Sanity Check for Peasant Mobs

[Jaden]

So looting will still drive population down at the same rate?
But instead of frequent small groups of militia, we will have less frequent and bigger groups?

[Zakilevo]

If 30 peasants show up, they'll probably still stop 700 men from looting. But only 30 men *shouldn't* spawn as a militia anymore. If they do, it should be considered a bug. For 700 men, there should be no less than 350 peasants spawning as militia. Basically, you shouldn't see peasant militia arise with a number less than half of the occupying force's numbers. Militia were also given a slight increase in strength so they shouldn't be cannon fodder anymore, but are still weaker peasants still.

Does this mean enemies can now loot for longer until they see peasants gather or does that have nothing to do with it?

It sounds like occupying forces can now slaughter peasants pretty quickly since they will spawn in larger quantities.

[Indirik]

It sounds like the idea is that you won't get the nuisance mobs of irrelevant quantities of peasants that spawn, block everything, and are a nuisance for everyone. So you will be able to loot for longer, until the resentment builds up enough that a very large group spawns. Not only will the groups be larger, but their stats got buffed so they will actually be able to do some damage.  No more suicide charges of 700 peasants killing 1 soldier and wounding 2 more, while 600 of them get slaughtered.

[Vita`]

Indeed. We don't want overpowered peasant militia, but we don't want pointless peasants either. Please do keep us informed on how you notice peasant militia fights going and if you think they're better balanced or should be further adjusted. There is some randomness involved as well, so don't judge everything by 2-3 battles.

[Zakilevo]

Why don't we post maybe 30 battles or so involving this new militia unit somewhere to see what changed? We can discuss it more thoroughly by doing so I think.

[pcw27]

Have these changes been implemented? Because a little while ago Niselur's army ended up facing 2 or 3k cs of peasant militia. If this is the norm it will make the scorched Earth warfare we've seen so often in Battlemaster a lot harder to execute which has its advantages but also some drawbacks.

[Jaden]

Yes it's implemented, scorched earth is still very effective, but with substantial risk attached now

[vonGenf]

Have these changes been implemented? Because a little while ago Niselur's army ended up facing 2 or 3k cs of peasant militia. If this is the norm it will make the scorched Earth warfare we've seen so often in Battlemaster a lot harder to execute which has its advantages but also some drawbacks.

How many peasants was that? If you get to kill them purposefully, it's still scorched earth.

[Vita`]

Have these changes been implemented? Because a little while ago Niselur's army ended up facing 2 or 3k cs of peasant militia. If this is the norm it will make the scorched Earth warfare we've seen so often in Battlemaster a lot harder to execute which has its advantages but also some drawbacks.

For what its worth, this has been live for a couple weeks now.

[Zakilevo]

How many peasants was that? If you get to kill them purposefully, it's still scorched earth.

About 1000 peasants I believe. They had 2.5k CS.

When there were only 1k CS left, they were hitting for less than 100 still. So they are still somewhat useless lol

[Indirik]

In a recent battle in Itaufield, there was a 522 peasant mob, rated at 1164 CS. They faced off against about 800 Astrum soldiers.

The mob hit for 248 damage, taking down 10 Astrum soldiers. 401 of the mob were killed by 8600 damage.

So they are better than they were, but still not a huge threat to a large military force. Which is what they are supposed to be. You will take damage against them, and they will wear you down. If a defending army were to come in and attempt to drive out the invaders in combination with the peasant mod, then they could potentially swing the balance of the battle.

We may find that they still need a *little* bit more punch, though. The low CS/man for the mobs, combined with the spreading out of hits with the new combat system tends to really dilute their hitting power.

[Dishman]

We may find that they still need a *little* bit more punch, though. The low CS/man for the mobs, combined with the spreading out of hits with the new combat system tends to really dilute their hitting power.

Not sure how drastic this would be, but why not give them a volley or two? Making them range 1 or 2 mixed infantry would give them a small boost to their attack (a turn or two before being slaughtered) while keeping them largely fodder.

Slings, hunting bows, even atlatls could be easily possessed by peasants.

[Vita`]

Or the classic pick up the nearest rock and throw it. These *are* peasants, not lightly trained soldiers.

[Penchant]

Its still feels like it fails the sanity check to me. Strength-wise is fine but what group of peasants is going to fight against a group of professional soldiers nearly the same size? It requires a bit of a larger army for scorched earth policy but otherwise the best way to take out a region for an entire war is a couple days of looting, regardless of the type, so you can kill enough of the peasants it goes rogue, starve, then such a low pop it can't recover for months or loot (little bit longer method) until you kill however many you want once again making it months to recover. Scorched Earth is a great way to take out a region for the entirety of a war because its powerful (which makes sense), is the easiest option available (doesn't really make sense unless its a long time of looting), and the fastest (doesn't make sense, it should be faster to convince people through at least brutality to follow you than it is to kill thousands upon thousands). An option that should seem like a better idea when doing this with border regions is to take it over and give it away to a third party outside the war so it can't be took back, but currently scorched earth is the best possible in all circumstances except for the exceptionally rare Darka-CE war although the move wasn't done to deny the enemy holding over the region since it had already been trashed I believe but to prevent passage which only works in really rare circumstances like this.

[De-Legro]

Or the classic pick up the nearest rock and throw it. These *are* peasants, not lightly trained soldiers.

Slings were a commonly used hunting tool by peasants, that is why they became a military weapon to start with, since most men (in the relevant cultures) had some experience with their use. I couldn't really say about javelins/bows. There is no technical reason peasants couldn't make them and use them for hunting, but I have no idea if they did during the period or not.