for not following orders, but a reasonable effort should be made to be certain that it's not for activity-related reasons. I would expect that to include actions like issuing warnings before issuing punishments and demonstrating a clear and logical escalation while affording the targeted character every opportunity to respond. If you give someone an ultimatum and they don't reply for a week, or they don't reply but are obviously otherwise active (traveling, recruiting, etc.), then punish away. The point is, ask questions first, punish later. Players should be afforded the benefit of the doubt when it comes to anything remotely related to their activity level.

I don't oppose banning in general. I don't even oppose banning for spurious reasons. I oppose witch-hunts to get rid of inactive characters.

Ditto this.

Anaris

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #28: February 05, 2013, 09:08:56 PM »
Timothy Collett

"The only thing you can't trade for your heart's desire...is your heart." "You are what you do.  Choose again, and change." "One of these days, someone's gonna plug you, and you're going to die saying, 'What did I say? What did I say?'"  ~ Miles Naismith Vorkosigan

vonGenf

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Re: Banned for being inactive for 5 Days
« Reply #29: February 05, 2013, 09:13:38 PM »
I really don't know what more you want people to do before banning characters like this.

I really don't know why people would want to ban characters like this. Maybe there was a time when, due to the tax system, they took money from other people, but that time is long gone. The game is pretty well designed so that they don't matter at all and can be safely ignored.
After all it's a roleplaying game.