New Estate System

[Ramiel]

My Duchess is taking half me income? Time to go to WAR

[Tom]

Diagram updated.

And yes, the point where guilds and upkeep come in was changed at some time during the design of the new system.

If anyone can format the example as proper wiki tables, that would be really good.

My Duchess is taking half me income? Time to go to WAR

That's exactly the kind of internal strife I was hoping to create. :-)

[Indirik]

Tom: The new diagram you uploaded was a duplicate of the previous one. I think you re-uploaded the old version.

[Tom]

Tom: The new diagram you uploaded was a duplicate of the previous one. I think you re-uploaded the old version.

reload the page.

[Indirik]

Wow, that was weird... I even went to the File: page on the wiki and compared the two versions from the file history page, and they were identical.

Oh well... It works now.

[egamma]

There should now be a branch, out of the lord's share, going to the duke.

[Tom]

There should now be a branch, out of the lord's share, going to the duke.

I tried that, but it looks bad and it doesn't tell the whole story, because the duke's share comes from multiple lords.

[ben3256]

I have a great concern that the new system will leave all the realms deficient in knights to be able to efficiently utilize the existing regions. I am sure that in my present realm, that there are only sufficient knights to have only one per region. How can we expand without sufficient knights (2)  to occupy the regions properly? Without an influx of knights, wouldn't all the realms become become fixed in size? What happens to the incentive to expand or defeat the enemy?

I would appreciate any response on the theory.

Bruce Newmyer

[Bedwyr]

Bruce,

Under the current system, you need at least one and often two or more to run a region without stats deteriorating.  Under the new system, all that will happen if you don't have enough knights is that you get less gold.  Region stats will still be fine, and you will get full food production.

[De-Legro]

I have a great concern that the new system will leave all the realms deficient in knights to be able to efficiently utilize the existing regions. I am sure that in my present realm, that there are only sufficient knights to have only one per region. How can we expand without sufficient knights (2)  to occupy the regions properly? Without an influx of knights, wouldn't all the realms become become fixed in size? What happens to the incentive to expand or defeat the enemy?

I would appreciate any response on the theory.

Bruce Newmyer

That is the problem with the current system, not the proposed one. Currently without sufficient knight estate coverage, region stats drop until the region rebels. You can offset this somewhat with courtier work or holding court. the new system allows a region to remain stable without any knight estates at all. Sure it is below optimum but all other things being equal, it is stable.

Does your realm currently have regions with no knights?

[Chenier]

Bruce,

Under the current system, you need at least one and often two or more to run a region without stats deteriorating.  Under the new system, all that will happen if you don't have enough knights is that you get less gold.  Region stats will still be fine, and you will get full food production.

Cheers.

Now when is that gonna happen? I need that looting back, and there are a few nearby rogue regions I wouldn't mind annexing...

[Tom]

Under the new system, you need one lord and one knight per region to run an acceptable tax. Since rulers, dukes, etc. can all be knights as well (though only of their own duchies/regions), that means 2 characters per region the realm holds. 3-4 if you want to run at 100% efficiency.

Frankly, if your realm has less than 2-3 characters per region, it is trying to hold more land than it can and should get rid of a region or two.

[fodder]

wait.. i thought a duke can't be a knight unless he's a lord as well? to avoid a duke being someone's liege and that someone's knight at the same time.

which would infer a ruler can't be a lord without being a duke at the same time... where does that leave a ruler+knight?

[Draco Tanos]

I'd figure the ruler could be duke of a region, lord of a region in his duchy, and as he has an estate, technically a knight in said region.

[vonGenf]

Frankly, if your realm has less than 2-3 characters per region, it is trying to hold more land than it can and should get rid of a region or two.

Isn't that exactly the problem that we tried to fix with the new system? There are many realms which cannot expand even though they have land in which they can expand. Telling them they should get rid of a region or two won't incite them to go to war.