The Current War

[Geronus]

Tara began officially sanctioning looting in Hammarsett a while back, when Hammarsett had multiple nobles at once loot in Taran regions.

That might have happened recently when our Marshal made a mistake, but the orders were quickly corrected, which Ottar would know if he'd asked. Kurohyou probably should have reached out to him proactively and apologized, but either way the gloves seem to be off now.

[Dante Silverfire]

That might have happened recently when our Marshal made a mistake, but the orders were quickly corrected, which Ottar would know if he'd asked. Kurohyou probably should have reached out to him proactively and apologized, but either way the gloves seem to be off now.

I was just stating the facts of the situation as seen by my IC character which has all allied military information from the CE alliance available to him.

[jaune]

Ah, intresting... Is it reallly so that Tarans have gone killing spree aswell? :D

If so, Ottar can suck my sweaty socks with his double standard noble rules, which we knew were utter BS from the beginning.

Tara cheered Darkans when we burned RS & Abington, but when they thought they dont need Darka's services anymore and we were hired to fight them... oh boy that cry and whine what we recieved after few lootings... "How barbaric! Unhonorable! Tara would never do anything like that!"

But since i dont have any actual reports of Tarans growing balls and fight like a man instead of crap talk... i stop it here :)

[Zadar]

Situation is this mr King of wet socks.
Yes Darka was one of our friends long time ago but when they did entered on our realm and started to weaken our Realm by raping I was a bit upset and of course wet socks did start to rape without declaring war just like cowards, but hey that is your style not ours. I have given orders that we will not rape and make our enemies stronger, if that happens we will punish those.

[Bael]

That might have happened recently when our Marshal made a mistake, but the orders were quickly corrected, which Ottar would know if he'd asked. Kurohyou probably should have reached out to him proactively and apologized, but either way the gloves seem to be off now.

While I can only speak from the opinion that my character (and me, to a certain extent) has formed, people don't actually like Hammarsett. They (Hammarsett) don't seem to study history, or even take note of current events: Hammarsett was formed by burning other realms to the ground to make place for them.

So what do they do? Take the first opportunity to attack the realms that cleared the land for them. Not only is that ungrateful, but quite colossally stupid. The land got burned to the ground before - and will now undoubtedly be again.

/endrant.

[Indirik]

Hammarsett was formed by burning other realms to the ground to make place for them.

Yeah, that's a good reason to hate them. I mean, come on, no one with any class *ever* does that. How rude of them to form a realm on land conquered from someone else... ::)

[GoldPanda]

Yeah, that's a good reason to hate them. I mean, come on, no one with any class *ever* does that. How rude of them to form a realm on land conquered from someone else... ::)

You need to finish reading the post before reaching for the snarky comments, man. Try again.  ::)

[Indirik]

I did. I just disagree with the premise of the post. "No one likes Hammarsett". That's not true at all. CE and their client states may not like them. But I think htey have the respect of most of the northerners. (So long as they avoid appointing tactless idiots as generals.)

[Foundation]

I did. I just disagree with the premise of the post. "No one likes Hammarsett". That's not true at all. CE and their client states may not like them. But I think htey have the respect of most of the northerners. (So long as they avoid appointing tactless idiots as generals.)

One is all and all is one.  I am you and you aren't me.

[Dante Silverfire]

I did. I just disagree with the premise of the post. "No one likes Hammarsett". That's not true at all. CE and their client states may not like them. But I think htey have the respect of most of the northerners. (So long as they avoid appointing tactless idiots as generals.)

I know of plenty of people in the north who don't like Hammarsett. They just won't say so publicly because of the ongoing war. Sometimes you're stuck with allies you don't like.

[Indirik]

Yeah, you always find people that don't like their allies. But most often you're kinda stuck with them.

[Geronus]

While I can only speak from the opinion that my character (and me, to a certain extent) has formed, people don't actually like Hammarsett. They (Hammarsett) don't seem to study history, or even take note of current events: Hammarsett was formed by burning other realms to the ground to make place for them.

So what do they do? Take the first opportunity to attack the realms that cleared the land for them. Not only is that ungrateful, but quite colossally stupid. The land got burned to the ground before - and will now undoubtedly be again.

/endrant.

Maybe. On the other hand, if you were as familiar with the history of Hammarsett as you are seemingly claiming to be, you'd probably understand why we've sided against both the Cagilans and the Corians.

To go off on a tangent, the second ruler or Hammarsett was my character, and I can tell you now that he never cared much for Atamaran politics or politicians. Undoubtedly he's done some stupid things politically that have haunted and will continue to haunt Hammarsett (and for good reason), but it was all done out of the IC conviction that most of his peers were contemptible in one way or another. He always looked down on the rest of the rulers of Atamara for having no convictions. Kostaja of Darka? Craven for being unwilling to even consider putting his realm at risk of counterattack by attacking Talerium even though it could have been to the immense benefit of his allies and probably the larger cause. Kerwin of Eston? Selfish fool for prioritizing what was good for himself and his one-time enemy of Coria over what was good for the realms that actually stuck their necks out to support him. Ottar of Tara? Soulless marionette of the Cagilan Empire with a god complex (dance puppet, dance!). Sordnaz of BoM? The ultimate politician, who's never taken a real stand on anything in his life. Aldarion of Talerium? Nothing but an urbane fig leaf over a combination of Cagilan cultural domination and domestic murder worship. Caibre of Suville? Inconstant opportunist of no particular convictions. Sidd of Minas Ithil? Actually, he was a pretty decent guy by Laszlo, though perhaps too passive. The only contemporary Laszlo ever truly respected other than Sidd was Nathan Simmons of Carelia (ironically, considering Laszlo's roots in Norland). Him and (even more ironically) the leadership of the Cagilan Empire at the time. Laszlo never dealt directly with the Empire, but at least they were always up front about what they represented in Laszlo's biased mind.

Now, to all the players whose characters Laszlo just insulted:

These are Laszlo's opinions. Expound upon your own characters' viewpoints as much as you like, but I hope you don't take it personally  ;)

[Dante Silverfire]

Maybe. On the other hand, if you were as familiar with the history of Hammarsett as you are seemingly claiming to be, you'd probably understand why we've sided against both the Cagilans and the Corians.

Kerwin of Eston? Selfish fool for prioritizing what was good for himself and his one-time enemy of Coria over what was good for the realms that actually stuck their necks out to support him.

You obviously don't know anything about the history between Coria and Eston. Coria stuck its neck out to support Eston in the past, more than the Northern Alliance has in this war.

Also, I'm curious as you didn't name any of Coria's rulers as having reason for your completely screwing over Corian/Hammarsett relations.

Like, I can understand why you are fighting CE, because most of your neighbors hate them, but why you chose to betray your Corian friend who helped found your realm I don't understand at all. Without us, you were nothing. Now we have to destroy your realm because of your actions.

[Perth]

Kerwin of Eston? Selfish fool for prioritizing what was good for himself and his one-time enemy of Coria over what was good for the realms that actually stuck their necks out to support him.

Meh, maybe so.

I wouldn't call him a fool, but selfish maybe sure. Kerwin has his own visions of the north and what the north should be; it isn't anything like what it is now and he struggles to reconcile his actions between the reality of what the geopolitics are and what he wants the geopolitics to be.



The most annoying thing about "The Current War" is that I think a lot of people are kind of ready for it to be over (maybe some aren't, though) but there just seems to be no good political way out of it until someone gets destroyed.

[Dante Silverfire]

The most annoying thing about "The Current War" is that I think a lot of people are kind of ready for it to be over (maybe some aren't, though) but there just seems to be no good political way out of it until someone gets destroyed.

I agree. Unfortunately, there really is no way to end this war at least for Coria and Hammarsett unless one of us is destroyed. That's just simply the way "Hatred" works. (Blame Laszlo for that one).

Since neither alliance wants their "ally" to be the one destroyed the war continues. It doesn't help that its a virtual stalemate either.

Another problem is, I don't think anyone can see any way that the diplomacy on Atamara can evolve well for whichever realm chooses to change the situation up first. Neither side can see the other alliance breaking up, so this war is pretty much just a mexican standoff where everyone is waiting for the other person to make the first devastating move. It is sad because my character has a lot of plans which he can't implement until after Coria is done fighting Hammarsett. His plans most likely will make a change on the way things are run in the current alliance set ups, but his hands are tied. It is 100% impossible to gain IC political support for anything which changes Coria's mission away from Hammarsett due to the Hatred war that is being fought.

Even still, lets say someone is destroyed. Does the war stop there? If it does, what does everyone even do next? You can't attack CE, because they have the best military on the continent. If you attack one of their allies, they'll gladly join in just to keep their realm members occupied. Perhaps the northern alliance fractions once again after the war and goes back to its petty squabbles, but that isn't that interesting on the whole either. CE's alliance will still be looking for some conflict to stick its head into, but CE also can't be defeated so long as all of its current allies stand by its side. CE/Tara/Talerium/Coria/Strombran have enough military strength and prowess to hold off every other realm on the continent and have done so successfully since the beginning of the war (when it actually was everyone against us). So this alliance causes stagnation because no one can fight them successfully, and even if all ally against them they can force a stalemate at the minimum.

Meanwhile, no one in the CE bloc wants to split up from it (at least not during war time) because it provides the strongest possible defense for your realm. Its a "winning" side that won't be defeated. So either CE needs some internal conflict that forces succession scale events, or CE needs to fight Tara to split this entire thing up. Shoot, it may be interesting if with the new estate system, CE just tried to become the next Abington on their own, slowly but surely.