improving the game via prison

[vonGenf]

An IC ban doesn't stop you from playing the game. I think that's the point, that going to prison locks you out from the game. It shouldn't work as a 'sorry, you cannot play the game with this character for a week/month'. It's not like prison can be entirely avoided except by sitting back in your city and doing nothing (And I don't think we want to encourage that either).

As Tom mentioned, you can talk to their judge, and also to your judge, and you can bribe the guards. You're not entirely locked out of the game. I would be glad to see more options, more things to do while in prison, but in the end it's an IC event that is triggered in-game. It should be seen as a normal part of game experience, not as a punishment.

[Anaris]

Being wounded also prevents you from playing—much more so than prison does, in fact. Do you consider wounding to be akin to a forum ban? Do you think we should remove it from the game?

Prison is a part of the game. It has been since the beginning of the game. There is nothing about prison that has changed to make more people leave the game. There have always been a few people who think that being in prison for a week is the worst thing EVAR, and there always will be, but that doesn't mean it's actually a detriment to the game as a whole.

Furthermore, this change—making sure that new players can't be put in prison for longer than a few days—should significantly help in making sure that new players aren't kept from the game, and thus increase their enjoyment.

[Telrunya]

But then the judge steals your gold, how long can you bribe the guards for? If it fails, or you don't have the money, you're locked out. That has nothing to do with an IC ban, which still allows you to play, just not in the realm of your choice. It's already stated that 'Prison is no fun', so then making people be stuck in prison for a month instead of a week doesn't seem to be a very logical follow-up on that. Especially when it's a rogue prison. So we need to make prison less of a 'locks you out of doing anything' and more like 'part of the game experience'. Perhaps take out the bribing part and allow everyone to always send and receive messages would be a dirty quick-fix to this. It wouldn't be such a lock out of the game then. It still inconveniences you, it still makes the enemy judge have some power over you and prevents you from doing some things, but it doesn't prevent you from playing.

EDIT: Wounding in that sense does the same. But at least it allows younger characters to heal up quicker, and tends to not last very long unless you're a 80-year old dude. These changes to prison can keep people out of the game for a month potentially.

[Buffalkill]

In modern prisons, prisoners spend their time exercising and getting degrees (at least according to films). Maybe imprisonment wouldn't be such a drag if there was an opportunity for prisoners to increase their skills at a faster rate than they normally could. So every hour they spend studying or training in prison is like 2 or 3 hours on the outside. By the time they get out they could have mad swordfighting skills, and it's less boring for the player.

[Dishman]

I like the idea. People with less holdings aren't held in prison for very long. It makes sense and would be a good gameplay addition.

As far as the long prison times originally suggested, I'd rather Duke/Council members have a sure shot of losing their position unless they pay the ransom, Lords could get a random chance of being released in time or losing position. The ransom should also be higher for higher positions. You want to enable people to join the fight if they want to without risking weeks of downtime, but still risking their prestigious positions and/or chests of gold.

In modern prisons, prisoners spend their time exercising and getting degrees (at least according to films). Maybe imprisonment wouldn't be such a drag if there was an opportunity for prisoners to increase their skills at a faster rate than they normally could. So every hour they spend studying or training in prison is like 2 or 3 hours on the outside. By the time they get out they could have mad swordfighting skills, and it's less boring for the player.

Might not be a bad idea. Maybe some of the softer skills would be good. Oratory and Trade (sweet talking guards, trading a few gold for smokes/wine).

[Foxglove]

On the whole, I like the idea (particularly getting newbies out of prison quickly). Although I have a couple of thoughts:

The longer prison times could be awfully hard on priest characters since they can be arrested pretty much at will if you're that way inclined. They could spend more time in prison than out of it.

It's becoming harder and harder to find players who are interested in taking on military positions (maybe one or two players for some realms). Keeping those key players in prision for 15 to 30 days would effectively end some wars or destroy some small-to-medium sized realms. I don't think there's any power on earth that would persuade some judges to release key characters if keeping them in prison for the full stretch helped them win a war.

Maybe it would also encourage people to pile resources into family gold to have the option for the family to pay the ransom.

[Stabbity]

Perhaps if we added a system where judges could pay the ransom for nobles of their realm, it would be less devastating. Judge asks for gold from wealthy Dukes, and if the ruler is well liked, it gets coughed up and the ruler is released.... But if said Dukes are ambitious and plotting to take the throne... Sure, let him rot.

And yes, a huge cut on that time needs to be made for priests or the class will quickly become unplayable.

[Buffalkill]

Perhaps if we added a system where judges could pay the ransom for nobles of their realm, it would be less devastating. Judge asks for gold from wealthy Dukes, and if the ruler is well liked, it gets coughed up and the ruler is released.... But if said Dukes are ambitious and plotting to take the throne... Sure, let him rot.

And yes, a huge cut on that time needs to be made for priests or the class will quickly become unplayable.

Yes! And if they don't like the ruler, they can pay the judge to keep him in prison longer while they make a play for the rulership.

[Dishman]

And yes, a huge cut on that time needs to be made for priests or the class will quickly become unplayable.

Actually, mixed with the idea of skill gains in prison (the idea of gaining oratory in particular) and maybe throw in some conversion abilities from within the prison (guards, prisoners, etc)....it might actually make arresting priests more interesting for both parties.

Imagine planting a seed of an opposing religion within the capital of your enemy's realm.

[Buffalkill]

Actually, mixed with the idea of skill gains in prison (the idea of gaining oratory in particular) and maybe throw in some conversion abilities from within the prison (guards, prisoners, etc)....it might actually make arresting priests more interesting for both parties.

Imagine planting a seed of an opposing religion within the capital of your enemy's realm.

I like that. I like it a lot.

[egamma]

What happens if a steward gets captured, and the next day the lord makes someone else steward? Will his sentence be reduced?

[Tom]

Perhaps if we added a system where judges could pay the ransom for nobles of their realm,

Yes, I just had the same idea. This would solve the griefer issue, because you can't decide to keep the enemy in prison just for fun. If the ransom is paid, he's free.

We'd need to modify our ransom calculations some, but as I said, this whole thing would be fairly easy to code.

[Tom]

Imagine planting a seed of an opposing religion within the capital of your enemy's realm.

Absolutely no free academy in prison. Infiltrators would line up to be imprisoned by their own judge so they can train for free.

And please don't do the usual that is done with every freaking idea on this board: Add six millions other crap to it, until the whole thing is so heavy that it sinks. If you want to make prison more interesting, that's a totally different topic, go and open a seperate thread or think it through and make a feature request.

[Buffalkill]

What happens if a steward gets captured, and the next day the lord makes someone else steward? Will his sentence be reduced?

I would think not. If it's going to be based on status or titles, it should be from the time of their capture.

[Tom]

What happens if a steward gets captured, and the next day the lord makes someone else steward? Will his sentence be reduced?

the same issue exists for all other positions. Answer: TBD.