Author Topic: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option  (Read 15750 times)

Eirikr

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Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Topic Start: February 26, 2013, 08:40:09 AM »
Title: Voluntary Death Option

Summary: Add a checkbox (perhaps in the Politics page beneath the renaming option or in the Actions page beneath the change class option) that, when checked, allows your character to be susceptible to death from serious wounds, including infiltrator actions and battle wounds without having to be a Hero. Death would still be a chance and not a guarantee. An old age limit can also be set either by default or by a player as an RP tool. The status of being mortal or not would only be visible to the player of that character. By popular demand, the choice to be mortal would be permanent once checked.

Details: A segment of the playerbase believes their character should be capable of dying from the various hazards in the world. Currently, the only way to do this is by becoming a hero, in which case you still cannot generally be killed except for a tiny chance in battle. This allows those characters who do wish to have the capacity for death to have a chance to die. Furthermore, this puts the control in the player's hands and is entirely voluntary. This ensures only players who wish to die by these methods will be affected. This checkbox could also be toggled off at any time should a player have second thoughts. (It has been suggested that this would be supported more as a permanent decision.) The chance of death can be reasonably small, if desired.

Old age death timers (again, entirely optional) provide an alternative to simply deleting or retiring the character. These could be implemented with an input box that accepts an integer. Since age in BM is not directly tied to actual time, force the death to trigger only on natural age growth rather than wounds. (That is, if the death timer is set to 60 and a character aged 59 is wounded and his age jumps to 62, the timer would trigger when the character ages to 63 naturally.) Include reminders to give players an opportunity to change the timer or write a roleplay.

Making the choice to be mortal or not private keeps infiltrators from specifically targeting only characters who are willing to die.

I am woefully ignorant of the coding challenges of this, so my apologies if it is too complex.

Benefits:
  • Puts the choice of death in the character's hands, not an infiltrator or other entity's hands, the usual reason for preventing character death.
  • Allows for roleplay opportunities surrounding death.
  • Makes the infiltrator class potentially more relevant without inherently buffing it.
  • Adds a mechanic that is strangely absent without forcing it upon players (in violation of the cited concept of the game).
  • Allows non-heroes to die, so one is not necessarily forced into the restrictions of the class. To my knowledge, death is not an advantage.

Possible Exploits:
  • Players toggle it off when they become aware of an impending assassination attempt. This should not be a problem immortality is already considered the norm.
  • Players may intentionally toggle it on when they become aware of an impending assassination to incite more severe action against the infiltrator's realm or person. In my opinion, this would energize the game and it's not like infiltrators are not already severely punished.
The previous exploits centered around the toggle, which has been dropped. The new list assumes it cannot be toggled.
  • Players may RP a martyr's death, despite this being one of the features of the Hero class. This may be countered somewhat by not being announced continent-wide. Honestly, it should be the playerbase's choice as to whom is a martyr; currently some heroes die and are not treated as martyrs. Some aren't even worth the fanfare attached to them as they did some distinctly "unherolike" activities while alive.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2013, 10:23:44 PM by Eirikr »

Perth

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #1: February 26, 2013, 08:45:34 AM »
Sure.

Though the people who will use will be the ones who would already be willing to kill (pause/delete) their character in an RP anyways. And those who won't use it will be the ones who sit around with 80+ year old characters and do nothing with them already.

So I dunno.
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Eirikr

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #2: February 26, 2013, 09:02:46 AM »
Precisely the point.

It has been stated in several other threads that characters should not be subject to involuntary death, especially in circumstances where it is the result of a somewhat random event. This is an attempt to work within that paradigm to put the choice in the hands of the individual character while still embracing the communal storytelling of BattleMaster. Perhaps I want to see how much impact my character can have before he dies? Maybe I want to place a check on myself so I don't get into a position of power, become complacent and have few ways to be removed. Personally, I do wish my characters were more likely to die (then again, I haven't had one die yet)... It would make me feel like there is some danger to my actions.

I've always felt like the message for deleting a character kind of breaks the atmosphere for a character's RP'd death. Seeing a beautiful RP and then "So-and-so has deleted his character Such-and-such." is kind of a sloppy way to do it. On top of that, you are not allowed to send messages while seriously wounded, so roleplayed deaths often include some reconciliation of that.

One other thing I like about it is that you can act arrogant when someone fails to kill you. I used to do this until I realized it was impossible to die via infiltrator actions... It lost its fun. Now, I just politely ask the judge to ban him, try to make another realm accountable (or disown the noble) and execute him on the second pass. Without the danger, my responses are just so... mechanical and political. I know it wouldn't have mattered much if he succeeded, but it's the right thing to do to make his life hard since he bothered trying.

Oh, I also forgot to add that only the player is privy to whether or not he is killable. This further guarantees the player's total control over their mortality. I have updated the request.

vonGenf

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #3: February 26, 2013, 09:07:04 AM »
This has been often proposed, and I've always supported, and I still do.

Though the people who will use will be the ones who would already be willing to kill (pause/delete) their character in an RP anyways.

The problem with killing your character in an RP is that you get to decide after the fact. I don't want to decide my character may be get killed, there is no tension in there. I want an infiltrator to have killed him, fair and square.
After all it's a roleplaying game.

Eirikr

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #4: February 26, 2013, 09:08:16 AM »
Ah, one more thing I just thought of... It is common for a noble to say "I would die for my realm!", but not necessarily be a hero. As a result, this is impossible. I think it would add to the game to be able to cause real casualties in war, allowing the devout nobles to make good on their promise and the aggressor force to potentially do real damage to a nation's nobles. It's always bothered me that a realm's nobility usually just changes realms when their original realm is destroyed. There should be a more elegant option to "go down with the ship".

Eldargard

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #5: February 26, 2013, 09:38:01 AM »
I love this idea. I would prefer the option to be selected at character creation and a semi-random death age to be assigned when the character is created but would take mortality in other forms as well. This would be cool. Super cool with plus seven to coolness besides!

vonGenf

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #6: February 26, 2013, 09:45:55 AM »
I would prefer the option to be selected at character creation

Why? Characters are often little defined at creation time; it's later that you can flesh them out and, depending on history in your realm/island, you may decide to check that box.

I know I would check it for some of my characters, but not all, and I could not have taken that decision at character creation time.
After all it's a roleplaying game.

Eldargard

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #7: February 26, 2013, 10:17:23 AM »
Like I mentioned, it really is not terribly important. I would like mortality in most any form. I simply prefer to have the selection be permanent cor that character - if the selection is made during or after the creation process is less important. I guess I simply can not imagine why I would want to get to know a character before deciding to make him mortal or not. If my mortal character ends up being my favorite, that is fine by me! I stress that it terribly important though.  The only benefit of choosing mortality at character creation and making said choice permanent is that it may mitigate the potential abuses listed some. I stress that the implementation details do not terribly concerning to me. Even if implemented in the way originally suggested I would simply check the box on all characters then forget the box exists. All too simple.

Poliorketes

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #8: February 26, 2013, 01:04:09 PM »
If I could, I would do all my characters mortal!

I hope they could die in battles, duels, killed by infiltrators, of old age, and even of illness (or maybe poisoned?) or accidents (natural or provoked)... This don't mean to make a carnage of noblemen, but to give some temporary nature and risk to the noble life. As hey are now, they are almost demigods!

And yes, I could RP this, as I could do with ALL things (battles and duels and taxes and everything), but I don't want to chose 'Hey, I'm going to die in this battle.' I want the battle to KILL me!  ;D

Anaris

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #9: February 26, 2013, 01:42:23 PM »
Last time this was proposed, it wasn't something you could switch on and off, but rather a decision you made once for your character. If, at any time, you check the "I am mortal" box, that's it, no going back.

I liked that version better. Less game-y.
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Perth

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #10: February 26, 2013, 11:24:15 PM »
Last time this was proposed, it wasn't something you could switch on and off, but rather a decision you made once for your character. If, at any time, you check the "I am mortal" box, that's it, no going back.

I liked that version better. Less game-y.

I like this idea better as well. Shouldn't be able to toggle it.
"A tale is but half told when only one person tells it." - The Saga of Grettir the Strong
- Current: Kemen (D'hara) - Past: Kerwin (Eston), Kale (Phantaria, Terran, Melodia)

Dante Silverfire

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #11: February 26, 2013, 11:29:19 PM »
If this is done, then what is the point of the hero class?

Wouldn't a better way to do this same thing just be to make the hero class not prevent you from also choosing another class?
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Penchant

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #12: February 27, 2013, 03:05:25 AM »
If this is done, then what is the point of the hero class?

Wouldn't a better way to do this same thing just be to make the hero class not prevent you from also choosing another class?
The hero class is much more than just the chance to die in battle.
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Penchant

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #13: February 27, 2013, 03:07:22 AM »
I like this idea better as well. Shouldn't be able to toggle it.
I would prefer the toggle. I don't know whether or not I would do this with my characters, but I do know that more people will try it out if they don't have to be stuck with it.
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Perth

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Re: Feature Request: Voluntary Death Option
« Reply #14: February 27, 2013, 03:14:56 AM »
I would prefer the toggle. I don't know whether or not I would do this with my characters, but I do know that more people will try it out if they don't have to be stuck with it.

But are you really trying it out if you don't actually, ya know, die?
"A tale is but half told when only one person tells it." - The Saga of Grettir the Strong
- Current: Kemen (D'hara) - Past: Kerwin (Eston), Kale (Phantaria, Terran, Melodia)