Sanguis Astroism

[dustole]

[quote author=Chénier link=topic=1421.msg127406#msg127406 date=1397255709

A Kabrinski who is now threatening to act as a dictator and is planning to metamorph the Church into something it was never close to being. No offense, dustole.
[/quote]


None taken.  I know I've made enemies. I'm not sure id I trust anyone else to protect SA.  I'm not sure if it can be saved.  Time will tell.

[Stabbity]

And then you went on to give a top rank to Alaster, probably the second-most-hated member of SA.

How generous of Jonsu. Now we don't just have to deal with true faithful and with those who are only there to destroy it, but we can also split the true faithful among those who would never accept a Kabrinski's authority and those who would only do so reluctantly.

A Kabrinski who is now threatening to act as a dictator and is planning to metamorph the Church into something it was never close to being. No offense, dustole.

And you accuse me of not being "active" enough. That Machiavel didn't do enough sermons. Every time Machiavel spoke in the Church, when you were there (and often when you weren't even there anymore), you went about to badmouth Machiavel and discredit him. And now you should be surprised that Machiavel contends himself with private interactions? If it hadn't been for Jonsu and her clique badmouthing him every time he uttered a word, regardless of what it was, maybe he'd be more willing to discuss things publicly.

You play destructive characters, Justin. That's what you find fun. That's what gives you thrills. And you are ready to go to any lengths to win. You don't consider other people's fun. When you make concessions, it's for self-gratification, and your concessions are as destructive as the actions they are supposed to undo.

The damage Enoch and Jonsu did to SA is irreparable. You guys won. Congrats.

I didn't elect to keep him around. Talk to Helm about that. He made a case to aid in mediation. You're damn lucky I'm a nice enough guy to have allowed it. Your judgement of my entire play style off of one interaction, which didn't get to come to any sort of fruition (Jonsu never actually got to govern SA thanks to hissy fits like the ones you throw.) insofar as actual governance.

Now, you should already be PAINFULLY aware there is little that goes on on Dwilight that I don't know about, especially when it comes to you. Your backroom actions maybe created fun for you and a couple others. That's hardly stepping up and making Sanguis Astroism fun, and frankly your ideas were doomed to flop. You want fun in a religion? Get to know the religion.

What is Machaviel's stance on balance? What is his stance on communing with the stars? What is his stance on the Prophet's Vision concerning Daimons? Does he have feelings towards the religion or is he just a political convertee like most everyone believes? Furthermore do you realize that for every noble that hates either Jonsu or Alaster, there is one or more who agrees with them? Why do you think Alaster just hasn't been banned and executed, he hangs around in realms that if Sanguis Astroism truly hated him, it wouldn't be a problem.

Frankly, if SA dies any time soon, the fault lies with the current leadership. Never before have I seen so many full members so active. I've given about a dozen private sermons of late. All I've seen and heard from Machaviel is whining, and asking for people to do things. Things he could be facilitating himself. Alaster is only a dictator if you let him be. Justiciars are not immune to excommunication, and I personally do not believe dustole is a big enough dick to hang onto the rank if the Elder council votes in favor of excommunicating him. Hell, the one guy in the Elder Council trying to do ANYTHING is facing a vote of no confidence for as far as I can tell, purely political reasons, and you wonder why the faith is dying.

The days to come can either be a revival for Sanguis Astroism, or its death. That lies purely in the hands of its leadership. If you cannot hack it, and you truly believe that Sanguis Astroism is lost, then stop whining, step down, and let someone else who will actually do something step up. That is the only way Sanguis Astroism will come around. I don't even know why I'm saying all of this, as it conflicts directly with my IC ambitions. IC, I want SA to die, and making it happen has been too damn easy.

[dustole]

Rurik won't be removed from the Elders.  I made that proposal to make a point.   In 2 days time the Regent is required to call a vote.  We don't have one.  Nor do we even have a quorum.

At that point im not sure what will happen.  It's been what 2 months since Jonsu stepped down from the elders?

[Stabbity]

Rurik won't be removed from the Elders.  I made that proposal to make a point.   In 2 days time the Regent is required to call a vote.  We don't have one.  Nor do we even have a quorum.

At that point im not sure what will happen.  It's been what 2 months since Jonsu stepped down from the elders?

Two months, and there is one Consul, Three Lights, No Regent, Two Justiciars, One actual luminary, one mystery Luminary.

Jonsu for Regent.

[Thehatter]

Moto...

[Thehatter]

Let's not forget the nice i/ooc threats that just happened in the church. I feel it is doomed.

[dustole]

Let's not forget the nice i/ooc threats that just happened in the church. I feel it is doomed.

what IC/OOC threats?   Did I miss something?

[Glaumring the Fox]

Am I the only one who doesn't find Jonsu an !@#$%^& and in any way annoying? Seriously since Jonsu has been in Asylon there hasn't been anything that I'v found that bad about the character. On the other hand I find Chenier very annoying and I've never even really spoken to him in game at all.

[Zakilevo]

Everyone finds Cheniers annoying.

As for Himouras, as long as you entertain them, you won't see any problems with them but the moment you fail to do so they will find their own entertainments.

[Anaris]

Time to tone down the personal attacks.

I'd really hate to have to lock this thread, after over 250 pages.

[Glaumring the Fox]

Good thing Asylon is a realm that promotes underhanded skullduggery and chaos... gee golly whiz we even have a piece of our charter that allows for insurrection and coups if the king is doing a bad job.

[OFaolain]

Aaaaaaaaaaanyway, how 'bout them Consul elections?  A fierce race between three great competitors, who knows what the outcome will be!  (cut to shot of snoozefest, no campaigning, no promises, no debates) Find out next time, on Sanguis Astroism Z!

[Meneldur]

This whole conversation is a tad ridiculous. The notion that Jonsu and only Jonsu talks about SA theologically is just silly; Constantine for example had a number of private sermons and religious discussions concerning balance and prophecy during the power-struggle (though since then I've had little time to play which is why I'm resigning him) and in fact I distinctly remember a public discussion involving Jonsu, Constantine and others regarding the exact nature of balance and embracing one Star over the others.

Furthermore the notion that SA needs more sermons to flourish has been counter to my experience playing there for a number of years. Apart from the discussions on the authority of the Prophet and balance during Allison's heyday theology rarely sparked significant controversy, and when it did it was often just a few players who would dominate. And even then such discussions were rarely based on huge block-text sermons but rather more dynamic discussion.
Of course I'm not saying that we shouldn't have as much theology/religious rp as possible, I'm just saying that attributing SA's decline to "not enough sermons" seems to run counter to my experience of the times when SA was flourishing.

Also can someone please tell me exactly when SA became this "kick-everyone out" machine that Stabbity and dustole are complaining about here? Admittedly I did take a break but both before my pause and since Helm took over casting someone out of SA has been the usual nigh-impossible lengthy process. Did something happen while I was away that changed this? And since SA's decline has really been brewing since long before I paused can it really be said to be the main cause of the problems?

[dustole]

Yes, don't get this thread locked!   

IC I've never trusted Jonsu or Machiavel.  I still interact with them because their characters are fun in different ways. 

Hopefully someone else can fill the trouble maker role in the church.  We need a little excitement.



Not many have been kicked out, but there have been enough to cause a perception problem. 

Instead of sects like the blood moon fruit being forced out they should be embraced.  I think that is what will be the key to an SA resurgence.  If nobles know they won't be kicked out for having slightly different beliefs they might get more active.

when I speak about sects within SA they would have to fit into the criteria laid out by the creed.

[Dishman]

...HELM WAS PUT IN CHARGE CHENIER. THE RESULTING SYSTEM IS HIS. Alaster remaining a Justiciar- HELM'S CALL....

There was never a more supported person, beyond the prophet himself. Helm claimed half the membership, and even that is astonishing given the apathy prior. SA needed a kick in the ass, and Jonsu was perfect. People actually drew lines, gave a realistic reaction, and cared about the institution.

If Enoch had stepped down, someone in a funny hat would say "change places", and everyone would go back to ignoring the gold-sink. Even if Enoch had declared himself tyrant, I couldn't hope to get the same kind of reaction. Hell, there is a chance no one would bat an eyelash and everything would keep shuffling on. Without a clear enemy, no one ever really seemed to care and had their own things to do. A clear enemy and a implied threat later, half the membership was interested in a Regency that was ignored.