OOC Clans

[De-Legro]

Omg  :o I used to know them along with Crescent last time. They are from some game called Utopia. Apocalypse Alliance Utopia can search as well too. The leader is called Khain, there is no doubt... Hear Tom requested him to change his family name from Dragon, he changed to Dragonborn. As we cannot have Dragon in Battlemaster  :P

Interesting, we have a Dragonborn in Pian En Luries, he hasn't really caused any significant trouble. Utopia was one of the first web based games, there are several other games loosely based on it as well, like Visual Utopia. I played it almost 15 years ago, surprised that it still kicks around.

Turns out it is quite fun to google realm names I've found a defunct Anti Pian En Luries, and a forum group called the ShadowClan Dark Moot whom appear to play BM among other games. They seem to share a far bit of OOC information around that forum, might be interesting for people that like to read that sort of stuff in this forum.

[Ramiel]

Actually De-Legro, he and 3 others have formed a very troubling and annoying group who like to OOC accuse me of constant OOC-Bashing and other social contract breakages in the end I got peeved off and told them to take it to the Magistrates or the Titans... wasnt he also one of that particular group who came from another realm, the whole group joined very close together and they even said they were a group?

Think I shall investigate and see if they were all from the same Oriolton, especially since he and his cronies are the ones spouting the same nonsense constantly...

Their character histories make for interesting reading as well.

[Chenier]

Interesting, we have a Dragonborn in Pian En Luries, he hasn't really caused any significant trouble. Utopia was one of the first web based games, there are several other games loosely based on it as well, like Visual Utopia. I played it almost 15 years ago, surprised that it still kicks around.

Turns out it is quite fun to google realm names I've found a defunct Anti Pian En Luries, and a forum group called the ShadowClan Dark Moot whom appear to play BM among other games. They seem to share a far bit of OOC information around that forum, might be interesting for people that like to read that sort of stuff in this forum.

Their talk about Dwi gave me shivers...

[De-Legro]

Their talk about Dwi gave me shivers...

Did you read some of their old threads about having multiple accounts?

[Chenier]

Did you read some of their old threads about having multiple accounts?

Yes, I saw that after.

A few of them are actually still in D'Hara, though I haven't checked to see if any had admitted to multying in the other thread.

[De-Legro]

The only ones I found that admitted to multi accounts also said they had been caught at it.

[De-Legro]

Thanks to Ramiel for doing the google cache searches

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:m6-PLLXH3uQJ:apocalypseiscoming.net/f2/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D16%26t%3D1664%26p%3D16118+site:apocalypseiscoming.net+apocalypseiscoming.net+battlemaster&cd=19&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:3vVdwz5yuL4J:apocalypseiscoming.net/f2/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D188%26t%3D1475%26start%3D0+site:apocalypseiscoming.net+apocalypseiscoming.net+battlemaster&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

[Ketchum]

So we called them as Utopia Clan? They bring bad name to Utopia game then  ???

I not surprise he caused much controversy in BM islandwide. It seems they learnt their skills when they first started out in Oritolon. Protests government members out of posts, rebellions, planning OOC, pretty much everything. Khain has been warned before regarding his playing conduct, he told me once  ::)

Back to the topic on hand. How do we handle OOC Clans? Do we talk to Magistrate? How can we acquire evidence without even involving ourselves, sort of undercover work to reveal their forums, their discussions?

[Chaotrance13]

So we called them as Utopia Clan? They bring bad name to Utopia game then  ???

I not surprise he caused much controversy in BM islandwide. It seems they learnt their skills when they first started out in Oritolon. Protests government members out of posts, rebellions, planning OOC, pretty much everything. Khain has been warned before regarding his playing conduct, he told me once  ::)

Back to the topic on hand. How do we handle OOC Clans? Do we talk to Magistrate? How can we acquire evidence without even involving ourselves, sort of undercover work to reveal their forums, their discussions?

It's hard to prove (as we've seen earlier on in this thread). If you have a suspicion, it needs to be referred to the Titans/Magistrates. But as said earlier, don't make an accusation unless you have solid proof. In this case, it would have to be something like a message in-game for people to look at some off-site forums such as the AA ones De-Legro linked to. Or the off-site posts themselves.

So I guess the question is now we've seen posts suggesting that members of the AA "come and quell the internal bickering of Oritolon", and the fact that they honestly do not give a damn about what Tom thinks (see De-Legro's second link) - does this constitute enough evidence that the Magistrates can open a case? Or are these cache searches too old to be of any real use now?

[Valast]

I am sure there are many many groups out there in the game already.  There is no way to find them and no need.  Look at Oritolon now.  It has survived the attempt on it...because not only would they have to take over the realm but they would have to deal with the political issues involved.  All it takes is one loyalist to let allied rulers know info on the takeover and the new administration is faced with crumbling relations.

Heck, at one point I was about to bring Lukon against Oritolon to purge it and re-establish its government....

No ooc clan can ever take a realm in BM and keep it... unless after doing so they are able to adapt to the BM environment.  The conquer everything mentality of clan gamers does not mesh with ourr Battlemaster.   True the realm they attack first may not survive... but we as core players must accept it.

Everything that happens in the game should help to develop your character and its personality.

[egamma]

In the first link, Dragon merely advertises Battlemaster as being a great game to play--good for him! We need more players! I have recommended BM myself to others, and put it in my Slashdot signature--how else will we get more players?

The second post is troubling, but this matter with Khain Dragonborn was settled almost a year ago--note that the forum thread is dated December 2010.

Can anyone find any information about the current clan invasion?

[Crescent]

I don't think it was ever settle egamma. I'm not too sure what the Titans told him, but he came in with 2 of his friends. One of them broke away and went to another continent, the other stuck with him and they both moved to a neighbouring realm. In their time they managed to get the emails of other contacts and my obvious guess is that they've been keeping in touch out of the game.

The current clan invasion is simply another member finding his OOC friends, and both groups sort of merged together. Hopefully this can be solved IC, but I do believe it may get a little ugly. I do foresee OOC bans coming into place, that is if we're able to knock their clan off the throne first.

[Revan]

I was ruler of Oritolon for three or four months until I paused for IRL reasons a couple of weeks ago. I think Crescent's jumping at shadows. That Old Guard leader Crescent talks about who failed I guess is Spearhead? The man who who when last on the throne did and said almost nothing for several months. His only role and intention was to keep Lukon sweet. He has been as quiet since he left the throne as he was on it.

Crescent succeeded Spearhead and equally practised a quiet leadership. When he did speak out, it tended to provoke and alienate some of the most powerful people in the realm. When I made it to the throne with Malice, the Old Guard faction had been shown to have no answers and Crescent had only succeeded in alienating more people by making threats to depose sitting Dukes. The way Crescent reacted at the time, it felt like he already felt a OOC clan was working against him and really seemed to despise me. Virtually every noble in the realm had got a personal letter from me though, Alowca had turned against Crescent wholesale and was behind me as a Lord of Alowca and I articulated a compelling policy, even if I never really implemented it!

Alas, although I got power the old guard still held many positions of power and influence, yet without involving themselves at all in the affairs of the realm any more. So I was frustrated in much of what I wanted to do. Meanwhile, Crescent continued to alienate people with his ways even after I dragged him back into government due to our nobility crisis. Before I paused, there was already a growing backlash that was causing me problems. Three or four people had come to me privately asking me to act against Crescent and they weren't just new players. Likewise, we were getting hammered in a war that, although I'd started and evangelised it, Crescent was getting the flak for being the abrasive, uncompromising general.

Basically, Oritolon was already heading down a road towards civil discord with or without a clan and new players and I'd grown tired of the leadership anyway. A few people in Oritolon know that I basically ran for no other reason than there was no-one else to takeover during the last couple of elections. I'd come to the throne with this grand idea that I could refresh and vitalise Oritolon and left it with the idea that actually, Oritolon needed fundamental reform of a drastic kind.

Oritolon has/had a lot of unresolved problems that were always going to cause trouble eventually. Sadly for Crescent, not only did he needlessly antagonise a lot of new players, but his past actions as ruler meant other powerful people had an agenda against him irrespective of anything else. Forget Khain, this is just the usual Oritolon civil disorder.

[Crescent]

You weren't a part of the OOC Clan, Malice and I respect you for that. However the bulk of your backing basically were all from the same group. If you recall the sudden surge in the increase of our nobles a few months back and the one-mindedness of them you would have been able to tell something was amiss already. It started way before you came to Oritolon, back when Antonine and Hvrek were still around. It only grew from there, albeit quietly, and you just stumbled across it. Put simply any candidate who ran against me at that point of time would have their vote, so long as its not me.

And its hard to get things done when nobody listened and followed. Punishments like fines garnered protests, and without punishments they simply kept to one side. We can't do bans because of our lack of nobles anyway. But I agree with your point that Oritolon needs a change in the fundamentals, but I still stand by my reasoning that this current crisis is led by a group of OOC friends.

To everyone else, I'm sorry that this post went a little off-track to a debate on the current issue in Oritolon. Lets keep it back to the topic about OOC Clans. Besides banishment and OOC bans and having many members etc would there be any other plausible solution to counter this? If anyone wishes to talk about politics and such of Oritolon please feel free to PM me.

[egamma]

I don't care about OOC clans, as long as they don't ban everyone who isn't in their clan from the realm. If people who know each other from elsewhere want to play together, let them.

From the information I have--that posted here, as well as from playing Gellin in the Colonies since 2007--Oriolton is long overdue for a shakeup. They're the most boring realm in the Colonies--always the ally of Lukon, sheltered by Lukon from any attack from elsewhere--definitely not good for player retention.

Your IC clan is the one proposing using OOC ban against an "OOC clan", out of fear that the OOC clan would do the same thing to you if given the chance. How are you any better than they are? Why is the "IC" clan of "Old Guard" any better than the "OOC" clan of newcomers? Why should we side with you, just simply because you've been here longer?